Dadavani Magazine. March Trapped in the grip of insistence EDITORIAL

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1 Dadavani Magazine March 2011 Trapped in the grip of insistence EDITORIAL Who is free from the prevailing belief, I am right, my talk is right? A worldly person, a sadhu and a mahatma (the one who has attained Selfrealization through Gnan Vidhi of Akram Vignan) on the path of moksha; none are able to remain free from activity due to such prevailing belief. Revered Dadashri introduces such insistence-laden conduct and defines the nature of willfulness and insistence as khencha. What does khencha mean? One keeps belaboring his point in order to prove himself correct, that is insistence. Insistence is one of the biggest negative traits. There is no truth where there is insistence. One will engage himself in confrontational arguments (chadasey chadhavu) to prove his point correct and to engage in such confrontational arguments is to leave your own place as the Self and fall all the way down; it is to lose your own place and to regress. How can one who wants to attain moksha afford such worldly interaction (vyavahar)? Gnani Purush Dadashri says that after attaining Atmagnan Self-realization, our life should be free from insistence. Generally, one should carry out wordly duties and work through gentle understanding and communication with the other person, but in this there should not be any insistence. Willfulness and inner pull increases the burden and prevents the expression of the bliss of the Self. Mukta hasya (the smile and laughter of the liberated One) has been obstructed due to ones own inner unyielding obstinacies (pakado) only, has it not? Look at this Gnani. He became insistence free and free from unyielding obstinacy, so how his mukta hasya is overflowing? Gnani Purush is constantly in a state of liberation, does not get bound even for a moment by any circumstance. Everyone become cheerful just doing darshan of the Gnani Purush. We are also able to attain such a state after attaining the Self. But there are tubers of kashayas (anger-pride-deceit-greed) inside and that is why insistent pull (khencha) remains within. This insistence is of the pudgal (mindspeech-body complex) and the Self is completely separate, but what prevents

2 the expression of that experience? Insistence-unyielding willfulness (khencha-pakkad). This inner willfulness is the fault, and that is why there is all this pain (dukha). The intellect makes one willful and insistent and ego makes one act crazily. It is because of this willfulness and insistence that one s further progress gets obstructed. We have a goal to become ekavtari (one more life remains before attaining moksha) then how can we afford to get caught into the grip of insistence? Insistence is a great danger zone in the path of moksha, therefore we have to understand in detail about this from the Gnani Purush and remain constantly alert. Awareness starts from the time one knows that inner pull-unyielding obstinacy-insistence (khencha-pakad-aagraha) are wrong in the path of moksha. It is our ardent prayer that this compilation of Dadavani help everyone to make the spiritual effort for the increased awareness necessary to experience the Self, and become tuber-free (nirgranth) like the Gnani. ~Jai Sat Chit Anand

3 Trapped in the grip of insistence Questioner: Ordinarily what should our life be like after attaining Dada s Gnan? Dadashri: You should live a life free from any insistence (khencha).

4 Questioner: Give me an example of how one is insistent, please. Dadashri: Suppose we are talking. I give you an answer and in order to make your point correct you bring up the same topic again. That is insistence (khencha). This is what people do over and over again. If you have taken Gnan, then there should be no insistence. If there is any insistence, then get rid of it, because it is a mistake. There is no problem if you try to get rid of it and it does not go away. If there is continued insistence on your part, if Chandulal is insistent, then You have to simply see it, by doing so, You are free. You are separate from your insistence if you remain the seer (jonaro). Then you are in compliance with our laws. Insistence (khencha) is something very different. Insistence means, if I say, No, it is like this but you keep belaboring your point in order to prove yourself correct, that is insistence. There is no truth where there is insistence; insistence is one of the biggest negative traits. The definition of being insistence-free is if someone tells you, I don t like it, then you say, Very well. I will keep quiet, there is no botheration. The door of arguments is lack of awakened awareness Questioner: So if someone keeps arguing and tries very hard to prove his point, does that mean he has no basis? Dadashri: But even in those situations people do not argue with awareness; people argue because they do not have awakened awareness. In fact, people argue because they lack awareness. Do you think someone with awakened awareness jagruti would argue? Questioner: Is it wrong or right to argue? Dadashri: It is fine for the worldly life; it is fine if you want to do something for the worldly life, but it is wrong if you want liberation. In the worldly life, if you don t argue, people will walk away with your things. But here in satsang, it is not appropriate to argue. There is nothing to say in whatever the Gnani tells you; arguing and discussions are only meant for the worldly life. In the worldly life you may even have to say, Dada, do not go in this car, go in this one. But here in satsang?! What wisdom, what over wise people there are! You are being over wise, this is what I have to tell some people.

