OFFICIAL REPORT OF PROCEEDINGS BEFORE THE NATIONAL LABOR RELATIONS BOARD REGION 19. Respondent, Charging Party.

Transcription

1 OFFICIL REPORT OF PROCEEDINGS BEFORE THE NTIONL LBOR RELTIONS BORD REGION In the Matter of: IM erospace Sumner, Inc., Respondent, Case Nos. -C-0 -C-0 and International ssociation of Machinists, District, Charging Party. Place: Seattle, Washington Dates: February, 0 Pages: through Volume: OFFICIL REPORTERS escribers, LLC E-Reporting and E-Transcription North th Street, Suite 0 Phoenix, Z 00 (0) -0

2 UNITED STTES OF MERIC BEFORE THENTIONL LBOR RELTIONS BORD REGION In the Matter of: IM EROSPCE SUMNER, INC., Respondent, Case Nos. -C-0 -C-0 and INTERNTIONL SSOCITION OF MCHINISTS, DISTRICT, Charging Party. The above-entitled matter came on for hearing, pursuant to notice, before ELENOR LWS, dministrative Law Judge, at the National Labor Relations Board, Region, James C. Sand Hearing Room, Jackson Federal Building, Second venue, Seattle, Washington, on Thursday, February, 0, : a.m.

3 PPERNCES On behalf of the General Counsel: RYN CONNOLLY, ES. NTIONL LBOR RELTIONS BORD - REGION Second venue Seattle, W Tel. (0)0- Fax. (0)0-0 On behalf of the Charging Party: SPENCER NTHN THL, ES. INTERNTIONL SSOCITION OF MCHINISTS, DISTRICT th Place South Seattle, W Tel. (0)-0 Fax. (0)-00 On behalf of the Respondent: CHRLES P. ROBERTS, III, ES. CONSTNGY BROOKS, SMITH & PROPHETE LLP 0 N. Cherry Street, Suite 00 Winston-Salem, NC Tel. ()-0 Fax. ()-00 W. MELVIN HS, III, ES. CONSTNGY BROOKS, SMITH & PROPHETE LLP P.O. Box Macon, G 0- Tel. ()- Fax. ()0-0

4 INDEX WITNESS DIRECT CROSS REDIRECT RECROSS VOIR DIRE Brenda Sellers Laura Hobbick Leigh Booth 0 / Deborah Ruffcorn / / James Herness 0 0

5 EXHIBITS 0 EXHIBIT IDENTIFIED IN EVIDENCE General Counsel: GC- GC- GC- (Not dmitted on the Record) GC- GC- Respondent: R- R- R- R- R- R- 0 R- R- R- R- R- R- R- 0 R-

6 0 R-0 R- R- 0 0 R- R- R- R- Charging Party: CP- CP- CP- 0 0

7 0 PROCEEDINGS JUDGE LWS: Okay. Let's go back on the record. We are continuing day. nd there are no preliminaries so we're just going to go ahead with the next witness for the Respondent. If you can come on up, we're going to swear you in. MR. ROBERTS: Respondent calls Brenda Sellers. JUDGE LWS: nd just so everybody knows and so it's clear for the record, Respondent's is still in front of her so if she does refer to a diagram it's going to be Respondent's Exhibit. Whereupon, BREND SELLERS having been duly sworn, was called as a witness herein and was examined and testified as follows: JUDGE LWS: Please have a seat. nd if you can state and spell your name for the record. THE WITNESS: Brenda Sellers, B-R-E-N-D-, S-E-L-L-E-R-S. JUDGE LWS: Thank you, Ms. Sellers. Couple things before I turn things over to counsel. If you're asked a question and you don't know the answer, that's fine. Just say, I don't know. Only guess if you're asked to take a guess -- THE WITNESS: Okay. JUDGE LWS: -- or make an estimation. If you don't understand a question, just say you don't understand the question and it will be asked in a more clear way.

8 THE WITNESS: Okay. JUDGE LWS: nd then, finally, our court reporter has to take down every word we say while we're on the record. In normal conversation we tend to anticipate the end of a question and jump in with a response. Try as best you can not to do that. THE WITNESS: Okay. JUDGE LWS: Okay. Thanks. DIRECT EXMINTION BY MR. ROBERTS: Good morning, Ms. Sellers. Where are you employed? IM erospace Sumner. nd how long have you worked there? It's been almost years. nd what is your position at this time? production supervisor over autoclave, layup, pack boards, and then autoclave gear. 0 nd how long have you been a supervisor? It's been about almost years. Okay. Prior to becoming a supervisor, were you in other types of jobs with IM? Uh-huh. I started out as a laminator in September of 000. nd then from there I went to a team leader in pack boards. I've been in production control. I've been in contracts.

9 Okay. nd then supervisor. nd the area that you work in -- there is a diagram, as the Judge said, as Respondent's Exhibit, in front of you. nd it's labeled, so can you just, by name, identify the area where you are supervisor? Uh-huh. utoclave layup. So that's -- So that's on the left-hand side of the -- Left side of the sheet, right outside those three doors, 0,. There's some tool prep area there. Those are also part of my job, Kit-Kat (phonetic), which is back by, the electrical room. nd then autoclave prep de-mold, and those three autoclaves. nd are they in the auto -- that layup room that's identified there? The Kit Kat machine is inside of the autoclave layup room. Do you have any responsibility for any parts of -- to 0 the -- let's say to the right of the wall that separates autoclave layup? So where it says assembly. I don't have any -- Yes, to that side. No. Okay. No. pproximately how -- we're going to talk primarily about June and July of last year. nd about how many employees did you have working for you at that time?

