F.C.A. WESSELS REGINA VERSUS: KONINGING TEEN: HIGH TREASON. MR. J.C. VAN NIEKERiC, MR. LIE BEN BERG

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1 PBEPARA TO RY EXA11INAT10 N IN THE MAGISTRATE'S COURT FOR THE DISTRICT OF JOHANNESBURG HELD IN JOHANNESBURG IN DIE MAGISTRAATSHOF VIR DIE AFDELING VAN JOHANNESBURG GE- HOU TE JOHANNESBURG BEFORE MR.: VOORMNR, : F.C.A. WESSELS REGINA VERSUS: KONINGING TEEN: FARRID ADAMS AND OTHERS CHARGE: AANKLAG: HIGH TREASON FOR THE CROWN: VIR DIE KROONs MR. J.C. VAN NIEKERiC, MR. LIE BEN BERG FOR THE DEFENCE: VIR DIE VERDEDIGING: Mr. V.C. BERRANGE MR. COAKSR MR. WEINBERG MR. ROSENBERG Q,C MR. MAISELS Q.C. MR. ZV/ARENSTEIN INTERPRETER: TOLK: VOLUME PAGES:

2 COURT RESUMES 13/1/1938; APPEARANCES AS BEFORE: MR. COAKER ADDRESSES CCURT(All Accused present in Court.) BY THE P.P.: On the 17th December, 1957, the Attorney-General advised senior counsel for the Defence, Mr, Rosenberg, that he had decided not to proceed against certain of the Accused, and on the 18th December that was confirmed. With Your Worship's kind co-operation it was agreed that it would not be necessary to bring these people up from the various places^ just for the purpose of formal withdrawal, and with Your Worship's concurrence again I ask leave of Your Worship to note on record that the Crown has withdrawn against the following Accused; No«2, Mohamad Asmalj No, ^ Xe$.tah Barenblattj No, 7, Isaac Bokala; No, 9, Suliman Esakjee; No, 19 Joseph M* Kwmaloj Norman Levy; No, 25, V. Maka^ No, 26 Piet Makgofe; No* E Malele; No, 33, S, Masimula; No, 35 July Mashabai No^ 39 % Mavuso; Hc^ Mpho; No, 49 4 Ida Mtwa^ No, 53 W.H. Ngwendu; No, 55, L* Nkosi; No* ^ Pooj No, 61, J, Hadebe; No, 62, Mary Ranthaj No, 68, M f W, Shopej No, 69 Celopas Sibande; No. 74, 0, Tambo; No. 76, R. Tunzi; No. 80, J, Buza; No, 82, Assa Dawoodj No, 86, C. Makholia^; No, 88^ J«Morolong; No, Lionel Mor^isoai 90«J* Mpozaj Ho. / 91, J. Mtini; No, 92, G, Ngotyana; Uo, 94, A. Sebeko; No*95» R. September; No. 96, A, Silingaj No, 99, F, Baard; No, 100, J,A. Calata; No. 101, S, Damons; No, 102, D, Funyani; No. 103, W,S. Gawe; No. 105, C, Jasson; No. 107, P. Mashibini; No. 11, F, Matomela; No. 115, E. Mfaxa; No, 125, S, Vanga; No. 126, J. Arenstein; No. 129 A. Gumede; No. 130, J, Hoogendyk; No. 132, A.J. Luthuli; No. 135, P.G. Mei; No. 136, Bertha Mkize; No. 143, A. Ngcobo; No. 144, Dorothy Nyembe; No. 145, V.S.M. Pillay; No. 147, E. Shanley; No. 148, Dorothy Shanley; No. 149, Debi Singh; No. 153, Gabriel Dechaba; No. 155,

3 J. Mafura; No. 156, Martha Moglakoane; No, 157, Leslie Monayane; No. 158, Abraham Sechoareng, I ask Your Worship now to formally discharge all these Accused. BY THE COURT: There are in all 61? BY THE P.P.: That is correct. BY THE COURT: The Accused, whose names and numbers have been read out, are now formally discharged. FRASER HUGO, befe'dig verklaar. VERHOOR DSUR P.A.; You are a detective head constable in the S.A.Police, stationed at Queenstown? I am. On 5th December, 1956, did you search the premises of V* # S. Gawe? I did. The numbers are WSG.18 to WSG. 24 (handed to witness)? Yes, these are the documents that I seized. Was this in his house? Yes. (No further questions) CROSS-EXAMINATION RESERVED: STEPHANUS GAUCHE, duly sworn. EXAMINED BY P.P. You are the Assistant Registrar of the Witwatersrand Division of the Supreme Court of South Africa? I am. And as such are you in charge of the records in that office? I am. Have you got in your possession the applications for bail in the treason trial heard during December 1956? I have. What are the numbers? 1580/56, 1592/56, 1593/56, 1645/56, 1646/56, 1647/56, 1648/56, and 1651/56, and 1650/56. (Handed in Exh. G.1157.) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION:

4 GUSTAV AUGUST WARNEKE, bee'dig verklaar. VERH00R DEUR P.A.; Are you a sergeant, in the S.A.Police, stationed at New Brighton? Yes. And do you know Accused M. Mkwai? Yes. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No, 117.) And on the 10th October, 1957, and on 17th October, 1957, did the Accused sign before you at New Brighton? Yes. And does that document before you contain his signature? Yes. (Handed in G.1158 specimen signature.) (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION: THOMAS BUCHANAN LION, duly sworn. EXAMINED BY P.P.: Are you a sergeant S.A,Police, stationed at New Brighton? I am. Do you know the Accused, W. Mkwai? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. Will you please do so? (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 117.) And on various dates between 19th September, and 7th November, 1957, did the Accused sign before you at New Brighton? He did. And are those his signatures on that document, and yours (handed to witness)? They are. How many times did he sign before you? Six times. (Handed in Exh. G.1158) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION:

5 QUARTUS STEEANUS EOURIE, duly sworn, EXAMINED BY P.P.: Are you a head constable, S,A.Police, stationed at Jeppe? That is correct. And on 19th September, 1957, did a person by the name of B. Hlapane sign before you at Jeppe Police Station? Correct. Can you identify that person? I think I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 10,) Will you look at this document, G.1159? The signature in column 4 is that of the Accused I pointed out. (Handed in G.1159) (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION: JOHANNES OOSTHUIZEN, besdig verklaar, VERHOOR DEUR P.A.: Are you a sergeant, S.A.Police, stationed at Jeppe? Ja. On the 26th Setpember, 1957, did a person by the name of B. Hlapane sign before you at Jeppe? Ja. Can you identify that person? Ja. Will you please do so? identifies Accused No. 10.) (Witness leaves box and And is this the document on which he signed before you (handed to witness)? Ja. (Handed in G.1159) (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION: PETRUS JOHANNES VAN RENSBURG, bee'dig verklaar. VERHOOR DEUR P.A.: Are you a sergeant, S.A.Police, stationed at Jeppe? Reg.