5 Worldly life exists verily due to conflicts This is a Vignan. Many people tell me; make laws, do this, do that. You fools! What kind of people are you that in spite of attaining such a Vignan you have not become wise? What a Vignan this is! A Vignan where even the slightest argument will not happen! Questioner: people until now. Rules and laws were the only way to discipline Dadashri: That is fine for people at large but ours is the path of liberation. People who want to wander around in this worldly life, they need laws. Otherwise, laws cause conflicts and conflicts give rise to the worldly life. Questioner: Are there not laws on the path of liberation? Dadashri: No laws are needed on the path of liberation. There are no laws here. Everything is natural. Whatever happens naturally is correct. The result of confrontational arguments Questioner: You said, where there is liberation, there are no laws; where there are laws there is no liberation. Liberation is through absolute humility (param vinaya). So absolute humility encompasses everything, does it not? Dadashri: Yes. Absolute humility encompasses everything. With rules, one will be required to keep a tulsi plant (tulsi leaves are used in prayer rituals in the kramic path, they also have medicinal properties). If a mouse nibbles away at the tulsi, he will have to keep a cat to keep the mice away. The cat ruins the milk and so he has to keep a dog to protect the milk. Where does it end? Therefore, here we have the law of no laws. Here we are applying Vignan and so the slightest of interference is madness. It is tantamount to being over wise.

6 So what is it like here in the satsang? You have to become wise. You have to have param vinaya, which means you do not have to speak unnecessarily. Speak only when it is necessary. Where there is absolute humility param vinaya one will not have his opinion at all. One will continue to see the storms within, and will not succumb to any inner tug of insistence (khencha). Do not try to show your wisdom or your cleverness here. All your cleverness is imitation; it is not original. Meaning you have learnt from others, you have learnt from books. Then you get into arguments and you do not stop. Don t you even recognize that you are going off on the wrong track, by doing this? To engage in such confrontational and competitive arguments (chadasey chadhavu) is to leave Your place as the Soul the Self and fall all the way down; it is to lose Your place and to regress. The one who pulls ends up being stupid Dadashri: You are not getting into arguments and clashes, which then require resolutions (bhanjghad) with people, are you? Questioner: It happens a little at home, it happens at home. Dadashri: At home; where else does that happen? Does it happen with your brother? Questioner: Yes. Dadashri: Distribute whatever needs to be distributed, and then it will not happen, is there anything to distribute? Questioner: No, there is nothing like that. Dadashri: Then what is it? Questioner: Certain beliefs. Misunderstanding remains towards one another.

