1128 Socrates/Glaucon

Transcription

1 1128 Sorats/Glauon 508 W say that thr ar many autiful things an many goo things, an so on for ah kin, an in this way w istinguish thm in wors. W o. An auty itslf an goo itslf an all th things that w thry st own as many, rvrsing ourslvs, w st own aoring to a singl form of ah, living that thr is ut on, an all it th ing of ah. That s tru. An w say that th many autiful things an th rst ar visil ut not intlligil, whil th forms ar intlligil ut not visil. That s ompltly tru. With what part of ourslvs o w s visil things? With our sight. An so auil things ar har y haring, an with our othr snss w priv all th othr prptil things. That s right. Hav you onsir how lavish th makr of our snss was in making th powr to s an sn? I an t say I hav. Wll, onsir it this way. Do haring an soun n anothr kin of thing in orr for th formr to har an th lattr to har, a thir thing in whos asn th on won t har or th othr har? No, thy n nothing ls. An if thr ar any othrs that n suh a thing, thr an t many of thm. Can you think of on? I an t. You on t raliz that sight an th visil hav suh a n? How so? Sight may prsnt in th ys, an th on who has it may try to us it, an olors may prsnt in things, ut unlss a thir kin of thing is prsnt, whih is naturally aapt for this vry purpos, you know that sight will s nothing, an th olors will rmain unsn. What kin of thing o you man? I man what you all light. You r right. Thn it isn t an insignifiant kin of link that onnts th sns of sight an th powr to sn it is a mor valual link than any othr link things hav got, if in light is somthing valual. An, of ours, it s vry valual. Whih of th gos in havn woul you nam as th aus an ontrollr of this, th on whos light auss our sight to s in th st way an th visil things to sn? Th sam on you an othrs woul nam. Oviously, th answr to your qustion is th sun. An isn t sight y natur rlat to that go in this way? Whih way?

2 Rpuli VI 1129 Sight isn t th sun, nithr sight itslf nor that in whih it oms to, namly, th y. No, it rtainly isn t. But I think that it is th most sunlik of th snss. Vry muh so. An it rivs from th sun th powr it has, just lik an influx from an ovrflowing trasury. Crtainly. Th sun is not sight, ut isn t it th aus of sight itslf an sn y it? That s right. Lt s say, thn, that this is what I all th offspring of th goo, whih th goo got as its analogu. What th goo itslf is in th intlligil ralm, in rlation to unrstaning an intlligil things, th sun is in th visil ralm, in rlation to sight an visil things. How? Explain a it mor. You know that, whn w turn our ys to things whos olors ar no longr illuminat y th light of ay ut y night lights, th ys ar imm an sm narly lin, as if lar vision wr no longr in thm. Of ours. Yt whnvr on turns thm on things illuminat y th sun, thy s larly, an vision appars in thos vry sam ys? In. Wll, unrstan th soul in th sam way: Whn it fouss on somthing illuminat y truth an what is, it unrstans, knows, an apparntly posssss unrstaning, ut whn it fouss on what is mix with osu rity, on what oms to an passs away, it opins an is imm, hangs its opinions this way an that, an sms rft of unrstaning. It os sm that way. So that what givs truth to th things known an th powr to know to th knowr is th form of th goo. An though it is th aus of knowlg an truth, it is also an ojt of knowlg. 11 Both knowlg an truth ar autiful things, ut th goo is othr an mor autiful than thy. In th visil ralm, light an sight ar rightly onsir sunlik, ut it is wrong to think that thy ar th sun, so hr it is right to think of knowlg an truth as goolik ut wrong to think that ithr of thm is th goo for th goo is yt mor priz. This is an inonivaly autiful thing you r talking aout, if it provis oth knowlg an truth an is suprior to thm in auty. You surly on t think that a thing lik that oul plasur. Hush! Lt s xamin its imag in mor tail as follows. How? You ll willing to say, I think, that th sun not only provis visil things with th powr to sn ut also with oming to, growth, an nourishmnt, although it is not itslf oming to. How oul it? Apting th mnation of gignōskomnēs to gignōskomnēn.