6 On 3rd October, 1957, did a person by the name of B, Hlapane sign before you? Hy hat voor my geteken. Do you know this person? Ek sal horn kan uitwys; as ek horn sien sal ek horn herken, (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 10.) And is this the signature of Accused No, 10 and your own, on the document I now show? Dis my handtekening en beskuldigde nr. 10 se handtekening, (Handed in G.1159) (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION; HERMAN MARTHINUS MORKSL. besdig verklaar. VERHOOR DSUR P.A.: Are you a sergeant, S,A,Police, stationed at Jeppe? Reg. On 10th October, 1957, did a person by the- name of B«Hlapane sign before you at Jeppe? Hy het voor my geteken, P, Hlapane het voor my geteken. Can you identify this person? Ek kan> ja, (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No, 10.) Is this his signature on the document, G.1159? Dis reg. And your signature too? Dis reg. (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION: MATHYS JACOBUS VENTER, befe'dig verklaar. VERHOOR DEUR P.A.: Are you a sergeant, S,A.Police, stationed at Jeppe? Dis reg. On 17/10/57, and 24th October, 1957, did a person by the name of B. Hlapane sign before you at the Jeppe Police Station? Ja.

7 Do you know this person, can you identify him? Ja, (Witness leaves "box and identifies Accused No, 10), Did he sign this document "before you, G.1159? Ja, Who completed the particulars about the address in the same column? Hy self. Did you also sign that form? Yes, (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION: DAWID JACOBUS BROODRYK. begdjg verklaar, VERHOOR DEUR P.A. : Are you a sergeant, S t A,Police, station at Jeppe?-«. On 31st October, 1957, and 7th November, 1957, did a person by the name of B. Hlapane sign before you? Ja # Can you identify that person? Ja. Will you please do so? (Witness leaves box and ideiw tifies Accused No. 10), Beskuldigde nr., 10 is die per soon wat aan my gerapporteer het. Are those the signatures on thai, form? Ja, And who completed the rest of that column, as regards the address and so on? Hy self. (G.1159) (No further questions) NO CRCSS-EXAMINATION: MATHUS DANIEL BRUEWER, besdjg verklaar. VERHOOR DEUR P.A.: Are you a sergeant, S,A.Police, stationed at Newlands? Ek is. Do you know a person P.P. Mtithe? Ja, daar moes so iemand gerapporteer het. Can you identify this person? Nee, ek kan hom nie identifiseer nie. Will you look at this form, G.1160? Ja.

8 Did that person Mtithe sign that form before you? Ja, hy het. i How many times? Op een geleentheid het hy dit voor my geteken. What date? 24/10/1957. Will you look at the first page please? Ek kannie onthou nie, maar dit skyn my dit was nie deur hom gedoen nie, want hy het nie die vorm behoorlik geteken nie. On how many occasions did a person by the name of Mtithe sign that form before you? Net een geleentheid. What happened on the 19th September 1957? Ons was nog nie ten voile bewus van die instruksies nie, en ek weet nie wat daardie oggend gebeur het nie. (Handed in G.1160.) No further questions. NO CROSS-EXAMINATION. WILLEM JACOB FOUCHE, besdig verklaar, VERHOOR DEUR P.A.: Are you a sergeant, S.A.Police, stationed at Newlands? Dit is korrek. On 17/10/57 did a person by the name of P. Mthithe sign a document before you at the Newlands Police Station? Dis korrek. Did that person sign in your presence? Korrek. Who completed the rest of that column? Ek het dit persoonlik voltooi. The column where the person signed, who completed that column? 1 n Persoon wie sy naam as P. Mthithe gegee het. Can you identify the person P. Mthithe? Nee. (Handed in G.1160) (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION;

9 FREDERIK BEZUIDENHOUT. besdig verklaar: VJRHOOR DEUR P.A. ; Are you a sergeant, S.A.Police, stationed at Newlands? Dis reg. On 31st October, 1957, and 7th November, 1957, did a person by the name of P. Mthithe sign his name before you at Newlands? Daar was so ' n persoon. Ek sal nie kan s wie die persoon is nie, of dit die regte persoon is of nie. Is this the signature that was signed before you by this perc"^ 'G.-1160)? Dis reg. And the address that was given in that column who wrote that in on that form? Hy moes dit self hier ingeskrywe het. Was it do n/1 in front of you? Ja. Dis reg. Can you identify this person? Nee, ek sal hom nie kan identifiseer nie. (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION: JACOBUS JOHANNES GERBER, befe'dig verklaar. VBRHOOR DEUR P.A.; Are you a sergeant, S.A.Police, stationed at Marshall Square? Ja. Do you know the person R.E. Press? Ja. Can you identify him? Ja. Will you please do so? (Witness leaves box and identifi^ Accused No, 60.) Did this person sign before you at Marshall Square on various occasions? Ja. On how many occasions did he sign before you? Op 6 geleenthede. And are those his signatures? Ja, And you hand in the document, G.1161?

10 Do you also know a person "by the name of Leslie Masina? Ja. Did he also sign before you at Marshall Square? Ja. Can you identify him? Ek hoop so. Will you kindly identify him (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 17.)? Ek dink dit is hy, maar ek is nie seker nie. Will you have a look at this document, (G.1162). Did this person who gave his name as L. Masina sign that before you? Ja. And who wrote in that address in the column? Hy self. I see there is a number on that form, do you know who supplied that number? Dit is nommer wat verskaf is deur die sirkulere wat deur ons ontvang is, sover ek ontho u. Did you at any time question the Accused in connection with that number, can you remember that? Nee. (Handed in G.1162.) Do you know a person by the name cf H.G. Makgothi? Ja, Can you identify him? Ek most maar weer se ek hoop so. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 29.) Will you please look at this document, G.1163 (handed to witness). Are those the signatures of this person Makgothi who signed before you? Ja. And who complated these last columns, the address columns here? Hy self. (Handed in G.1163.) (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION:

11 CHARLES JOHANNES ESTERHUIZEN, beedig verklaar, VERHOOR DEUR P.A.: Are you at present employed at the Baragwanath non- European hospital, Johannesburg? Ja. On 27/9/55, were you a sergeant in the S.A,Police,? Ja. Where were you stationed? Fordsburg. On that date did you together with other officers of the police, search the offices of one Ruth First? Ja. And after the search did you compile a list of the documents seized? Ja. Did she sign this list? Ja. On the second last page too? Ja. (Handed in G.1164.) Do you know this parson Ruth First, can you identify her? Yes, I think so. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 73.) (No further questions) BY THE COURT: Where did this search take place? In die kantore van mej. Ruth First, Whereabouts? Ek weet dis naby Grays, ek kannie pre sies onthou nie. In Johannesburg? Yes, NO CROSS-EXAMINATION: VERNON ASPELING, beedig verklaar, VERHOOR DEUR P.A.: Are you a sergeant, S.A.Police, stationed at Newlands? Dis reg. Do you know a person by the name of P. Mthithe, can you identify him? Ek dink so. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 75.) Did a parson who gave the name of P. Mthithe report i