10 nywhere from like to. nd that's pretty similar now? Uh-huh. bout the same? Yeah. You need to answer verbally. Okay. Thank you. JUDGE LWS: You can't take down a nod. THE WITNESS: Sorry. BY MR. ROBERTS: Just very briefly, what kind of positions are in your area? We have autoclave. We have laminators. We have kit cutters, water striders, which are prep, and then autoclave operators and de-molders. Okay. Now, did you at one time have -- did you at one time have an employee named Lori-nn Downs-Haynes in your area? 0 nd do you remember approximately when she started working in your -- in autoclave? She was already in my area when I took over the position. Okay. She was -- we shared -- a couple P ducts were in that area, LM layup, autoclave layup, pack boards. They were kind

11 of all in that layup room. So she was already located in there. Okay. For the entire time you've been supervisor, at least up until she -- there's some evidence that she moved into a different position at one point in time. But for that duration she was in your area? She was in the layup room, yeah. nd did she work only on one position or did she have various positions? She had -- when I took over the supervisory in there she was working for another supervisor, but she was working on P ducts. So the ducting that we built. Uh-huh. nd then an LM layup. nd then when we split the LMs and just autoclave work, then she was working in the duct layup area, and then came over when we began our pack work program. nd we used her as a pack board laminator. Okay. nd did she from time to time -- and at this point 0 I'm talking before June and July of last year. Did she from time to time work in other areas of the plant? nd what other areas did she work in? She worked in duct rework, some duct assembly. ll right. Just so we all know, if you can identify on Exhibit -- Respondent where duct -- you said rework, or --

12 Yeah, duct rework. It used to be located -- so this map is of current looks like, where back in June, July it was back in the right corner over by where it's trim shops and then breakout. Okay. re you -- Behind layup area. Where was it in June and July of -- Back there where it says breakout and of the diagram. You're saying that as we sit here today it's in a different location? Uh-huh. Okay. Yeah. They've currently moved it right outside the autoclave layup door,. Okay. Towards me. What other areas did she work in prior to June and July of last year? She was -- would work in duct layup. She would work in 0 some shipping and receiving at times. She loves overtime, so. nd was that -- was that always on overtime or was it sometimes during the regular course of the day? Sometimes it would be the beginning of her shift or the end of her shift. nd then there was also times during the -- you know, the morning of she would report to pack board layup.

13 But then, you know, maybe callouts for duct layup was high, and so we would move her or other employees to that area to help fill that. So prior to June and July of last year was there any practice of sharing employees from one area to another? nd can you explain that to me? So like I said, with call-ins, or if one program is slower than the other we will kind of move operators around. If they have experience in ducts and they maybe have seven call-ins, she could use one of my operators, and vice versa. I borrow her supervisors sometimes to help fill, you know, callouts, vacations, sick, anything like that. (Respondent Exhibit Number Marked for Identification) BY MR. ROBERTS: Okay. I'm going to show you what I've marked for identification -- going to show you what I've marked for identification as Respondent's Exhibit. JUDGE LWS: Thank you. THE WITNESS: Thank you. 0 BY MR. ROBERTS: re you familiar with this document? I am. nd what is it? This is a text message from Donna to myself. nd the date of it appears to be June th of 0; is that correct?

14 That's correct. nd the message at the top that says, do you have any extra laminators today, was that from her or from you? That was from Donna. Okay. nd then that's your response where it says, yes, I am sending down Lori-nn now? Okay. nd that -- the bottom note, that doesn't have anything to do with -- about -- No, that's -- and that's Friday, June 0th. JUDGE LWS: Yeah, because it makes no sense. MR. ROBERTS: I'm not going to go there. THE WITNESS: No, that's -- BY MR. ROBERTS: So is this -- do you recall at this time, did you, in fact, send Lori-nn down to her area? I did. Uh-huh. nd was that just for one day or was it for an extended period of time? It was for that day. nd then each day after we would 0 kind of touch base with each other. Did I -- her program, did it pick up, did I get potting in, material in, could I send her again. nd it did turn into a couple days because we were out of potting for our pack boards, and so she didn't have the work. Okay.

15 MR. ROBERTS: nd I'll offer Respondent's Exhibit. MR. CONNOLLY: No objection. JUDGE LWS: nything? MR. THL: No objection. JUDGE LWS: Respondent's is admitted. (Respondent Exhibit Number Received into Evidence) BY MR. ROBERTS: ll right. nd when she worked in duct -- over for Donna Shaw, do you know where she worked for Donna Shaw? Typically I think she would be in duct room, which is -- well, it's layup area. So to the right on this diagram. To the far right of the -- Yeah, just outside the plaster shop or the -- so door. ll right. nd while she was there did you have occasion to -- well, whose payroll was she on while she was in Donna Shaw's -- She was under my E the entire time, 'cause I did not -- What does that mean, under your -- She was still my employee. I did not permanently transfer 0 her to another supervisor. So she was still under my E, so all of her time punches, ins, out, all of her vacation requests, attendance reports came through me. JUDGE LWS: Can you translate what E is? THE WITNESS: ttendance some -- it's a program. JUDGE LWS: Okay.