3 1130 Sorats/Glauon Thrfor, you shoul also say that not only o th ojts of knowlg ow thir ing known to th goo, ut thir ing is also u to it, although th goo is not ing, ut suprior to it in rank an powr. An Glauon omially sai: By Apollo, what a amoni supriority! It s your own fault; you for m to tll you my opinion aout it. An I on t want you to stop ithr. So ontinu to xplain its similarity to th sun, if you v omitt anything. I m rtainly omitting a lot. Wll, on t, not vn th smallst thing. I think I ll hav to omit a fair it, ut, as far as is possil at th momnt, I won t omit anything voluntarily. Don t. Unrstan, thn, that, as w sai, thr ar ths two things, on sovrign of th intlligil kin an pla, th othr of th visil (I on t say of havn so as not to sm to you to playing th sophist with th nam). 12 In any as, you hav two kins of thing, visil an intlligil. Right. It is lik a lin ivi into two unqual stions. 13 Thn ivi ah stion namly, that of th visil an that of th intlligil in th sam ratio as th lin. In trms now of rlativ larity an opaity, on sustion of th visil onsists of imags. An y imags I man, first, 12. Th play may on th similarity of soun twn ouranou ( of havn ) an horatou ( of th visil ). Mor likly, Sorats is rfrring to th fat that ouranou sms to ontain th wor nou, th gnitiv as of nous ( unrstaning ), an rlativ of noētou ( of th intlligil ). If h sai that th sun was sovrign of havn, h might takn to suggst in sophistial fashion that it was sovrign of th intlligil an that thr was no ral iffrn twn th goo an th sun. 13. Th lin is illustrat low: Unrstaning (noēsis) Thought (ianoia) Blif (pistis) Imagination (ikasia)

4 Rpuli VI 1131 shaows, thn rfltions in watr an in all los-pak, smooth, an shiny matrials, an vrything of that sort, if you unrstan. 510 I o. In th othr sustion of th visil, put th originals of ths imags, namly, th animals aroun us, all th plants, an th whol lass of manufatur things. Consir thm put. Woul you willing to say that, as rgars truth an untruth, th ivision is in this proportion: As th opinal is to th knowal, so th liknss is to th thing that it is lik? Crtainly. Consir now how th stion of th intlligil is to ivi. How? As follows: In on sustion, th soul, using as imags th things that wr imitat for, is for to invstigat from hypothss, proing not to a first prinipl ut to a onlusion. In th othr sustion, howvr, it maks its way to a first prinipl that is not a hypothsis, proing from a hypothsis ut without th imags us in th prvious sustion, using forms thmslvs an making its invstigation through thm. I on t yt fully unrstan what you man. Lt s try again. You ll unrstan it mor asily aftr th following praml. I think you know that stunts of gomtry, alulation, an th lik hypothsiz th o an th vn, th various figurs, th thr kins of angls, an othr things akin to ths in ah of thir invstigations, as if thy knw thm. Thy mak ths thir hypothss an on t think it nssary to giv any aount of thm, ithr to thmslvs or to othrs, as if thy wr lar to vryon. An going from ths first prinipls through th rmaining stps, thy arriv in full agrmnt. I rtainly know that muh. Thn you also know that, although thy us visil figurs an mak laims aout thm, thir thought isn t irt to thm ut to thos othr things that thy ar lik. Thy mak thir laims for th sak of th squar itslf an th iagonal itslf, not th iagonal thy raw, an similarly with th othrs. Ths figurs that thy mak an raw, of whih shaows an rfltions in watr ar imags, thy now in turn us as imags, in sking to s thos othrs thmslvs that on annot s xpt y mans of thought. 511 That s tru. This, thn, is th kin of thing that, on th on han, I sai is intlligil, an, on th othr, is suh that th soul is for to us hypothss in th invstigation of it, not travlling up to a first prinipl, sin it annot rah yon its hypothss, ut using as imags thos vry things of whih imags wr ma in th stion low, an whih, y omparison to thir imags, wr thought to lar an to valu as suh. I unrstan that you man what happns in gomtry an rlat sins.