12 on 3rd October, and on 7th October, 1957? Hy het. Did he sign that form G.1160 in front of you? Hy het. And who wrote the address in that fourth column? Dit is sy eie handskrif. And as what did that person report, why did he report? Hy het gerapporteer dat hy beskuldigde is in die hoogverraadsaak, (No further questions) MR. COAKER; NO QUESTIONS; CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. SLOVO: Were you given any instructions in connection with the treason trial Accused who came to report? Ja. Was one of the instructions that you were given to indicate to the Accused that they needn't do or say anything but if they do say anything, it might be used against them as evidence in this trial? Nee. Did you at any stage know that those forms would be used for the purposes of proving certain things in this trial? Dit sou alleenlik as getuienis gedien het dat hy wel daar gerapporteer het. But as far as you were aware, you didn't know that it would be used as evidence in this preparatory examination?- Nee. I take it had you known that, you would have given the Accused the usual warning? Ja, ek moes. And the system of signing, I understand only started about three months ago? Dis reg. You are aware that is after the adjournment in this case? Ja. (No further questions)

13 JOHANNES BOSMAN, duly sworn, EXAMINED BY P.P.: Are you a head constable, S.A,Police, stationed at Johannesburg? That is so. On 22nd September, 1956, did a person by the name of H.M. Moosa, sign a verifying affidavit in respect of bail application in front of you in Johannesburg? That is so. Can you identify this person, H.M, Moosa? I think so. (Witness leaves box) I am not sure. Will you have a look at this verifying affidavit in case 1653/56, portion of Exh front of you? Yes. Was that signed in And is that your signature? That is so, (Bail application 1653/56, G.1157) (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION: ZAYED GAMIET, duly sworn. EXAMINED BY P.P.: Are you an attorney for the Transvaal, practising at Coxham House, No. 52 Commissioner Street, Johannesburg? I am. On the 7th December, 1956, at the magistrates court, Johannesburg, did you attest various affidavits on bail applications of persons charged on an alleged charge of high treason? That is correct. (G.1157) Did the following persons sign affidavits before you: Pieter Arnoldus Bernardus Beyleveld? I can't remember unless I see the various documents. (Handed to witness.) There is a signature of Beyleveld on this. Do you know that person Beyleveld? I did not know that person at the time. Can you identify him? Now, I can, yes. (Witness!

14 leaves "box and identifies Accused No. 6.) What document is it that Accused No. 6 signed? It is called a supplementary affidavit. Was this document attested "by you? It was. Did that person sign "before you? Well, somebody by the name of Beyleveld signed before me, but I didn't know the person of my own knowledge at the time. Did you know at the time whether or not this person was one of the Accused at the treason trial him to be one of the Accused.? I understood Did this person Bertha Mashaba sign before you, a verifying affidavit, saying that she is the tenth applicant in the above matter, the above matter being an application for bail on a treason charge? I attested a signature Bartha Mashaba on this document. Can you identify that person? I don't know the person. The next one is G. Sibande; is that a verifying affidavit? This is a verifying affidavit. Also a treason bail application? That is correct. And did that person sign before you? Somebody signed G. Sibande in front of me, that is all I can say. Can you identify that person? I can't identify that person, no. This next one is Billy Nair, stating "I am the 18th applicant in the above matter."? There is a signature Billy Nair on this verifying affidavit. Did that person sign before you? Somebody signed "Billy Nair" in front of me on this occasion, and I attested his signature. Can you identify that person Billy Nair who signed before you? I am not acquainted with this person. \

15 The next person is Stephen Dhlamini? This signature was appended in my presence. As one of the applicants in the hail application? That is so. Can you identify that person? No, I can't identify him. The next one is P.H, Simelane, stating "X am the 20th applicant in the above matter." Did that person sign before you? This signature P.H. Simelane was put on a document in my presence. Can you identify that person? I do not know these Accused personally. The next one is D.A. Seedat, stating M I am the 21st applicant in the above matter." Did D.A. Seedat sign in your presence? This signature D.A. Seedat was appended in my presence. Can you identify that perso-n D.A. Seedat? I think I can. Will you try? (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No, 146.) And a person by the name of J.G. Mathews stating "I am the 23rd applicant in the above matter", did he sign before you? This signature was appended in my presence, J.G. Mathews. Can you identify that person? I subsequently got to know who J.G. Mathews was. I did not know him at the time. And did you know that the J.G. Mathews who signed in your presence? I assumed it was J.G. Mathews, seeing that the signature was J.G. Mathews. Can you identify this J.G, Mathews that you learnt to know subsequently? I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 108.)

16 Did a person "by the name of P.S, Manana, saying I am the 24th applicant in the above matter, did he sign this in your presence, this verifying affidavit? Somebody signed the name P.S. Manana on this affidavit in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot. The next one is G. Hurbans, stating"i am the 25th applicant in the above matter." Did G. Hurbans sign that in your presence.? The signature "G. Hurbans" was signed by somebody in my presence. Can you identify that person? I subsequently got to know who the person was. Can you identify the person you subsequently learned to be G. Hurbans? Accused No. 131.) (Witness leaves box and identifies The next one is M.T. Naicker, stating that he is the 27th applicant in the above matter. Was that signed in your presence? This signature M.T. Naicker was appended by somebody in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot identify that person. The next one is Caswell Moonsamy, stating "I am the 28th applicant in the above matter." Was that signature appended in your presence?-- r This signature was appended by somebody in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot. The next is M.B. Yengwa, stating "I am the 30th applicant in the above matter."? This signature was appended by somebody in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot identify that person. The next is David Ngugenyeka, stating "I am the 38th applicant in the above matter."? This signature was appended by somebody who wrote down D.H. Mgugenyeka.

17 Can you identify that person? I cannot identify that parson. The next one is Alex LaGuma, stating"i am the the 40th applicant in this matter." Was this signed in your presence.? This signature was appended in my presence. Can you identify that person? I can. (Witness leaves "box and identifies Accused No, 85,) The next is Sonia Bunting, stating "I am the 41st applicant in the above matter." Signed S.B, Bunting, Was that signed in your presence? This signature was appended by somebody in my presence. Can you identify that person? I can identify this person. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No, 79*) The next one is George Peake, stating "I am the 43rd applicant in the above matter," Was that signed in your presence? This was signed by somebody in my presence, G, Peake, Can you identify G. Peake? I subsequently got to knew who G. Peake was. Can you identify the person you learned to be G.Peake subsequently? (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 93.) The next one is C, Mayekiso, stating"i am the 47th applicant in the above matter." Was that signed in your presence? This signature was appended by somebody in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot identify him, The next one is B. Turok, stating "I am the 49th applicant in the above matter."? This signature was appended in my presence. Can you identify that person? I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 97)

18 The next is 1.0. Horwitz, stating "I am the 52nd applicant in the above matter."? This signature was appended in my presence. Can you identify that person? I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 84.) The one I have got in front of me is again Pieter Arnoldus Bernardus Beyleveld, "I am the 59th applicant in the above matter. " Will you just see whether that form was signed in your presence? That signature was placed on this document by somebody in my presence. You have already identified that person? I have. This last document is a verifying affidavit, is that correct? That is correct. And the first one was a supplementary affidavit? That is correct. The next one is J. Kampeni, stating M I am the 81st applicant in the above matter," a verifying affidavit. Did that person sign that in your presence? Somebody signed J. Kampeni in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot. The next one is J. Jack, saying "I am the 82nd applicant in the above matter."? This signature was appended by a person who signed J. Jack, in my presence. identify him. I cannot The next one is A. Nogya, stating "I am the 83rd applicant in the above matter."? This document was also signed by somebody A, Nogya in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot. The next one is L. Kepe, stating "I am the 84th applicant in the above matter."? This document was signed L. Kepe by somebody in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot identify him.