16 0 THE WITNESS: It's attendance. JUDGE LWS: It doesn't matter. THE WITNESS: Yeah, it's where they clock in and out. So it shows me they've clocked in and out. If there's a vacation that they've put in, just keeps track of their time. BY MR. ROBERTS: ny kind of leaves or anything like -- like family medical leave or anything like that? It would -- there's a code that says -- we don't know what it is, but there is a code that says which. Yeah, if she was on -- called out sick that day, or -- ll right. So did you have occasion to actually go over and speak with her from time to time? Oh, yeah. 'Cause sometimes they -- you know, if they forget to clock out, or if it didn't register, or if they go to lunch they have to clock out, and if they didn't, you know, clock back in then I would have to go and ask her like, you came back from lunch, what time did you clock in and clock out. Did you -- when you sent Lori -- Ms. Downs-Haynes over 0 there did you have occasion to send any other employees over there? Uh-huh. Yeah. She had asked for additional laminators so around that same time I sent Kelli Clough. How do you spell that last name? C-L-O-U-G-H. Kelli with an I. K-E-L-L-I. nd was there -- why did you select Ms. Clough to go over

17 there with Ms. Downs-Haynes? She also had been working in duct. She had probably over a year of duct experience. Did you become aware at some point in time that there was a petition going around to -- I'll put it kind of bluntly -- get rid of the Union -- to decertify the Union? Uh-huh. I did hear of it. nd then on one occasion Lori-nn -- I start around :00 a.m. in the morning where employees usually start about :0. She had came to me and said, have you seen my petition. nd I said, no. nd she said, okay, I think I've set it down somewhere, and she left. Before -- well, did you hear from others that she was involved in circulating a petition? I did not. It was a complete shock to me. nd why was it a shock to you? Because she was very pro-union. She would always have -- ask to have her steward with her whenever she would go to HR for any -- anything. Greg Clark -- she would always ask for Greg to be present with her. 0 Okay. Prior to June and July of last year did Ms. Downs-Haynes from time to time go to HR for various reasons? She did. She had some medical stuff she was going through, as well as there was some holiday pay that we get two weeks -- a week-and-a-half off, and she felt she should have

18 been paid for it and I don't think we paid for it. So she had been working with HR on -- on that. nd what is the practice or protocol when someone wants to set up a meeting with human resources? We will typically -- we like to ask the employee, you know, if they want to set up an appointment. That way we can let HR know so they can be prepared. So we -- usually she would say to me, I need to make an appointment with HR, and then I would. Sometimes she would say what it's for, sometimes they want to keep that private, so. During the course of while the petition was being passed around or signatures were being collected, did you ever see -- apart from when she asked about the petition, did you ever actually see the petition? No. I have never physically seen the petition. nd did you ever see it being actually, by anyone, passed around inside the facility? No. In June and July, while that was going on, did 0 Ms. Downs-Haynes have occasion to request to meet with human resources? up? nd were you involved in that -- in setting those meetings Yeah. Donna would sometimes call and say, hey, I -- you

19 know, Lori-nn went to go see HR. Or vice versa. I would tell, you know, Donna, hey, Lori-nn would see HR today so at some point she's going to need to go up and see them. Did you know the reason that she -- on those occasions in June and July why she was going up there? No, not -- no. Not at the time. Other than asking -- the time when she asked you where was her petition, or had you seen her petition, did you ever have any conversation at all with her about the Union, or the petition, or anything like that? No. Did you ever -- did there come a time though when you got some complaint, or some issue raised by Donna Shaw? She had told me that Lori-nn was back from lunch 0 late -- on a break -- so I went -- I said, okay. So I went down to the layup room -- duct room. She was on moving line. nd I just simply said, you must be returning from breaks and lunches on time. If you're going to be late -- 'cause sometimes she would say, well, I was in HR. Well, you gotta let Donna and I know that that's where you are going to be so that we can be prepared for that. Did you ever state to her that she should be careful about her union activity? No. Had you been -- as a supervisor had you been given any

20 instructions or directions from your superiors as to -- about how you should act or not act in these -- in what -- with regard to the petition? Yes, we -- nd what instructions had you received? We were to remain neutral. We were not to show any -- just to remain neutral. Okay. Directing your attention -- did you attend a meeting in which the Employer announced that it had received a petition and that it was withdrawing recognition? Yes, I did. Okay. nd what do you recall being said at that meeting? Just that there had been a petition that was signed by a certain amount of employees, I don't recall the number, and that we had submitted it and that we were withdrawing. nd who spoke in that meeting? Mike Pratt, I believe. Okay. nd after the meeting do you recall what you did or 0 where you went after the meeting? No. I was standing over where the production -- door. Where was the meeting held on this layout? If there's a door around -- near it -- Yeah, it -- Is it where the BR -- So it -- so between 0 -- point and is where Mike

21 Pratt would have been standing. nd then I was standing at next to Dave Blake, in that kind of doorway area. Okay. Did you observe Debbie Ruffcorn or Leigh Booth in that meeting? No. I didn't even know where they were located in that meeting. I don't recall even seeing them. Did you walk out with them, Leigh Booth and/or Debbie Ruffcorn? No, I did not walk out with them. So do you recall what you did after the meeting ended? I went back to the autoclave layup room. Okay. Did you yourself make any kind of gesture or statement regarding the fact that the Employer had withdrawn recognition? No, I did not. nd did you observe any other manager make any kind of positive gesture or statement with regard to what had happened? No. You testified that Lori had -- Ms. Downs-Haynes had worked 0 in various areas and you said among those were shipping and receiving? Uh-huh. Yeah. Was that a yes? Okay.