7 Dadashri: Where is the misunderstanding remaining? The one (ego) will turn towards where there is a pull. When he pulls then you have to let go; otherwise it will break. Then you have to tie a knot. When the tug happens, then You should know that, this one (within) is tugging. In our world the world of those on the path of liberation the one who does not pull or tug will attain salvation. Sooner or later, the one who is keeps tugging with insistence will have to repent and let go, will he not? Some people should understand this thoroughly, no? Thereafter where is the need to quarrel at all? If both of them pull then it will break and if it breaks then you will have to tie a knot (mend the hurt that has happened). If both pull then both are called fools, no? Questioner: Then repentance happens. After the rope breaks I feel regret. Dadashri: You end up tying a knot; then will you not feel regret? Was it not good without a knot? Thereafter you let it continue with the knot the (hurt and strained relationship), that is not considered upayoga (applied awareness of the Self) at all, is it? The One who is in upayoga, will not even allow any knot to form. The one with upayoga would not have any tug of insistence (khencha). Khencha -tug of insistence- means adjustment is gone. Adjustment gone means, all done; finished. There is no problem if opinions are lifeless, without the tug of insistence; they will resolve faster. But the opinions, which are with the tug of insistence, can bring a veil over the Gnan (the Self). Ignorance arises on provocation Questioner: There are many such weaknesses, Dada. Many such weaknesses are lying within. Dadashri: No, it seems that way when everything is smooth externally, but you know when he (the ego) is provoked that the weaknesses are lying inside. One will appear smooth and soft from outside, when instigated a little then Questioner: Weaknesses will arise when provoked.

8 Dadashri: That is why the ignorance will arise. Filled stock of ignorance. Externally, there is the Gnan, but this ignorance arises. Questioner: Much repentance happens inside that what is all this? All this will not work. Dadashri: Therefore, proceed with caution. Upayoga is that which does not let the time of repentance to come. Yet if you miss, then do pratikraman (alochana: confession of one s mistake, pratikraman: asking for forgiveness, and pratyakhyan: firm resolve and determination never to repeat the mistake, and asking for the energy for the same). Questioner: Prakruti (the mind-body-speech complex) gets excited all of sudden. Dadashri: To see; the prakruti which gets excited suddenly is called upayoga (applied awareness as the Self). You will not get such opportunity again. The opportunity that has come about now, such opportunity will not come again. Questioner: Yes. One binds insistence through ego Questioner: Am I harboring insistence, through my independence? Dadashri: The ego comes out there. One binds it through ego. It binds us. This path of ours-akram Vignan-is devoid of any tugs of insistence khencha. Overt insistence (aagraha) is the portrait of ego. We can understand the ego of other person through his overt insistence. Our path is devoid of insistence (niragrahi)! If someone says that, it is dark outside, then we say that, We are requesting, at least see again. Then he says, No, it is dark out there. So we know, how can we afford to stay with him until morning? We should walk away. From your view point it is correct, by saying this much, we leave. We were wrong, saying this we should walk away. Vitarag (absolutely devoid of attachment and abhorrence) path will not hurt anyone. We should walk ahead.

9 If one understands vyavasthit (scientific circumstantial evidences) completely, then the word insistence khencha does not exist at all! We should tell the other person, Do whatever suits you. We would take adjustment with him. Nothing will happen outside of vyavasthit. Tug of insistence which has spread in each and every corner Questioner: This that has happened is vyavasthit, this which happened is not outside of vyavasthit. Whatever happened is correct. We say like that but Dadashri: You do speak vyavasthit, but all the insistences are still lying within. How many insistences are there inside? Questioner: Dada, please explain about that mistake. Dadashri: All that would be lying hidden in the nooks. Questioner: Now, no tug of insistence remains, Dada. Dadashri: It may seem like that. Insistence is lying inside. Questioner: Dada, point out that mistake, which insistence is that so I can improve. Dadashri: Why would I show you everyday? Questioner: I would improve that mistake, Dada. Dadashri: No, improve it, can you not understand? If insistence persists then can you not understand that this insistence came back? He will see inside everything and check it out. Do see and investigate. Check in detail (nirikshan). Questioner: There is no other insistence, Dada. I have this inner intent (bhaav), that I want to stay constantly with Dada. There is insistence at home and I have come from home after taking permission. I have come here after taking approval from everybody at home. Dadashri: You do not have insistence, I know that too. But, even if you do not have any insistence but whatever it is, it will bother you, will it