19 The next one is V. Mini, stating "I am the 88th applicant in the above matter." Was that signed in your presence? This was signed by someone in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot, The next one is W. Make, stating "I am the 89th applicant in the above matter," Was that signed in your presence? This document was signed by somebody W. Make in my presence. I cannot identify this person. The next one B. Ndimba, stating "I am the 91st applicant in the above matter." Was that signed in your presence? This was signed by somebody B. Ndimba in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot identify that person. The next one is Z.K, Mathews, stating "I am the 92nd applicant in the above matter." Was that signed in your presence? This document was signed Z.K. Mathews by someone in my presence, and I subsequently got to know him. Will you please identify the person you know now as Z.K. Mathews? No. 109.) (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused The next one is Helen Joseph, stating "I am the 95th applicant in the above matterj" Was this signed in your presence? This document was signed Helen Joseph in my presence. Can you identify that person? I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 13.) The next one is Fred Carneson, stating "I am the Ulth applicant in the above matter." Was this signed in your presence."? This document was signed by somebody F. Carneson in my presence. Can you identify that person? I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 81.)

20 The next one is T. Tsume, stating "I am the 139th applicant in the above matter. " Was this signed in your presence? This document was signed T. Tsume by somebody in my presence. person. Can you identify that person? I cannot identify this The next is W. Mkwayi, stating,"i am the 140th applicant in the above matter." Was this signed in your presence? This was signed Mkwayi by somebody in my presence. Can you identify that person? I cannot, The next is T. Mqota, stating"i am the 150th applicant in the above matter," Was that signed in your presence? This signature was appended by somebody in my presence. Can you identify him? I cannot. The next one is A, Hutchinson, stating "I am the 118th applicant in the above matter." Was that signed in your presence? This was signed by somebody A. Hutchinson in my presence, whom I did not know at the time. Do you know now who that person is? I do. Can you identify him? I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 11.) (No further questions) BY THE P.P.: These documents all form part of case No. 1648/ 56, Exh. G ) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION; BAREND JACOBUS VAN PER BERG, duly sworn. EXAMINED BY P.P.: Are you a sergeant, S.A.Police, stationed at Wynberg, Transvaal? Ja, Transvaal. And on the 10th October, 1957, as well as on 31st October, 1957, did a person by the name of T.X. Makwana, sign his name in your presence?-- Dis reg.

21 Did you also sign a form? Ek het. Are those the signatures on this form I now hand you? Dit is, ja. And you also signed the form? Dis reg. Can you identify this person T.X. Makwana who that? Ek hoop ek kan. The address that was written in in the fourth who wrote in that address? Makiwana self. Will you please try and identify that person, (Witness leaves "box and fails to identify Accused.) nie in staat om die persoon uit te wys nie, (Form handed in G.1165.) (No further questions) NO CROSS-EXAMINATION; signed column,? Ek is PETRUS JOHANNES DU PREEZ. beedig verklaar. VERHOOR DEUR P.A.; Are you a detective sergeant S.A.Police, stationed at Pretoria? Heeltemal reg. Are you also a handwriting expert? Ja, ek is ondersoeker van batwiste dokumente en handskrifte. Did you compare signatures of persons together with the documents which you have now in front of you? Ja. Have you got specimen signatures? Ja. From which you compared the others, the exhibits? Ja, Did you in the course of your investigations, how did you examine these various documents? In die loop van my ondersoek, het ek elke moontlik skrifeienskap. Ek het dit noukeurig nagegaan en vasgestel dat daar baie noue ooreenkoms bestaan, ten opsigte van skryfgewoontes in die algemeen, sowel as inherente skrifeienskappe. Ek het vasgestel

22 dat die vorm, konstruksie, lynkwaliteit, en verder het ek vasgestel dat die helling, die verhouding van letters teenoormekaar, spasieering, groter verhouding, punktuasie, lynhreke, verbindingstrepe, en die aanvang en endstrepe, het ek vasgestel dat dit in elke opsig ooreenstem, soos ek dit in enige normale skrif sou verwag. Now, you have a file now in respect of each person, is that correct? Ja. Who is the first person you have got there? Die van Farrid Adams. What did you use as a specimen for Farrid Adams? Ek het gebruik besdigde verklaring, nr. 1648/56, applikant nr. 62. (Portion of G.1157.). You compared that with various documents? Korrek. What are those documents? Bewys. B. 63, C.444, G. 422, C. 404, B.244, B. 216, B.214, B. 212, B. 208, B.209, NA.161, DM. 41, NA.161. And in your opinion, what do you say about the specimen and the exhibits? Dat die skrywer van die monster verantwoordelik is vir al hierdie betwiste naamtekenings. BY THE COURT; You say "disputed documents;" do you mean the documents you have already mentioned? Die bewysstukke wat ek genoem het. BY MR. BERRANGE: I wonder if I might be allowed to intervene at this stage, Sir, by asking the Court to take the adjournment now. As a result of certain discussions that I have had with the Crown and my colleages we may be able considerably to shorten these proceedings, and to that end if the Court would be prepared to adjourn at this stage, we would be able to acquaint Your Worship this afternoon whatthe position is. COURT ADJOURNS:

23 COURT RESULTS5; BY MR. BERRANGE; The Defence, Sir, have had some discussions with the Crown aimed at shortening this phase of the proceedings, and in order to do so, it will he necessary for us to examine documents which will take some considerable time, but I think that we will be able to shorten these proceedings in doing this, and to that end, I would ask Your Worship by arrangement with the Crown, to postpone these proceedings now until 9.30 tomorrow morning, and we can then spend the rest of the afternoon in carrying out the task which we have set ourselves. BY THE P.P.; That is correct. At the same time perhaps the Court would ask the Accused not to leave. BY MR. BERRANGE; We have no objection to that. BY THE COURT; Yes, Mr. Coaker, that is your province, is it not? The Crown has requested that the Accused should not leave, so they will have to wait until the end of the discussion. COURT ADJOURNS;

24 COURT RESUMES 14/1/58: APPEARANCES AS BEFORE; MR. COAKER ADDRESSES COURT; (All Accused present in Court) Accused No. 93, George Peake, granted leave of absence for medical treatment 15/1/58.) PROCEEDINGS TO CONTINUE IN ABSENCE OP ACCUSED No. 93s ISAAC SHARP, duly sworn, EXAMINED BY P.P. (MR. VAN NIEKERK) Are you a detective sergeant, S.A,Police, stationed at Johannesburg? Correct, And have you been attached to the Security Staff since February 1950? That is correct. And was it part of you duty to carry out observations at meetings, and to attend various meetings of various organisations? That is correct. And in the course of your duties, did you acquaint yourself with various membars of organisations like the African National Congress and other Congresses? That is correct. Do you know the Accused Parrid Adams? I do. You can identify him? I can, (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 1) Do you know whether there is any other person by that name taking part in the activities of the Congress movement? There is no other person taking part in the Congress movement with that name. Do you know what the position is that he holds in the various organisations? I don't know what his position is, but he is an active member, he organises, distributes pamphlets, he takes an active part in meetings, and I have often observed him at places where meetings are held, going out with people who are banned and cannot attend meetings, have a conversation with them and go back to the place of meeting,