22 Sorry. nd was she -- so she had experience in these other areas like breakout -- the breakout area, and rework, and -- Yeah, like duct rework and stuff. Okay. Just one or two more questions -- Okay. -- for clarification. laminator -- are there different types of laminators? Like different products or something that you're working on? Yeah. There's all -- we have different specifications. So like pack boards, those are the slides that hold the emergency chute in the aircraft, those require a little more detail than some of our ducts -- you know, just the ducting tube. But we do have different specifications for different splicing requirements and work orientation. Had Ms. Downs-Haynes worked in both the different areas or just in one area? No. Yeah. She had worked in ducts, and LMs, and pack 0 boards, P ducts. nd she had been -- she's a great laminator. She picks up quickly, so we tend to be able to utilize her in other areas. MR. ROBERTS: I don't have any further questions. JUDGE LWS: Okay. Ready for cross, or do you need -- MR. CONNOLLY: Sure, Your Honor. JUDGE LWS: Okay.

23 MR. CONNOLLY: Good morning, Ms. Sellers. THE WITNESS: Good morning. CROSS-EXMINTION BY MR. CONNOLLY: How frequently do employees that are assigned to your work area work in other areas, similar to what you described regarding Lori-nn? Uh-huh. It could -- sometimes daily. So currently we're working another program in my autoclave and layup area. I have borrowed Donna's duct laminators every day this week. How many? One this week. But on any given day we are -- we can be moving operators back and forth if need be. nd Lori-nn worked in duct for several weeks, correct? You have to -- 0 That was a yes? Okay. Sorry. nd can you recall any other assignments that lasted that long? For several weeks she would come in to work early and work in duct rework. No, I'm sorry. Can you recall any other employees that were working in another department for that long a period?

24 Yes, Kelli Clough. Okay. nd can -- what department was she in? Duct layup. Okay. That same -- Same area. -- time? nd that was -- I think in your testimony you mentioned that Kelli Clough was sent at the same time as Lori-nn? I don't recall if it was the same exact day, but I mean -- She she would -- yes. General time? Probably was in the next couple days -- Okay. -- I had sent her, or she had gone first and then, you know, Lori had. nd how long was she in duct? Probably a couple weeks, I'm going to assume. It could 0 have been almost up to a month. ny other examples you can think of where an employee was working in a different department for more than a couple of days? I have currently one of our laminators in autoclave layup. She works in duct rework as well. She's been there for

25 probably five months. Okay. In the morning she works in duct rework and then comes to autoclave layup and works. So works in both on the same day? Okay. Now, you testified that Lori-nn would occasionally work in other areas because she was working overtime, correct? So how is it determined who is going to be working on overtime? By experience. Typically we would -- we're not going to cross train or try to put somebody in and work overtime if they don't -- they're not familiar with that product or how to do that product. So we -- if they had already kind of been established or trained, then that's when we would allow them to work the overtime. nd is that a decision that you make yourself or is that in consultation with any other employer? 0 I always check with my -- my manager. nd who is your manager? Rob nderson. nd you were asked about whether you made any comment about that meeting -- you know, the Union being no longer recognized at that meeting.

26 0 nd you testified that you did not? I didn't. Did you ever make any sort of comment, exclamation regarding the Union no longer being recognized? No. We were counseled to remain neutral. nd it's very important that we remained neutral. nd how frequently do you counsel employees to stop talking and get back to work? The clustering you mentioned. Say -- can you repeat the -- Your testimony was that when employees are clustered 0 together -- MR. ROBERTS: No, she wasn't asked -- THE WITNESS: I never -- MR. ROBERTS: -- anything about that. JUDGE LWS: Yeah, I don't think she was asked about -- THE WITNESS: I did not. JUDGE LWS: -- about instructing employees to get back to work. MR. CONNOLLY: Okay. I have no further questions, Your Honor. JUDGE LWS: Okay. nything from Charging Party? MR. THL: No. JUDGE LWS: ll right. ny redirect? MR. ROBERTS: No.

27 0 JUDGE LWS: ll right. Thank you for providing your testimony. THE WITNESS: Thank you. JUDGE LWS: Please don't discuss what you talked about in here today with any other witnesses to this proceeding or any potential witnesses. Okay. Thank you. THE WITNESS: Thank you. JUDGE LWS: Off the record. (Off the record at : a.m.) JUDGE LWS: nd I'm going to swear you in before you have a seat. Whereupon, LUR HOBBICK having been duly sworn, was called as a witness herein and was examined and testified as follows: JUDGE LWS: Please have a seat. nd can you state and spell your name for the record. THE WITNESS: Laura Hobbick, L--U-R-, H-O-B-B-I-C-K. JUDGE LWS: Thank you, Ms. Hobbick. Before the lawyers start asking you questions I just want to go over a couple things. One is if you're asked a question and you don't know the answer, please say, I don't know. Only guess or speculate if you're asked to take a guess. If you don't understand a question, just say you don't understand and it will be cleared up for you. nd then, finally, as best you can try not to jump

28 in with your answer until you're completely sure the question is done being asked because our court reporter can't take down two voices at once. THE WITNESS: Okay. JUDGE LWS: Thank you. DIRECT EXMINTION BY MR. HS: Good morning, Ms. Hobbick. Good morning. Would you like to share with the Judge any lack of comfort factors that you have about testifying? I have a little bit of stage fright, so I have a problem talking in front of people I don't know. JUDGE LWS: ll right. Well, this -- THE WITNESS: So if you see me flush, that's why. JUDGE LWS: -- this is an easy crowd, so try to relax as best you can. MR. HS: Thank you. 0 BY MR. HS: Ms. Hobbick, where do you work? I work in autoclave layup. For what company? Oh. IM erospace. In front of you there's a document marked R-. That's an exhibit that's in the record of the facility. Okay. Can you tell us where the area is that you work,