10 not? Whatever happened is vyavasthit, that will never bother you; all this other will hurt you. The filled stock with which you are wandering, what can you gain in that? It will not let you do anything else. Insistence about serving Questioner: It does remain a little like that in the matter of doing service for Dada. Dadashri: The desire of serving must not remain at all. Whatever service seva you got, is your service and in that a hundred percent happiness will flow. And once the desire arises, it will become a fire. It is a terrible disease. Desire for what? Are we a beggar that we would beg from anyone? Questioner: Where is the feeling of beggary for doing service of the Gnani Purush? If we keep this for the Gnani Purush then there will not be any feeling of beggary, no? Dadashri: That is verily called beggary,that may be with Gnani Purush or whoever else, he is considered a beggar only. The prevailing happiness is lost, because of the beggary. One should not keep any kind of desire. Desire is a live fire. If desire arises then eradicate, along with its seed. And what seva one has to do for the Gnani Purush? And where does he need that seva at all? Questioner: But I have to do for me. Dada, You do not want service seva from anybody. Dadashri: But it is meaningless, isn t it? This is crazyness, a kind of madness! When you attain the vision of His grace that is called seva. Attain His grace. So when can you attain that grace? It will happen when You remain in Our Agnas. Questioner: This verily is the main thing. Dadashri: You do not have to remain in seva. You have to remain in Agnas. Service is to be done of your parents. Questioner: There is no inner pull or strong desire to serve the parents.

11 Dadashri: That is indeed crazy, isn t it? Such a person is considered a crazy person. One who does not understand the profound obligation of his parents is crazy. Therefore, parent s seva is first. Second number is Gnani s seva. Questioner: But what if one believes the Gnani to be everything, even more than his parents? Dadashri: A person who does not serve his parents, is not considered a human at all! First of all comes the service seva of parents, then comes the seva of the Gnani Purush or a guru. Then at the third rank the seva of God comes. Your relationship is with parents and guru, they are the ones who give you right understanding. Grace flows in when insistence leaves Questioner: So the one following the prompts of the mind, its cause is this insistence only! Dadashri: Yes. Insistence, all those tugs of insistence are very heavy. And insistence has caused you lots of harm. Otherwise how much grace would you have attained in just two years? We cannot say that there is no sincerity. But how many mistakes are there? You had to give medicine, but many times it happened that you would have forgotten to give medicine the whole day. So why these many mistakes still remain? I feel that may be your brain is little weak or what? May be, but if this insistence leaves then also it is good enough so you will receive grace and everything will settle. Grace will come about, will it not? And seva (service) is our account only. If it is our account then nobody will take it and if someone is there to take it then it is not ours. It is all vyavasthit. Is anybody doing insistence from here? Questioner: No. Dadashri: If it hurt inside then so be it, otherwise nothing. Questioner: But Dada, if everybody decides that I want to get my work of the Atma the Self done, and want to complete the understanding of this Gnan. However I decided that I want do only service of Dada. So then it continued according to that only.

12 Dadashri: That is enough; I want to get it done. But along with this you should understand what benefit you got from this, should you not? After two months, you should calculate the account, should you not? In benefit, Dada does not like your thing, then you would believe that Dada s grace is not upon you. You would think that Dada does not keep it on you intentionally. Then you will be at fault. Then you have to do lot more pratikraman. You have to do lots of pratikraman of Dada. Now if you look at that fault then how many faults will happen? This is the understanding of the self the ego intellect complex. The fault will be there due to lack of understanding. These are not done intentionally or knowingly. But that fault will definitely give fruit (result), will it not? We say that, Brother, such thing is not in us, and then he would believe. But again he would go on the original nature (of seeing faults), would he not? Questioner: Even then one thing had been fixed that whatever Dada does it is for my benefit. That is fixed. Dadashri: You say that this is fixed. That is true. That is why you stayed otherwise you would not have stayed. That much has fitted, that whatever He (Dada) does it is to my benefit, that much had been fitted. Oh, from where can one get this favorable circumstance at all? Questioner: One cannot get it. Dadashri: Can one get such favorable circumstance by spending money, by spending a lot of money? Questioner: No, one will not get that at all. Dadashri: What does Niruben say? Even if You were to kill me, even then I will not leave. What is the benefit in dying like that? Questioner: Now only two things remain here. Either Dada or death, I do not want any third thing other than these two. Dadashri: What is the problem even if a third thing comes? Unyielding grips in matters of relative truth