25 Can you name the various organisations with which he is associated? That is the Transvaal Indian Congress, the African National Congress, the S.A. Coloured Peoples' Organisation, the Congress of Democrats, the S.A. Congress of Trade Unions. Do you know whether he took any part in the arrangements for the Congress of the People? He took part in the arrangements for the Congress of the People, an active part in organising for the Congress of the People, Do you know whether he is associated with the Peace Council? He is. And the Society for Peace and Friendship with the Soviet Union? Yes. Do you know a person "by the name of Isaac Bokala who was Accused No. 7? I do. Do you know whether he held any particular position in any "branch or any organisation? I don't know if he has any particular position, hut he is an active member of the African National Congress, Newclare Branch. He organises there. Do you know Accused Andries Chamile? I do. Can you identify him? I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 8.) Do you know any other person bearing that name who takes part in the activities of this movement? No. Do you know anything about this particular person, Andries Chamile? He is an active member of the African National Congress, Newclare Branch, and organises and addresses meetings there. He organises youngsters, he brings them wearing the African National Congress colours. Do you know whether or not he attended any conferences of the African National Congress? He was one of those who took a bus to Durban, I think in 1954, there was a conference

26 in Durban. Did you attend the African National Congress conference at Bloemfontein in 1955? No. Do you know with what various organisations he is associated? He is associated with the Transvaal Indian Congress the African National Congress, the S.A. Coloured Peoples' Organisation, the Congress of Democrats, and the S.A. Congress of Trade Unions, Do you know Accused Helen Joseph? I do. Can you identify her? I can, (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No, 13,) Do you know any other person by that name who takes part in the activities of the Congress Movement? No, Except the person Paul Joseph, No, I am asking you about a person by the name of Helen Joseph; do you know anybody else by that name who has taken part in the Congress Movement? No, And what do you know about HelaiJoseph? She took an active part in the so-called Liberation Movement, and die is the secretary of the Federation of S.A, Women. She takes part in all these organisations and she took part in the Congress of the People. She organised the Protest Demonstration to the Union Buildings, in 1953 or 1954 or maybe 1955, but it was within the last four or five years, I am not certain of the date. What was the demonstration about? It was a protest against passes. First they wanted to interview the Minister of Native Affairs, and then the second demonstration was to interview the Prime Minister, concerning the same subject. Do you know Accused Paul Joseph? I do. Can you identify him? I can. and identifies Accused No. 14.) (Witness leaves box i

27 Do you know any other person hearing that name who is active in the Congress movement? No. What do you know about this person? He is an active member of the Congresses, he takes an active part, organises, distributes pamphlets, and he visited the countries behind the Iron Curtain and Russia, Do you know whether he held an executive position in any of these organisations? I don't know if he held any Indian position, but he was a delegate to the S.A./Congress which was held in Durban in 1953«Do you know whether he had anything to do with the Peace Council? He is an executive member of the Peace Council. When? Between the last four or five years. Do you know to what extent he is connected with the Transvaal Indian Congress? He organises. Do you know the Accused Pish Keitsing? I do. Can you identify him? I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 15.) Do you know whether he holds any position in any of the organisations? I know he is volunteer in chief of the African National Congress, Newclare Branch, and he takes an active part, organises, addressing meetings. Do you know whether there is any other person bearing that name who takes an active part in the Congress movement? No. Do you know Accused Moses Kotane? I do. Can you identify him? I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 16.) What do you know about this person? He is a former secretary-general of the S.A. Communist Party. And a member of the executive of the African National Congress.

28 Do you know until when? Until the Suppression of Communism Act came into operation in 1950, And the African National Congress? He was' an execu-r tive member of that until he was banned. When was that? It was during the last 2, 3, 4 years back, I am not certain. Do you know Accused Jerry Kumalo.? I do. Can you identify him? Yes, (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No, 17.) Do you know of any other person by that name taking an active part in the Congress Movement? No. What do you know about this person Jerry Kumalo? Jerry Kumalo is an executive member of the African National Congress, Moroko Branch, He takes an active part in the African National Congress and other Congresses, addresses meetings. Do you know the Accused A.M. Kathradra? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 18), Do you know any other person by that name who takes part in the Congress Movement? No, What do you know about this person Kathradra? Kathradra is a former chairman of the Transvaal Indian Youth Congress, and the secretary of the S,A. Indian Youth Congress, Do you know whether he held any other positions in any other organisations? He takes an active part in the Peace Council, and the Society for Peace and Friendship with the Soviet Union. Do you know whether he has ever been overseas? 1951/ 52 he proceeded overseas, and he remained in Budapest over seven months, and reported the World Youth Federation, Before the Suppression of Communism Act came into being, do you know whether this man attended communist meet-

29 ings, did you ever see him at communist meetings? He addressed Communist Party meetings at Sophiatown. Do you know Accused Leon Levy? I do. Can you identify him? I can. (Witness leaves "box and identifies Accused No. 20). Do you know of any other person hy that name taking an active part in the Congress Movement? No. What do you know ahout Leon Levy? He is a secretary of the S.A. Council, and he is president of the S.A.Congress of Trade Unions. He takes an active part in the Congress meetings. Do you know Accused Stanley Lollan? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves "box and identifies Accused No. 22.) Do you know any other person hearing that name who takes an active part in the Congress movement? No. What do you know ahout him? Stanley Lollan is the secretary of the S.A. Coloured Peoples' Organisation, the Transvaal Branch, and he was also national treasurer of that Organisation. He takes an active part in the Congresses, and he took part in the Congress of the People. He was one of those who were checking credentials at the credential tahle of this Congress of the People. Do you know Frank Madiba? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No, 23.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes an active part in the Congress? No. Do you know whether he held or holds any executive positions? He was the chairman of the African National Congress, Newclare Branch until he was banned. Do you know whether he took an active part in the Con-

30 ference of the Congress of the People? He did. Do you know to what extent? As a delegate from Newclare. Do you know Accused Aaron Mahlango? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 24.) Do you know whether there is any other person bearing that name who takes an active part in the activities of the Congress movement? No. Do you know anything about this person? He is an active member of the African National Congress, He takes part in the S.A. Congress of Trade Unions, addresses meetings. Do you know Accused Tennyson Makiwane? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 27), Do you know whether there is any other person by that name who takes an active part in Congress? No. Do you know anything about this person? He takes an active part in the Congresses, and he writes articles for the "New Age." Do you know Accused Joshua Makwe? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 28.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes an active part in the Congress Movement? No. Do you know anything about this person? The chairman of the African National Congress, Germiston Branch; he takes an active part in the Congress, in the meetings of the Congresses. Do you know H.G. Magkothi...