5 1132 Sorats/Glauon Thn also unrstan that, y th othr sustion of th intlligil, I man that whih rason itslf grasps y th powr of ialti. It os not onsir ths hypothss as first prinipls ut truly as hypothss ut as stpping stons to tak off from, naling it to rah th unhypothtial first prinipl of vrything. Having grasp this prinipl, it rvrss itslf an, kping hol of what follows from it, oms own to a onlusion without making us of anything visil at all, ut only of forms thmslvs, moving on from forms to forms, an ning in forms. I unrstan, if not yt aquatly (for in my opinion you r spaking of an normous task), that you want to istinguish th intlligil part of that whih is, th part stui y th sin of ialti, as larr than th part stui y th so-all sins, for whih thir hypothss ar first prinipls. An although thos who stuy th ojts of ths sins ar for to o so y mans of thought rathr than sns prption, still, aus thy o not go ak to a gnuin first prinipl, ut pro from hypothss, you on t think that thy unrstan thm, vn though, givn suh a prinipl, thy ar intlligil. An you sm to m to all th stat of th gomtrs thought ut not unrstaning, thought ing intrmiat twn opinion an unrstaning. Your xposition is most aquat. Thus thr ar four suh onitions in th soul, orrsponing to th four sustions of our lin: Unrstaning for th highst, thought for th son, lif for th thir, an imaging for th last. Arrang thm in a ratio, an onsir that ah shars in larity to th gr that th sustion it is st ovr shars in truth. I unrstan, agr, an arrang thm as you say. Book VII 514 Nxt, I sai, ompar th fft of uation an of th lak of it on our natur to an xprin lik this: Imagin human ings living in an unrgroun, avlik wlling, with an ntran a long way up, whih is oth opn to th light an as wi as th av itslf. Thy v n thr sin hilhoo, fix in th sam pla, with thir nks an lgs fttr, al to s only in front of thm, aus thir ons prvnt thm from turning thir has aroun. Light is provi y a fir urning far aov an hin thm. Also hin thm, ut on highr groun, thr is a path strthing twn thm an th fir. Imagin that along this path a low wall has n uilt, lik th srn in front of pupptrs aov whih thy show thir puppts. I m imagining it. Thn also imagin that thr ar popl along th wall, arrying all kins of artifats that projt aov it status of popl an othr animals, ma out of ston, woo, an vry matrial. An, as you xpt, som 515 of th arrirs ar talking, an som ar silnt. It s a strang imag you r sriing, an strang prisonrs.

6 Rpuli VII 1133 Thy r lik us. Do you suppos, first of all, that ths prisonrs s anything of thmslvs an on anothr sis th shaows that th fir asts on th wall in front of thm? How oul thy, if thy hav to kp thir has motionlss throughout lif? What aout th things ing arri along th wall? Isn t th sam tru of thm? Of ours. An if thy oul talk to on anothr, on t you think thy suppos that th nams thy us appli to th things thy s passing for thm? 1 Thy hav to. An what if thir prison also ha an ho from th wall faing thm? Don t you think thy liv that th shaows passing in front of thm wr talking whnvr on of th arrirs passing along th wall was oing so? I rtainly o. Thn th prisonrs woul in vry way liv that th truth is nothing othr than th shaows of thos artifats. Thy must surly liv that. Consir, thn, what ing rlas from thir ons an ur of thir ignoran woul naturally lik, if somthing lik this am to pass. 2 Whn on of thm was fr an sunly ompll to stan up, turn his ha, walk, an look up towar th light, h pain an azzl an unal to s th things whos shaows h sn for. What o you think h say, if w tol him that what h sn for was inons- quntial, ut that now aus h is a it losr to th things that ar an is turn towars things that ar mor h ss mor orrtly? Or, to put it anothr way, if w point to ah of th things passing y, ask him what ah of thm is, an ompll him to answr, on t you think h at a loss an that h liv that th things h saw arlir wr trur than th ons h was now ing shown? Muh trur. An if somon ompll him to look at th light itslf, wouln t his ys hurt, an wouln t h turn aroun an fl towars th things h s al to s, living that thy r rally larr than th ons h s ing shown? H woul. An if somon ragg him away from thr y for, up th rough, stp path, an in t lt him go until h ha ragg him into th sunlight, wouln t h pain an irritat at ing trat that way? An whn h am into th light, with th sun filling his ys, wouln t h unal 516 to s a singl on of th things now sai to tru? 1. Raing parionta autous nomizin onomazin in Raing hoia tis an iē phusi, i in 5.