13 There is no such thing as the truth (satya) in this relative world. The sat is eternal (avinashi). There is no other sat. Everything else is relative intent (sapeksha bhaav). And yet look how people hang on to it with unyielding grip of obstinacy! So how is this truth? It is relative truth. That which is truth at 5 or 50 minutes, will become wrong at 60 minutes. Therefore, do not hold on to these things. Do not be inflexible and obstinate in any of this. Use whatever kind of water you have to in order to cook the beans. Ultimately you may even have to use the water from the gutter. So use whatever kind of water you have to cook the beans and take care of your work. It should not hurt anyone, one should not have anyintent of hurting anyone; one should get his work done. Why insist on truth-untruth? It is also wrong (asatya) to hang on to the truth (satya). To hang on to the truth s tail (insist on the truth) is in itself untruth (asatya). To become insistent is to ruin everything. People take a beating by hanging on to the tail of the truth, just as they hang on to a donkey s tail. They will take a beating from the kicks but they will not let go of the tail. They will insist I will not let go, no matter what. Whereas we do not have any grasping of anything (graha) or persistence of insistence (aagraha). There is not the slightest insistence of it has to be this way in any matter, not even for a second. Not even for a second will we say, this is right, this is true. There is not the slightest insistence of even This Gnan has manifest. If you say, that is incorrect, even then there is no insistence on our part. Whatever comes through your vision (drashti) is correct. If you do not encounter any separation with anyone due to difference of opinion (matabheda) anywhere, then know that You are on the right path. And where there is separation due to differences of opinions, know that your path is not clear yet. You still have to carve your road through the mountains; you will have to remove big rocks that come your way, otherwise you are bound to crash into them if they are lying in your path.

14 If someone outside of our satsang insults you and degrades you, you will get drawn in into a confrontation. If he instigates you into a confrontation with him (jakka), you will even become obstinately confrontational. Once you enter into obstinate confrontations; which inevitably becomes an interaction of animosity (chadasey chadhavu), you become completely immersed by illusion (mithyatva). Then the applied awareness as and of the Self (upayoga) is gone. All this will serve to spread the illusion even further. This is a grave disease. You should not be rigid or adamant about right and wrong if you are to sustain that relationship. Rigidity will destroy the relationship. When the other person is trying to destroy the relation, you should mend it if you want to maintain that relationship. These are all temporary relations. For example if your wife says, Tonight there is a full moon and you say, No, it is a moonless night, then the bickering will start and it will last all night. In the morning she will be sulking and you will know that the argument is not over when she deliberately bangs the cup of tea while serving you. Instead it is better if you understand the situation when she becomes adamant. Gently turn the argument around by pretending to consult a horoscope calendar and then telling her she is right that there will be a full moon tonight. If you don t do this, the argument will get out of control and then if you were to give in suddenly, she will fall harder and you will have to bear the consequences. Instead it is better to beware from the start and let go gently. An objection leads to a binding reaction Is there still some insistence or has it decreased? Questioner: The insistence on the part of prakruti (mind-speech-body complex) does not work in front of this science vignan. Dadashri: It does not work, does it? It will not work, will it? One holds on to insistence and becomes stupid. You had so much insistence, now it is gone. You were not letting go of that string at all. You had to let go off it in the middle, didn t you? Questioner: This insistence left through one sentence of yours Dada. Chandubhai said in satsang that I have understood this way, I have understood this way, so then You said that, What objection do You-We (the awakened Ones) have? Then it flashed for Me that from hereon if there