31 BY MR. BERRANG3: If my learned friend will allow me to intervene at this stage. Your Worship, I haven't raised this matter before, hut as I think everybody knows we are very anxious to save as much time as possible. It seems to me highly i probable I can put it no higher than that that a great deal of this witness' evidence is purely hearsay, I don't know whether I am right in that, I cite an example, for instance when he says that Tennyson Makiwane writes articles in "New Age," Now, I don't know upon what basis this witness bases his testimony. Or, for instance, when he testis fies to membership of various organisations on the part of various of the Accused. We don't know upon what basis he gives that testimony. Now, it is true, Sir, that I could sit here and wait for him to run right through the whole list of some 90 Accused and endeavouring to establish that a great deal of his evidence-is hearsay. I am endeavouring to save the waste of time which would be entailed in listening to evidence which would ultimately have to be disregarded by the Court, because it is of a hearsay nature. And that being so, I would suggest, for instance, that when the witness is asked about the position of any individual.member, or when he is asked in regard to any matter of fact to which he testifies, that he might be asked the question "On what do you base your testimony?" Really, that could come from me ultimately in cross-examination, but as I say, Sir, I am trying to save time by ennabling the Court to ascertain at this early stage whether or not his evidence is direct, or whether it is hearsay, BY THE COURT: Yes, I think the point raised is pertinent to the issue as to whether evidence is admissable or not, Mr. Prosecutor, and I don't know whether you have had the opportunity of testing the source of the information given by the

32 7778 witness, whether all of it is evidence of which he has personal knowledge, or whether some of it is not hearsay. In the nature of things, I think some of the evidence must he hearsay, I don't know whether it is possible to restrict the evidence only to such evidence as is not hearsay. BY THE P.P.: I suggest then, Your Worship, that I leave off this witness at this stage to give Counsel an opportunity of cross-examining him on the evidence so far given. BY MR. BERRANGE: I think that would he an admirable suggestion if it meets with your approval, Sir. BY THE COURT: To test whether your surmise is correct? BY MR. BERRA.'TGE; Yes, and the validity of the evidence. BY THE COURT: You don't know whether the evidence given is all original evidence, or whether it is hearsay? BY THE P.P.: I take it that when the witness says "he is taking an active part in this or that organisation"., BY THE COURT: Yes, he knows these people, and he has seen them at meetings; he knows they have taken an active part in addressing meetings of certain organisations, but when he says that the witness has been in a country in Europe, for instance, for several months, would that not be hearsay evidence. BY THE P.P.: Well, I don't know; it might be tested. BY THE COURT: Will you proceed then, Mr. Berrange? CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. BERRANGE: Sharp, what do you say is the name of that youth federation in Budapest? It is the World Federation of Youth, I am not certain of the word. What is the name of the organisation? It is the Federation of World Youth. so. You are sure that that is the name? Well, I think

33 You think so, you are not sure? Yes. Have you ever he en to Budapest? No, I haven't been there. How do you know that its headquarters are in Budapest? I attended a meeting where Kathradra addressed the meeting and he said that it was at the headquarters of the World Youth. And I have also seen an article which appeared in "The Spark" which was the Congress 1 paper, a letter appeared there written by Kathradra from Budapest. So your evidence then is based upon something that you read in the newspaper? What he said too in the meeting. And you evidence is based on what you heard at a meeting, and what you read in a newspaper? Yes. You don't know the name of this organisation? It is the World Youth Organisation. That is the third different name that you have given to this organisation; now what is the name of it? I don't know exactly the words, but it is called the Federation of World Youth. That is the fourth different name that you have given them. And tell me, did you see Tennyson Makiwane actually writing an article which went into New Age? I saw him at meetings, writing. Did you see him writing any article which ultimately appeared in New Age is my question? Yes. Where was he writing this article? It appeared in the New Age under his name. Did you see him writing these articles is my question? I saw him taking notes at meetings. Did you see him write any articles which ultimately appeared in New Age? I don't seem to catch the point. BY THE COURT: You say you have seen articles under his name

34 ? Yes. Did you see him actually write these articles? ' No, I saw him at meetings taking notes, CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR. BERRANGE CONTD.: I am not interested whether you saw him at meetings taking notes, I am asking you a simple question. Did you see him write any articles which later on appeared in New Age? No. You also go to meetings and take notes? I do. Did your articles appear in New Age? No, I don't write; I am not a journalist. So the reason that you say Tennyson Makiwane writes articles in New Age, is because in reading New Age you have seen an article under the name of Tennyson Makiwane? Yes, That is your only reason for saying that? Yes, and he writes about what actually took place at the meeting where I saw -him taking notes. Give us some details then, will you; what was said at this meeting, and what issue of New Age did it appear in, and what did appear in New Age? I wouldn't be able to,,,. You wouldn't be able to. How does one become a member of the Transvaal Indian Congress? Well, I suppose by joining. Do you know, not what do you suppose? He joins, he takes Do you know is my question? No, I wouldn't be able to say how he becomes a member. You don't know how anybody becomes a member? No. So when you say that anybody is a member of any organisation, it is because of something you have been told? It is that he takes an active part. Do you mind answering my question. When you say that

35 anybody is a membar of any organisation it is because of what you have been told? Yes. And when you say that anyone of these persons is a member of the executive committee, it is also because of what you have been told? It is what is common knowledge. You have been told? Yes, what is common knowledge. Were you ever a member of the S.A. Communist Party? No. When you say that Moses Kotane was formerly secretarygeneral of this S.A. Communist Party, that is something that you have been told? It is common knowledge. It is something that you have learnt as a result of something that has been said to you? Yes. And then you say he was a member of the African National Congress, of the executive of the African National Congress, that is also something which you have learnt as a result of what you have heard from somebody else? Yes. And that applies to every one of the Accused whose names you have mentioned as being on the executive of any one of these organisations? Yes. And lastly, do you know whether Paul Joseph has got a sister? No. Do you know whether he has got a wife? No. Do you know whether he has got any female relative? No, I have seen him walking with females, but I don't know what is his relation to those females. You don't know whether he has got any female relatives? No. And you of course don't know all the members of all the organisations, do you? I don't. BY THE COURT; Mr. Prosecutor, it is apparent now that a great deal of what he said is hearsay, and it maybe that the

36 witness has drawn inferences from what he has seen. We have heard during the course of these proceedings what the various Accused did, what part they took in the various activities of Congresses, and much of this evidence seems to me to he a summing up of that situation. I don't know whether it will carry the case any further. BY MR. BERRANGE: I am afraid, Sir, if I may interject, that the witness is being asked to take the place of Your Worship in drawing these conclusions. BY THE COURT: All he is being asked to do is to draw inferences from his observations BY MR. BERRANGE: Which is for Your Worship to do, on the evidence. BY THE COURT: And these matters are before the Court. BY THE P.P.: But the position is, he has said the person belongs to a certain organisation, and now he gives the reasons for that. He says he has seen the persons actually at such organisation's meetings. BY THE COURT: Yes, but haven't we that evidence already before the Court, what these different Accused did, what their activities were. BY THE P.P.: I think we have some of them. BY THE COURT: I don't know whether some of this evidence is new evidence, I am not quite sure. Por instance, that a certain Accused is an office bearer in one of the organisations. In many of the documents these names appear as office-bearers, and I don't know that the witness can carry the matter any further, or whether the Court shouldn't merely be asked to draw its own inferences from the facts that are before the Court. BY THE P.P.: I would just like to ask this witness one question. You said you do not know all the members of all - - > ^ ; ;., " 'ift

37 the organisations; is that what I understood you to say to Mr. Berrange? I do not know all the members, hut I know all the members who are taking an active part in these organisations. COURT ADJOURNS: COURT RESUMES: ISAAC SHARP, still under oath, EXAMINATION BY P.P. (contd.) Do you know the Accused H.G. Makgothi? I do. Can ycu identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 29.) Do you know any other person bearing that name who takes an active part in the activities of the Congress movement? No. What do you know about this person? He is the former national president of the African National Congress Youth League. How do you know that? It was announced at meetings that he addressed. Do you know whether he has been overseas? He went overseas. How do you know that? It was announced at the meeting at the welcome of Walter Sisulu at the Communal Hall, Western Native Townships. Can you recall when? In Was he present when this announcement was made? I don't remember if he was present. The next one BY MR. BERRANGE: May we have a ruling from Your Worship in 1 regard to the admissability of that bit of evidence, of the evidence testified to by the witness when he says it was announced at a meeting, that he had been overseas.