29 autoclave? Can you locate that? It's autoclave layup on the left side of the piece of paper. Okay. How long have you worked there? June will be six years. nd you've been in autoclave for those six years? Yes, I -- that's my title. Were you -- when the Union was there, were you a union member? Yes, I was. How did you become a union member? fter they voted the Union in, I signed up because I was 0 under the impression that I was going to have to pay dues either way and I figured I might as well be covered by the Union if I'm going to have to pay the dues. (Respondent Exhibit Number Marked for Identification) MR. HS: May I approach the witness, Your Honor? JUDGE LWS: MR. HS: Let the record reflect I'm handing Ms. Hobbick Respondent's Exhibit for identification. BY MR. HS: Do you recognize the document? Yes, my -- it's my request for transfer. nd is the date accurate, //? nd how did you come to make that request for transfer?

30 I went onto BirdDog online, which is their hiring site. nd they have an option for their new job openings to be sent to your mailbox -- your . nd I opted that they send me new job openings, and it popped up in my . nd as a result of that what did you do? I applied online and the following day I put in my request for transfer. Did you have any discussions with any other employees about that BirdDog that you got? I discussed it with Lori-nn and told her about it because I knew she wanted experience in other areas. That's Lori-nn Downs-Haynes? Yes, Lori-nn Downs. nd approximately how long after / did you have this discussion with Lori-nn? 0 day. Probably the day that I did the transfer or the following Shortly afterwards? nd this is on -- on R- for identification, this is your signature on the request? Had you previously taken any action regarding this transfer request online? I did the online application the day before I turned in

31 the request for transfer. MR. HS: Now we'll offer R- into evidence. JUDGE LWS: ny objection? MR. THL: No objection. JUDGE LWS: Respondent's is admitted. (Respondent Exhibit Number Received into Evidence) BY MR. HS: fter you made this application for transfer, what occurred next with regard to that transfer request? Within a short period of time I had an interview with the lead for shipping and receiving. I believe his name was urelio (phonetic). nd did you have any other interviews? I did have another interview. He went on vacation right after the interview that I had with him, and I had another interview with an H -- somebody from HR. I do not remember who. 0 nd did you have any experience in shipping and receiving? No. None. None. Were you ever told with regard to what was the action taken on your request for transfer? Just that I had not received the position. re you aware of anyone else who had made a similar transfer request? I knew that Lori-nn Downs had applied for the position.

32 Were you employed by IM back in and I guess it was ' when there was a union election? I was -- I was already employed. I was hired in 0. Did you ever observe any union supporters campaigning during working time? MR. CONNOLLY: Your Honor, I assume my standing objection is still in place? JUDGE LWS: MR. CONNOLLY: Okay. BY MR. HS: Was that something that occurred frequently? I remember two campaigns throughout the whole time that they were campaigning. You remember two campaigns? Two different instances where -- Oh, two separate instances. Okay. Where that occurred? Ms. Hobbick, did -- directing your attention to the period 0 of this past summer, June and July, right after this transfer request here, did you ever have an occasion to see Lori-nn ask anyone to sign her petition during working time? Not during working time, no. When did you ever see her? She came to me to ask me to sign the petition, but it was before my shift.

33 Did you ever see her ask employees while she and they were on break to sign -- No. Did you ever see her ask any employees outside the facility? I didn't see her ask anybody other than me. MR. HS: Excuse me one moment, please. JUDGE LWS: Sure. Take your time. MR. HS: No further questions. JUDGE LWS: ll right. nd before we go on to cross, I 0 just want to make sure the person who entered the room is not a witness. MR. ROBERTS: Not for us. JUDGE LWS: Okay. Okay. Great. Thanks. MR. CONNOLLY: Thank you, Ms. Hobbick, for being here today. I do not have any questions, Your Honor. MR. THL: May I follow up? JUDGE LWS: Sure. CROSS-EXMINTION BY MR. THL: So you applied for the receiving clerk position in May of 0; is that right? nd is that because of the date May nd that's in the upper left there? Is that how you're recalling that?

34 I didn't -- right off the top of my head I do not remember. But this is my handwriting, so. So I assume that the job was posted at some time prior to when you applied for it, right? So it would have been posted prior to May nd. You applied for it, you think, on May nd? nd tell me just a little bit about the receiving clerk position and why it's appealing. Is it -- why it's appealing to you. The experience. I didn't have any experience in shipping or receiving at all, and I've been working for the same company for -- well, coming up on six years now, and I want more experience. I want to know more about the company. Got it. When did you get notified that you did not receive the position? 0 Probably about a week after my second interview. Help me put that into time. That I cannot remember. So was it before Lori-nn was appointed to the position? That I do not know. Do you know if anyone was appointed to the position prior to Lori-nn getting it? That I do not know.