15 is any objection, then I lost my ticket to liberation. Why should I harbor any objection? If there is no objection, then its fine, and if there is an objection then I have lost my ticket. Dadashri: Objection and problem must not be there at all. Even if he (Chandubhai) is speaking really trashy stuff and lies; why should it bother you? Questioner: What objection do you have, means What objection Shuddhatma pure Soul has? Dadashri: No. But what objection and problem is it for You? One thing is that he is a Shuddhatma and whatever that poor fellow is speaking, that is dependent on unfolding of his karma. He does not have control in that. Now what problem do You have in that? He has no control on us, so therefore, where is the problem? And You have become free from any objection (vandha). Objection and the resultant ego reaction which binds (vandha-vachaka), that is not Your business at all anymore. If it is absolutely correct even then what objection do You have? If there is an objection then there is reaction, no? We placed these words objectionreaction which binds within (vandha-vachka) in religion. Otherwise these exist in relative worldly interaction. If one knows that in the worldly life interaction it is a relation (relative) then one can get solution. But if one believes that relation as real then insistence will remain. In a relation, that is relative, one does not have to say mine is correct. Resolve the matter by simply by saying, take it, you are right. The moment one becomes obstinate, fight starts Where is the need to see anything else at all? It is in Our awareness that this one is Shuddhatma. At this time, he is as a file for me. I have to understand what do I have to do with a file. We have two views, by real view point he is flawless (nirdosh), by relative view point he is flawless, and then, this is a file, settle with equanimity. What else? Now he will not report a claim on my name anywhere. Otherwise, If we go there and he would make an objection (vandho). And once he objects (vandho), the binding reaction (vachako) will arise. Once there is vachako, karma is bound. When the objection escalates to a binding reaction, karma is bound.there is no

16 problem with objection, but there should not be any vachako (binding reaction of the ego). Questioner: There should not be any vachako, what does it mean, please explain a little. Dadashri: There is no problem for objection, when will the vachako arise? It will, if we hold on to that objection. If he declares his objection openly (vandho), then we check and let it go. We know that his vision is verily wrong and if we hang on to it then, we, on the contrary will appear stupid. And if his vision is right then we should say, Brother, this is how it is, then we would turn him right. He will be always ready to understand. Now if there is a problem of chotham (lunar fourth day of the moon) and pancham (lunar fifth day of the moon), for that we can say that the one saying chotham is also correct and the one saying pancham is also correct then both of them will let us go. They will say, Go ahead. You are correct from your view point (to the one saying today is chotham) and you are correct from your view point (to the one saying today is pancham), and Lord Mahavir s view point is different. We should walk away by saying so. Lord Mahavir is trying to say something clearly different. There is no mistake like holding on to insistence in this world. When vandho (objection) results in insistence, then it is called vachako. That is why Kavi sang; Kavi has sung something, has he not? Questioner: Vandha ne vachaka sahu, agnan manyatao aene didhi oodaavi. He The Gnani Purush dissipated all the objections and their insistence and ignorant beliefs. Dadashri: He would remove objections, insistent reactions and ignorance beliefs. Pure is the result. Have I taken anything else out from you? Our mahatmas do not have any objection in anything. They would settle with equanimity. Keep only one goal that I want to know Atma (the Self). Do not become insistent and willful about I want to do this and I want to do that. Whatever happened at whatever time, is correct.

17 Insistence of scriptural knowledge People say that we understood these scriptures. That means they knew all these. So someone who knew this went to him and says to him, Sir, please explain to us. Then what can he explain? Questioner: One has to do everything over there, no? Do this and do that. You are not doing like this and you are not doing like that and do like this. We had heard only such language. Dadashri: If he can explain to one person then I say that he has understood. All these people, who are scriptural scholars; if one of them can make only one outsider person understand, then I would say that you are right. Your education is right. He would have insistence for his knowledge only. He will not be concerned about the other person s knowledge and he will have insistence for his own knowledge. However, we would know about that other person s knowledge. We would not have any insistence. We do not have insistence for our knowledge. About his education, what he has studied and what he has not, we adjust to the other person. No matter who that outside person is or what religion he follows, we adjust to him. We would have adjustment only and he definitely would get benefit. Burden increases when intellect makes one insistence in talks We have concern with the one speaks what we like. Questioner: I asked my father to come and do the darshan (of the Gnani) whereupon he started speaking inappropriately. Dadashri: So you should keep a little silence. You should not bring him here so often. Questioner: Since we have so much love for Dada, we would feel bad, would we not? Dadashri: Yes, but instead of feeling bad, if you remain silent then it is better that he will not do like this again. So you should not give such opportunity to him. If he comes here, then he will think about speaking wrong, will he not? If we speak good about Dada then he will talk reverse