38 f I would like Your Worship to give a ruling on that. He says he doesn't remember if Makgothi was present. BY THE COURT: Yes, I don't know, Mr. Berrange. This has always been rather a difficult question. It has been raised from time to time. There is authority to the effect that one Accused says is evidence against all the others, where a conspiracy is alleged and eventually proved. Now, whether the Crown will succeed in establishing this conspiracy eventually is a matter still to be considered, but at this stage it is difficult for the Court to give a ruling unless the whole aspect is argued. If this was said at a meeting of one of the organisations by one of the Accused, for instance, then it seems to me that prima facie that evidence should be admitted, BY MR. BERRANGE: Of course, Sir, it is a matter of complete impossibility to argue at the moment, until one has the whole of the Crown case before one. BY THE COURT: That is the difficulty, and it would involve considerable argument, BY MR, BERRANGE: It would go to the roots of the case. BY THE COURT: That is so, I am inclined to allow this evidence at the moment. If it could be more specifically mentioned by the witness, what meeting this was, I don't know whether that is quite clear. EXAMINATION BY P.P. CONTD.: I will try and elicit that. What meeting was that you were referring to? It was the welcome of Walter Sisulu from overseas. Where was that? It was held at the Communal Hall, at the Western Native Townships. Under whose auspices was the meeting held? African National Congress.

39 And you say it was more or less 1953? already given evidence on that. I have BY THE COURT: That seems to fit in with evidence that has already been given, Mr. Berrange, and I think at the present moment the evidence will have to "be received. EXAMINATION BY P.P. CONTD.: The next is Sampie Malupe. Do you know him? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 31.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes part in the activities of the Congress Movement? No. Do you know v^hether he holds or held any executive position? He was secretary of the African National Congress, Newclare Branch. How do you know that? It was announced at a meeting. Do you know whether he was present? He was present; he was a speaker at the meeting. The next is Nelson Mandela? Yes, I know him. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 32.) Do you know any other person of that name who took an active part in the activities of the Congress movement? No. Do you know anything about this person? He is the \ former president of the African National Congress Youth League, the national body, and the former president of the African National Congress, Transvaal. How do you know that? It was announced at meetings. Do you know whether he was present? He was present and addressed the meetings. Up till when was that, more or less? He was the president until he was banned, of the African National Con-'

40 gress, Transvaal. You'don't know the date? I don't. 3, 4, 5 years ago. Now the next one is Bertha Mashaba.? I do. It was between Do you know her Can you identify her? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 36.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes an active part in these organisations? No. Do you know anything about this person? She is the secretary of the African National Congress "Women's League, Germiston Branch, How do you know that? It was announced at meetings. Where?-- At the Trades Hall. Was she present? Yes. And you know anything else about her? She is a vicepresident of the African National Congress Women's League. That was also announced at a meeting. Do you know anything about her activities? She is one of those who organised the Protest Demonstration to the Union Buildings. How do you know that? It was announced at a meeting at Albertynsville which I attended. Philemon Mathole, do you know the person? Yes. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 37) Do you know any other person by "that name who takes an active part in the activities of the organisation? No. What do you know about this person? Philemon Mathole is the secretary of the Transvaal African National Congress. How do you know that? It was announced at a meeting and I have already given evidence on that.

41 Where was it held? It was held at Moroka West. Do you know Moosa Moola? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 44.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes part in the activities of the Congress? No. Do you know anything about Moosa Moolla? Moosa Moola is the joint secretary of the Transvaal Indian Youth Congress. How do you know that? It was announced at meetings. Do you know whether he was present? He was present. Do you know anything else about him? He takes an active part in the Congresses, and he is one of those who attended the C.O.P. Conference, at Kliptown. And he takes part in the Peace Council and the Society for Peace and Friendship with the Soviet Union. Do you know Dr. H.M. Moosa? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 45.) Do you know any other Dr. H.M. Moosa who takes part in the activities of Congress? No. What do you know about Dr. Moosa? Dr. Moosa is the chairman of the S.A. Indian Youth Congress, and he is also acting as the secretary of the Transvaal Indian Congress, and also secretary of the S.A. Indian Congress. How do you know this? This was announced at meetings where Dr. Moosa addressed the meeting. Do you know Obed Motsabi? I do. Can you identify him? (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 47.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes part in the activities of the Congress movement? No.

42 Do you know anything about Obed Motsabi? Obed Motsabi, he takes an active part in the African National Congress meetings and others. I don't know what position he holds. He attends these meetings. Do you know Lilian Ngoyi? I do. Can you identify her? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 52.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes part in the activities of the organisation? No, Do you know anything about her? Lilian Ngoyi is the president of the African National Congress Women's League, president of the Federation of S.A. Women. How do you know that? It was announced at meetings which she addressed. And she is one of the persons who went overseas and when she returned she reported that she presided at a meeting of the women in Switzerland. What women? I don't just know the name, but it is some kind of a Women's World Federation. Do you know John Nkadimeng? I do. What do you know about John Nkadimeng? John Nkadimeng is an active member of the African National Congress, and he is a member of the National Executive, and is a former chairman of the Central Branch of the African National Congress. How do you know that? These were announced at a meeting. Was he present? He was ^resent. And you can identify him? I can. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 54.) Which Central Branch of the A.N.C. did you refer to? In the city. Do you know anything about his activities? He takes

43 an active part in the Congress meetings, and he addresses meetings. And do you know any other person hy that name who takes an active part in these organisations? No. P.P.D, Nokwe,-do you know him? I do. Please identify him if you can? (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 56.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes part in the activities of the Congress Movement? No. Do you know anything about him? He is the secretary of the working committee of the African National Congress, the national body. How do you know that? It was announced at meetings. Was he present? He was present. Do you know whether he has been overseas? He is one of those who visited the Communist countries, and I took notes where he addressed a meeting and he stated the places he visited overseas, and I have already given evidence on that. The next is P.P. Nthithe, do you know him? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 57.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes part in the activities of the organisation? No. Do you know anything about him? He is the chairman and secretary of the African National Congress Youth League, Sophiatown Branch. How do you know that? It was announced at a meeting he addressed. Was he present? He was present. The next is Dr. Ronald Press, do you know him? I