35 Did you ever see the posting reposted in late June after the original closing period? No, I do not remember. MR. THL: Thank you. I don't have anything further. JUDGE LWS: ny redirect? MR. HS: No, ma'am. JUDGE LWS: ll right. Well, thank you very much for 0 providing your testimony. THE WITNESS: You're welcome. JUDGE LWS: Wasn't so bad. nd -- THE WITNESS: No, it wasn't really. JUDGE LWS: You did good. nd please don't discuss what you testified about with any other witnesses or anybody who could be called as a witness. THE WITNESS: Okay. JUDGE LWS: Okay. Thank you. Off the record. (Off the record at :0 a.m.) JUDGE LWS: Get the next witness. MR. ROBERTS: She's here. JUDGE LWS: Oh, she's here. ll right. Well, there we go. Let's go back on the record. MR. ROBERTS: Respondent calls Leigh Booth. JUDGE LWS: You can come on around. Please raise your right hand. Whereupon,

36 0 0 LEIGH BOOTH having been duly sworn, was called as a witness herein and was examined and testified as follows: JUDGE LWS: Please have a seat and identify yourself for the record. THE WITNESS: My name is Leigh Booth, L-E-I-G-H, B-O-O-T-H. JUDGE LWS: Thank you, Ms. Booth. nd you've heard me instruct the other witnesses so I'm not going to bother doing it again. So, counsel, proceed. MR. ROBERTS: I'd just note for the record that Ms. Booth has some flu-like symptoms. She'll try to stay away from everybody, but, with your permission, if she needs to just step down for a second -- JUDGE LWS: Yeah. MR. ROBERTS: -- is that okay? JUDGE LWS: If you need a break, let us know. THE WITNESS: Thank you. MR. ROBERTS: ll right. DIRECT EXMINTION BY MR. ROBERTS: Ms. Booth, you're employed with IM erospace? Yes, I am. ll right. nd keep your voice up a little bit. I know you're not feeling well, but just keep --

37 nd what is your current position? Vice President of human resources. nd how long have you been associated with IM erospace? lmost years, I believe. Okay. nd we don't need the whole history, but just what positions have you typically held there? I started as the manager of HR with the Renton facility. nd then as it grew and came under one management team, they added uburn. nd then when we purchased Precision erospace, which is the Sumner facility, and they became part of IM, they added that. nd I believe around that time is when I was promoted to Vice President. Can you tell us approximately when the Sumner facility became part of IM? I believe it was in 00. nd where is your office located? My main office is in Renton. Do you have office space, or do you use office space at 0 the other facilities from time to time? I'll either work in the HR manager's office, or if there's an open office sometimes I'll work in that. But I don't have a set office in the other locations, no. nd directing your attention about back to 0, you're familiar that there was a union campaign during that time

38 period? nd were you -- at least have responsibilities for the Employer with regard to that campaign? I was part of the negotiating team. Okay. nd just very briefly, what were the issues as far as you could determine at that time? I think there were two main issues that I believe were the -- were the issues. Sorry. Too much cold medicine. One of them was the leadership at the Sumner site, and pay. nd the record reflects of course that the Union won the election and was certified. nd you're aware that negotiations subsequently occurred? 0 They started, I believe, in September. nd were you involved in those negotiations? Yes, I was. nd you were present at the table? Yes, I was. nd how long did those negotiations continue? They went all the way through, I believe, pril of the following year. Okay. nd was a contract successfully reached at some point? I believe end of pril, / or /. Right in there.

39 During the course of -- or even after the campaign, did the company receive certain unfair labor practice charges related to its handbook? Yes, it did. nd were you involved in resolving those with the National Labor Relations Board? Yes, I was. (Respondent Exhibit Number Marked for Identification) BY MR. ROBERTS: I'm going to show you what I've marked for identification as Respondent's Exhibit. Can you identify this document? What is it? It was a summary of the issues with our handbook at the time. Okay. nd there's just one that I want to ask you about, is the number -- allegation. It talks about access to the facility. Was that one of the issues? 0 nd do you recall what the nature of that issue was? I think the issue was there were people who came to work early -- substantially early or substantially late and our handbook at the time -- and, again, it's a while ago, so I'm -- to the best of my ability -- the language in the handbook restricted them from doing that and they felt it was too

40 restrictive. Okay. nd was a resolution of that charge reached? I believe so, yes. nd did the company enter into a settlement agreement with the Board? Yes, they did. nd what was the basic point of that settlement, or what was the basic obligation of the company under that settlement? We agreed on language updating our handbook in the specified areas, and we had to post a notice on the bulletin boards -- the company bulletin boards for a period of time. I don't remember how long. (Respondent Exhibit Number Marked for Identification) BY MR. ROBERTS: I'm going to show you what I've marked as Respondent's. Can you identify this document? It looks like the settlement agreement and the 0 posting. MR. CONNOLLY: Your Honor, I'm going to object to this line of questioning. I know the documents have not been themselves offered yet, but to the extent this is addressing some dispute that existed in the past regarding a prior rule, I don't see the relevance. MR. ROBERTS: Well, it goes to the whole allegation of access -- you know, granting excessive access to the facility. So I think it's relevant.

41 JUDGE LWS: I do see some relevance there. So, again, they haven't been offered yet, but I will -- I assume we're not going to go too deep into this, but -- MR. ROBERTS: I've covered it. I was just getting ready to offer them. Respondent offers Respondent's Exhibits and. JUDGE LWS: Okay. nd I -- MR. CONNOLLY: I would object, Your Honor. JUDGE LWS: nd I will go ahead and admit them because I do see some potential relevance with regard to the access issue. (Respondent Exhibits Number and Received into Evidence) BY MR. ROBERTS: I think you testified that a contract was reached in around pril of 0, correct? The end of pril. Okay. nd was there a provision in the -- do you recall a provision in the contract dealing with membership in the Union, whether employees were required and what were the parameters of that? 0 nd just describe in general what the agreement was. The agreement that was reached was that employees would have the choice of whether or not they wanted to actively join the Union and sign the card and then pay dues or not. But it was entirely up to their choice.