7 1134 Sorats/Glauon 517 H woul unal to s thm, at last at first. I suppos, thn, that h n tim to gt ajust for h oul s things in th worl aov. At first, h s shaows most asily, thn imags of mn an othr things in watr, thn th things thmslvs. Of ths, h al to stuy th things in th sky an th sky itslf mor asily at night, looking at th light of th stars an th moon, than uring th ay, looking at th sun an th light of th sun. Of ours. Finally, I suppos, h al to s th sun, not imags of it in watr or som alin pla, ut th sun itslf, in its own pla, an al to stuy it. Nssarily so. An at this point h woul infr an onlu that th sun provis th sasons an th yars, govrns vrything in th visil worl, an is in som way th aus of all th things that h us to s. It s lar that woul his nxt stp. What aout whn h rmins himslf of his first wlling pla, his fllow prisonrs, an what pass for wisom thr? Don t you think that h ount himslf happy for th hang an pity th othrs? Crtainly. An if thr ha n any honors, praiss, or prizs among thm for th on who was sharpst at intifying th shaows as thy pass y an who st rmmr whih usually am arlir, whih latr, an whih simultanously, an who oul thus st ivin th futur, o you think that our man woul sir ths rwars or nvy thos among th prisonrs who wr honor an hl powr? Insta, wouln t h fl, with Homr, that h muh prfr to work th arth as a srf to anothr, on without possssions, 3 an go through any suffrings, rathr than shar thir opinions an liv as thy o? I suppos h woul rathr suffr anything than liv lik that. Consir this too. If this man wnt own into th av again an sat own in his sam sat, wouln t his ys oming sunly out of th sun lik that fill with arknss? Thy rtainly woul. An for his ys ha rovr an th ajustmnt woul not quik whil his vision was still im, if h ha to ompt again with th prptual prisonrs in rognizing th shaows, wouln t h invit riiul? Wouln t it sai of him that h rturn from his upwar journy with his ysight ruin an that it isn t worthwhil vn to try to travl upwar? An, as for anyon who tri to fr thm an la thm upwar, if thy oul somhow gt thir hans on him, wouln t thy kill him? Thy rtainly woul. 3. Oyssy xi

8 Rpuli VII 1135 This whol imag, Glauon, must fitt togthr with what w sai for. Th visil ralm shoul likn to th prison wlling, an th light of th fir insi it to th powr of th sun. An if you intrprt th upwar journy an th stuy of things aov as th upwar journy of th soul to th intlligil ralm, you ll grasp what I hop to onvy, sin that is what you want to har aout. Whthr it s tru or not, only th go knows. But this is how I s it: In th knowal ralm, th form of th goo is th last thing to sn, an it is rah only with iffiulty. On on has sn it, howvr, on must onlu that it is th aus of all that is orrt an autiful in anything, that it prous oth light an its sour in th visil ralm, an that in th intlligil ralm it ontrols an provis truth an unrstaning, so that anyon who is to at snsily in privat or puli must s it. I hav th sam thought, at last as far as I m al. Com, thn, shar with m this thought also: It isn t surprising that th ons who gt to this point ar unwilling to oupy thmslvs with human affairs an that thir souls ar always prssing upwars, agr to spn thir tim aov, for, aftr all, this is surly what w xpt, if in things fit th imag I sri for. It is. What aout what happns whn somon turns from ivin stuy to th vils of human lif? Do you think it s surprising, sin his sight is still im, an h hasn t yt om austom to th arknss aroun him, that h havs awkwarly an appars ompltly riiulous if h s ompll, ithr in th ourts or lswhr, to ontn aout th shaows of justi or th status of whih thy ar th shaows an to isput aout th way ths things ar unrstoo y popl who hav nvr sn justi itslf? That s not surprising at all. No, it isn t. But anyon with any unrstaning woul rmmr that 518 th ys may onfus in two ways an from two auss, namly, whn thy v om from th light into th arknss an whn thy v om from th arknss into th light. Ralizing that th sam applis to th soul, whn somon ss a soul istur an unal to s somthing, h won t laugh minlssly, ut h ll tak into onsiration whthr it has om from a rightr lif an is imm through not having yt om austom to th ark or whthr it has om from gratr ignoran into gratr light an is azzl y th inras rillian. Thn h ll lar th first soul happy in its xprin an lif, an h ll pity th lattr ut vn if h hos to mak fun of it, at last h lss riiulous than if h laugh at a soul that has om from th light aov. What you say is vry rasonal. If that s tru, thn hr s what w must think aout ths mattrs: Euation isn t what som popl lar it to, namly, putting knowlg into souls that lak it, lik putting sight into lin ys. Thy o say that.