44 Will you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves "box and identifies Accused No. 60.) Do you know any other Dr. R.E. Press who takes part in the activities of the organisations? No, Do you know anything about him? I know him as a member of the S.A,Congress of Democrats, and also national secretary of the Textile Workers Union, How do you know that? Because it was announced at meetings. Was he present? He was present. Do you know Robert Resha? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 63,) Do you know any other person by that name who takes part in the activities of the organisation? No, Do you know anything about him? He is the former president of the African National Congress Youth League, and he is the volunteer in chief of the African National Congress, He takes an active part in the Congress meetings* How do you know that? It was announced at a meeting. Was he present? He was. BY THE COURT: What was announced at a meeting? That he is the national president of the African National Congress Youth League. And that he is the volunteer in chief of the African National Congress. EXAMINATION BY P.P. CONTD.: Can you recollect when that meeting was held? I wouldn't be able to say, but it was held in Sophiatown, I don't know the dates. Do you know whether you have given evidence on this meeting or not? I have already given evidence on a meeting where Mr. Robert Resha

45 But this specific meeting that you are referring to? I don't know if it is this specific one, no, hut it is usually announced at meetings, the position of these people when they speak. I will not he able to tell if I recorded in my notes at the time. I have already given evidence where Robert Resha addressed meetings. But did you state in evidence in what capacity he addressed the meetings? I won't be able to tell. Bennet Seitchiro, do you know him? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 64.) Do you know any other person of that name who takes part in the activities of the organisation? No. Do you know anything about Bennet Seitchiro? He is a former secretary cf the African National Congress, Newclare Branch, and the chairman of the sam3 branch. How do you know that? It was announced at the meetings he addressed. Nimrod Sijake, do you know him? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 65.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes part in the activities of the organisation? No, Do you know anything about him? He is an active member of the African National Congress, attends meetings, and he attended the C.O.P. Conference, and he was distributing also literature there, at the C.O.P. Conference, in Kliptown He is an organiser of the Iron and Steelworkers. How do you know that? This was announced at meetings. I couldn't specify which particular meeting. Do you know Peter Selepe? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 66.)

46 Do you know any other person "by that name who takes part in the activities of the organisation? No. Do you know anything about him? I used to see him attending Communist meetings at Alexandra Township and also in front of the City Hall. He addressed the C.O.P, Conference at Kliptown in Do you know Sydney Shall? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves "box and identifies Accused No. 67.) Do you know any other person "by that name who takes part in the activities of the organisations? No, Do you know anything about him? He takes an active part in the meetings of the Congress, the C.O.P. Conference at Kliptown in He attended Do you know Walter Sisulu? Yes. Can you identify him? Yes, (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 70.) Do you know any other person of that name who takes part in the activities of the organisation? No, Do you know anything about him? Walter Sisulu is the former Secretary-General of the African National Congress, and he is one of those who visited overseas. How do you know that? It was announced at meetings and I have already given evidence on his visit overseas. Do you know Gert Sibande? I do. What do you know about him... first, can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 71.) Do you know any other person by that name who takes an active part in the activities of the organisation? No. I

47 Do you know anything about this person Gert Sibande? Gert Sibande is the chairman of the African National Congres, Bethel Branch. And he is also a member of the African National Congress Executive Committee, Transvaal. How do you know that? This was announced at meetings where he spoke, where he addressed the meetings, and I have already given evidence on that. Do you know whether he was at Kliptown? He addressed the meeting at Kliptown. Was that the Congress of the People? Yes. Do you know Simon Tyiki? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 75.) Do you know any other person of that name who takes part in the activities of that organisation? No. Do you know anything about him? Simon Tyiki is the chairman of the African National Congress, Sophiatown Branch. How do you know that? It was announced at meetings he addressed. Do you know Lionel Forman? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 83.) Do you know any other person by that name who took part in the activities of the organisation? No. Do you know anything about Lionel Forman? Mr. Lionel Forman used to take an active part in the Congress Meetings, and I also used to see him attending Communist meetings. Where? In front of the City Hall. When was that? It was during 1950.

48 Do you know J. Mathews? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves "box and identifies Accused No. 108). Do you know any other person "by that name who has taken part in the activities of Congress? No. Do you know anything about him? While he was in Johannesburg he used to take an active part in the African National Congress Youth League and the African National Congress meetings. Do you know anything else about him? That is all. The other will be hearsay. Do you know Dr. Conco? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 127). Do you know any other Dr. Conco who takes an active part in the affairs of the organisation? No. Do you know anything about him? He was the chairman of the first C.O.P. Conference which was held at the Trades Hall in 1954, and he also presided as chairman of the Congress of the People at Kliptown, in Also he was treasurer-general of the African National Congress, the national body. How do you know that? This was announced at a meet ing where he presided. Do you know whether he attended any other conferences? I saw him attending the S.A. Indian Congress in 1953 in Durban. You know Dr. Motala? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No. 138). Do you know any other Dr. Motala who has taken part in the activities of the organisation? No. Do you know anything about Dr. Motala? He attended

49 the S.A. Indian Congress which was held in Johannesburg, during the last four or five years, I wouldn't be able to say just when, I kept observation on that meeting. Do you know D.A. Seedat? I do. Can you identify him? Yes. (Witness leaves box and identifies Accused No ) Do you know any other person by that name who takes an active part in the activities of Congress? No. Do you know anything about him? He is also one of those who attended the S.A. Indian Congress which was held in Johannesburg, a conference of the Congress. Do you know anything else about him? No. Do you know whether he attended the Kliptown Conference? I won't be able to tell. (No further questions) CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. BZRRANGE; This morning, and before the tea interval, you gave evidence about xhe positions held by a number of people? Correct. And after you had so given evidence for some little time, the question was raised by me as to whether or not your evidence was not hearsay? Correct. And as a result of that His Worship permitted me at that stage to cross-examine you in order to ascertain whether your evidence was hearsay? Quit e correct. You have been giving evidence in the courts for a number of years? Correct. You know what is meant by hearsay evidence? I do. You have also known that hearsay evidence is not admissable? Correct. You have always known that? Yes. Therefore you realised this morning that when I ques-

50 tioned you about these individuals to whom you had testified, that I was interested in ascertaining whether the evidence was hearsay? Correct. And you realised at that stage that if your evidence was hearsay it wouldn't be accepted by the Court? Correct. In questioning you about a number of these individuals, I asked you how did you know the positions which you say they held? Yes. And you replied and said that you knew this because of what you had been told by others? Correct. You also said it was common knowledge? That is correct. And that was the explanation given by you when I was endeavouring to have your evidence excluded? Correct. And you knew I was endeavouring to have your evidence excluded? Well, I wouldn't say that. Well, what did you think I was objecting to on the grounds of hearsay? I thought you want to Exclude your evidence? To clarify it. Didn't you know that hearsay evidence is not admissable? Yes, I do. And therefore if I object on the grounds of your evidence being hearsay, I would be objecting in order to exclude your evidence, would I not? That means I wouldn't... That is what you would think? Not me, I thought you wanted the position to be clarified. Yes, for what purpose, so as to have admissable evidence, or inadmissable evidence it was to have admissable evidence and not to have inadmissable evidence, correct? Yes. So then, I then put to you after having tested you with regard to a number of these individuals, as to how you

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