42 Okay. But if they chose to join, what were the consequences of that? If they elected to join then they were tied in for the length of the contract, or whatever time, like new hires, was left in the contract. t the time that the Union was there did the company deduct -- assuming that they had authorization from employees, did they deduct the membership dues from their paychecks? It was automatically deducted and sent to the IM. nd did you receive notice -- periodic notifications from the Union as to the amount of the dues? nnually, yes. (Respondent Exhibit Number Marked for Identification) BY MR. ROBERTS: I'll show what I've marked as Respondent's Exhibit. nd it's a two-page document. Can you identify what each page is? The top page was the notice I received obvious -- not 0 obviously, sorry -- on December st notifying me of the new dues for '. MR. CONNOLLY: Excuse me, Your Honor. I only have one page. THE WITNESS: nd the second page is the notice I received on November th for the 0 dues. BY MR. ROBERTS: nd those reflect the dues that were applicable for --

43 -- each of the years? The ones that went into effect for the new year. Okay. MR. ROBERTS: I'll offer Respondent's Exhibit. JUDGE LWS: ny objection? MR. CONNOLLY: No objection, Your Honor. JUDGE LWS: I will admit Respondent's. (Respondent Exhibit Number Received into Evidence) BY MR. ROBERTS: Did there come a point in time where the ownership of the company changed? nd approximately when did that occur? I believe February of 0. nd how was the company, if you know, owned prior to that time? Was it publicly held? Was it privately held? It wasn't publicly held, but there were -- each facility was actually its own entity, had its own UVI number, but it was held under a parent company that was privately held. 0 Okay. nd did that change at this time that you say that ownership changed? We were purchased by Liberty Hall, which is an equity group.

44 Okay. nd what, if anything -- when they purchased it, what, if anything, happened with regard to the relationship between the three facilities? I think at first there was a lot of discovery, but instead of being so much separate entities they've really shifted us towards -- even though we still are separate operating sites, they really are pulling us together so we're functioning as one, if that makes sense. So you don't have each site making their own decisions, but it's more centralized. They brought in consultants to interview all of the management team, I think all the way down to supervisor level at every site, to talk to them to get a sense for the company and the business and how it was going, just to get, I think, a lay of the land, so to speak. Okay. Did there come a time when there was a significant change in the management of the Sumner facility? In 0 -- and I apologize, I should remember, but I 0 don't. Maybe towards the end of first quarter the vice president of Sumner facility and the GM, and then within a couple months the HR manager were all replaced. nd the vice president, who was that? What was -- Jeff Moore. You mentioned the leadership issue. t the time of the campaign did that include Mr. Moore? Mr. Moore was there.

45 Now, was there -- did there come a point in time in 0 when some adjustments were made to wages in uburn and Renton, or the wage scales? Well, in January the minimum wage went up in Washington state, and so of course we were compliant with that. But then in the Renton and uburn facilities we reviewed the wage scale table and we adjusted that. I believe it was done -- by the time we got it done it was February -- Okay. -- when we implemented it. You did, at some point, become aware that a decertification petition was being circulated among the Sumner employees? Okay. nd I'm going to ask you, before you became aware of it -- of that actual petition, did you, in your position, receive inquiries or questions or comments from employees indicating, you know, concerns or issues with the Union? Starting with when the Union came in actually there 0 were people who weren't happy that obviously they lost the vote, in their terms right. nd then there wasn't a lot after that. But every year there would be,, people who would -- 'cause I'm out there at least once a week. I cover for vacations when people are out. I went through a couple HR managers, so in the interim between, I might be out there for a

46 0 month or so as I was hiring. People, I think, were familiar with me and they would express what they weren't happy with the Union and -- and make comments about it. Was there any change in the quantity of those comments at some point in 0? Normally, like I said, I'd get maybe four, five a year, just comments here or there. In second quarter sometime, heading into third, I received three or four inquiries from employees. nd specifically what were the nature of those inquiries? I had a couple that were very specific on how did they get rid of them and -- and what could I do. nd what was your response to those? That I could not assist them, that I could direct them to the NLRB, and I actually gave them their address and their telephone number. Okay. Were there any other -- you mentioned that as one inquiry. Were there other inquiries? There were a couple that -- like that, and there were a 0 couple that were just not happy with the wages. But they never asked any questions about how to make the Union go away, so I didn't give them any information. I just said, you know, their contract is what governed their working conditions, and that was it. Did you -- well, how did you learn that the petition was

47 actually actively being -- or employees were actively being solicited to sign a petition? You know, I don't know that I can pinpoint one thing. It was like suddenly everybody was talking about it, the supervisors, the managers. I know Debbie had heard. I may have heard from her. nd do you know an employee named Lori-nn Downs-Haynes? Yes, I do. nd did you -- backing away from the petition for the moment, but did you have occasion from time to time to address issues with her or issues that she had? Several. nd what kind of issues -- before this petition what kind of issues again did you have? Well, Lori had a work-related injury, so there was the 0 return-to-work process. I think a couple times I met with her. But the one that stands out in my mind was -- had to do with her compensation when she was out on leave. nd I met with her to go over the -- literally we came up with -- had a spreadsheet that outlined each week and what she got paid, and what she would have gotten paid, and what the rules were. nd I believe one time, the first time I met with her, it might have been Greg Clark, the shop steward, was with her. I believe another time James Herness was with her when we met to go over it.