9 1136 Sorats/Glauon 519 But our prsnt isussion, on th othr han, shows that th powr to larn is prsnt in vryon s soul an that th instrumnt with whih ah larns is lik an y that annot turn aroun from arknss to light without turning th whol oy. This instrumnt annot turn aroun from that whih is oming into ing without turning th whol soul until it is al to stuy that whih is an th rightst thing that is, namly, th on w all th goo. Isn t that right? Ys. Thn uation is th raft onrn with oing this vry thing, this turning aroun, an with how th soul an most asily an fftivly ma to o it. It isn t th raft of putting sight into th soul. Euation taks for grant that sight is thr ut that it isn t turn th right way or looking whr it ought to look, an it tris to rirt it appropriatly. So it sms. Now, it looks as though th othr so-all virtus of th soul ar akin to thos of th oy, for thy rally arn t thr forhan ut ar a latr y hait an prati. Howvr, th virtu of rason sms to long aov all to somthing mor ivin, whih nvr loss its powr ut is ithr usful an nfiial or uslss an harmful, pning on th way it is turn. Or hav you nvr noti this aout popl who ar sai to viious ut lvr, how kn th vision of thir littl souls is an how sharply it istinguishs th things it is turn towars? This shows that its sight isn t infrior ut rathr is for to srv vil ns, so that th sharpr it ss, th mor vil it aomplishs. Asolutly. Howvr, if a natur of this sort ha n hammr at from hilhoo an fr from th ons of kinship with oming, whih hav n fastn to it y fasting, gr, an othr suh plasurs an whih, lik lan wights, pull its vision ownwars if, ing ri of ths, it turn to look at tru things, thn I say that th sam soul of th sam prson woul s ths most sharply, just as it now os th things it is prsntly turn towars. Proaly so. An what aout th unuat who hav no xprin of truth? Isn t it likly in, osn t it follow nssarily from what was sai for that thy will nvr aquatly govrn a ity? But nithr woul thos who v n allow to spn thir whol livs ing uat. Th formr woul fail aus thy on t hav a singl goal at whih all thir ations, puli an privat, invitaly aim; th lattr woul fail aus thy rfus to at, thinking that thy ha sttl whil still aliv in th faraway Isls of th Blss. That s tru. It is our task as founrs, thn, to ompl th st naturs to rah th stuy w sai for is th most important, namly, to mak th asnt an s th goo. But whn thy v ma it an look suffiintly, w mustn t allow thm to o what thy r allow to o toay.

10 Rpuli VII 1137 What s that? To stay thr an rfus to go own again to th prisonrs in th av an shar thir laors an honors, whthr thy ar of lss worth or of gratr. Thn ar w to o thm an injusti y making thm liv a wors lif whn thy oul liv a ttr on? You ar forgtting again that it isn t th law s onrn to mak any on lass in th ity outstaningly happy ut to ontriv to spra happinss throughout th ity y ringing th itizns into harmony with ah othr through prsuasion or ompulsion an y making thm shar with ah othr th nfits that ah lass an onfr on th ommunity. 4 Th law prous suh popl in th ity, not in orr to allow thm to turn 520 in whatvr irtion thy want, ut to mak us of thm to in th ity togthr. That s tru, I ha forgottn. Osrv, thn, Glauon, that w won t oing an injusti to thos who v om philosophrs in our ity an that what w ll say to thm, whn w ompl thm to guar an ar for th othrs, will just. W ll say: Whn popl lik you om to in othr itis, thy r justifi in not sharing in thir ity s laors, for thy v grown thr spontanously, against th will of th onstitution. An what grows of its own aor an ows no t for its upringing has justi on its si whn it isn t kn to pay anyon for that upringing. But w v ma you kings in our ity an lars of th swarm, as it wr, oth for yourslvs an for th rst of th ity. You r ttr an mor ompltly uat than th othrs an ar ttr al to shar in oth typs of lif. Thrfor ah of you in turn must go own to liv in th ommon wlling pla of th othrs an grow austom to sing in th ark. Whn you ar us to it, you ll s vastly ttr than th popl thr. An aus you v sn th truth aout fin, just, an goo things, you ll know ah imag for what it is an also that of whih it is th imag. Thus, for you an for us, th ity will govrn, not lik th majority of itis nowaays, y popl who fight ovr shaows an struggl against on anothr in orr to rul as if that wr a grat goo ut y popl who ar awak rathr than raming, for th truth is surly this: A ity whos prosptiv rulrs ar last agr to rul must of nssity most fr from ivil war, whras a ity with th opposit kin of rulrs is govrn in th opposit way. Asolutly. Thn o you think that thos w v nurtur will isoy us an rfus to shar th laors of th ity, ah in turn, whil living th gratr part of thir tim with on anothr in th pur ralm? It isn t possil, for w ll giving just orrs to just popl. Eah of thm will rtainly go to rul as to somthing ompulsory, howvr, whih is xatly th opposit of what s on y thos who now rul in ah ity. 4. S , 462a 466.