48 Okay. Did you -- before the petition actually began being circulated, did you become aware that Ms. Downs-Haynes was asking questions or making -- raising issues about the Union? Can you ask that again? Sorry. I'm not sure -- Sure. Did anyone inform you -- well, did you have any discussions with Ms. Ruffcorn as to whether she had had any discussions with Ms. Downs-Haynes regarding the process for getting rid of the Union? You know I can't say before or after. I'll be honest. I don't -- because it seemed like it just went so -- so fast. I don't remember any particular one standing out. So, before. Trying to think. Okay. Well, before or after? Did you have some after? Or at least -- at some point during that process did you have -- 0 I remember having conversation after. Maybe two, but I remember one. But I believe the petition was already being -- going around. Okay. What meeting or conversation do you recall being involved in? I was working in Debbie's office and Lori-nn came in, and

49 she was upset, was agitated. Who else was present? Debbie. Sorry. Debbie Ruffcorn. nd do you recall an approximate date, or how long after the petition or before the petition it was being held? No. I believe it was after. Do you -- if you don't recall, it's fine. But do you recall approximately how long after the petition had been circulated? I don't. Okay. Sorry. What do you recall being said during that meeting? I remember Lori being upset because she was in the lunch 0 room and she was talking to employees about the petition, and she came in because she said James Herness was interrupting and standing there, and she felt like he was trying to intimidate her. They kind of went back and forth, I guess, a couple of times. nd I told her that the lunch room -- everybody was free to talk. They could talk about whatever they wanted. He was within his rights to be there, quite frankly, and to say what he wanted, just like she could say whatever she wanted to whoever. nd I think she asked a question or there was something asked about the other shifts. I don't remember a lot of

50 detail. nd either me or Debbie clarified for her that she couldn't be there on the other shifts and she couldn't work -- interrupt people's work, but if it was just a shift exchange, like from first to second, or whatever, as she's leaving and they're coming, she could, but she couldn't like come on site and talk to people on site, something of that nature. Directing your attention to on or about July the th, 0, were you involved in a meeting in which James Herness and Guisseppee Mercado raised certain issues about a posting that the company had made? nd was Ms. Ruffcorn also present for that meeting? Yeah, she was. Okay. nd just to the best of your recollection, tell us what -- you know, how that meeting went. What was said back and forth. I remember them coming in. nd I believe they'd scheduled 0 a time with Debbie ahead of time. nd they were asking about the posting that had been put up in response to all of the employee's questions. nd they were asking if we supported it, or agreed with it, something of that nature. nd we said, no, we were neutral. We had simply put it up, because we were getting all of these questions from the employees. They felt, I believe, that it was negative for the Union. nd I said, no, it's just the facts.

51 James alleged that a lot of people were reading it on work time and I don't remember exactly other stuff. nd I said we were unaware of that. But that we would address it with management because they should be working during work time. I believe we talked about transfers, or postings. Something of that nature as well, but I don't remember the particular details. nd I believe we also talked about some benefit issue, but I don't remember what it was. Some clarification on leaves or something. Was there any discussion in that meeting, do you recall any discussion about whether supervisors were assisting, or being involved in the process? I believe that's one of the allegations that James made. nd I said that we were unaware of it. But again, we would talk to management because we hadn't seen it. Nobody had reported it, and I certainly hadn't seen it. Did they -- during that meeting, was any -- were any specifics provided as to which supervisors or how they had been involved? 0 I don't remember any specifics. I just remember him stating we have facts, or we have statements. We have all of this stuff, but I don't remember any of the specific details or specifics. Okay. Sorry, supervisor.

52 Were you present when the petition was presented to the company? Yes, I was. nd where did that occur? In Debbie Ruffcorn's office. nd just tell us, as best you recall, what happened with regard to that. Rebecca Cole brought the petition in, and asked if we would accept it, and we took it. nd was anyone else present with her? Not when she brought the petition in. What about before she brought the petition? Before she brought the petition in, Lori had come in and she asked and pleaded if we would accept it. nd I said yes, and then she left. Now directing your attention to on or about July th, were you present when an announcement was made by the company about withdrawing recognition? 0 Yes, I was. Okay, and who was present -- I mean who spoke for management at that meeting? Michael Pratt. Okay, and do you recall where you were in that meeting? Where you were sitting or what kind of -- with regard to the setup, well first of all, where was the meeting held?

53 It was held in the maintenance room, which is in the middle of the plant. Okay, and where were you in relationship to Mr. Pratt? If I was facing everybody in the lunch room, I would have been off to the left. Can you look at Respondent's Exhibit, and I think the most effective way is there's a number of doors, noted and numbered by numbers. If that helps in any way. If you could locate sort of, where you were. Sorry. I'm not good with maps. Well, where was Mr. Pratt standing, if you recall? He was standing in the walkway between the offices and the lunchroom, which I think -- so if you go from maintenance, to purchasing, to engineering. Like, I think. I think that's the lunchroom right there. So he would have been right in that area. Okay, and approximately, where were you? I would have been probably down by. I typically, for all the all-hands meetings, I'm on the left side. That area. 0 Were you sitting, or were you standing? Standing. Okay. I don't sit for the meetings. nd was anyone standing with you, or near you? I think there were other members of management from