18 (negative), so you should not talk about Dada at all. So if you hold on to your insistence that our Dada is like this, then he will have more grip on his insistence. You should not say so. This path of ours is not of competition. This is a moksha marg (path of liberation). Everywhere in the world, there is a path of competition. Everybody s path is different and this path is different. You should not weigh (use intellect and enter into) talk and words. The one who tries to weigh, gets caught. Talks are just the talks; it does not happen as per talks. These cows and buffalos also talk, they do not have any insistence that why it is like this? Questioner: I do not speak at all without any reason. Dadashri: He does not know what fruit he will get. That is why we are telling people not to come in close contact; they should not come in close contact excessively. People would have lost the balance of their brain, so they would speak negative. They would have lost the balance of the brain or not? Had you seen? Questioner: Before Gnan. They would be everywhere. Dadashri: They take the beating from the worldly life (sansar); even then they would not leave their insistence. They are taking beating on the basis of past life s sins, and even while suffering pain they create new pain. So the man who is suffering pain creates (binds) more pain only. And the one who is a suffering pleasure creates and binds pleasure only. The one who is following the path of God will keep one kind of fear; there we have to keep upeksha (ignore without aversion). Worldly life means interference of intellect People are bound through this unyielding insistence (pakkad) only. That insistence verily binds them. This is right and this is wrong. They got engrossed in that! However that was verily there, was that not? This is the display of intellect. And whatever happened is justice, then that is called absence of intellect.

19 Do you still want to look for justice? Previously you were looking for justice; you had the need for the court and the lawyers, did you not? Now, after attaining Gnan, do you have to look for justice? Simply, whatever the account was, that verily got paid off, did it not? If any conversation matter (with different view points) extends longer than two minutes, then God moves away from there. God will go away the moment the talk gets teased and jumbled up. There is no problem in doing conversation but one should not insist on it. Burden increases when one becomes insistent. Otherwise how is our worldly interaction (vyavahar)? You cannot even speak like this with me, not even a one letter. Questioner: Only this person had said. Dadashri: But all those are our wrong feelings; useless feelings. One cannot become insistent at any place then how can he become insistent in front of the Gnani? With other person, if I become obstinate with this person then it is our mistake. If I become obstinate then it is my mistake. Questioner: Dada, the talk of letting go of the insistence is all right, now. Dada says so Dadashri: I tell him that, You have to do this way, yet he will not do. Again I request, brother, it would be better if you do this way. If he does not do then it is our mistake. Whose mistake is it? I do think that I am maintaing this with this big organization and finishing all the projects. What is the reason for that? It is because I did not hang onto any insistence whatsoever. One becomes insistent and that is a mistake and the hurt is because of that. And the intellect makes one insistent and crazy. People would laugh, behind the back then, would they laugh or not? Questioner: They would laugh. Dadashri: Would people not laugh behind our back? Last year he was holding on to his insistence, he too was holding on to his insistence. They had become insistent that is verily why they look bad. Now you will not become insistent, will you? We do not have insistence. Gnani s, the path of Lord Mahavir is the path without insistence! Not one divisiveness due to

20 differences of opinions (matabheda) with so many people. Not one matabheda, not with anyone. And we are more delicate than even a little child. If a child says, Do it this way, then we understand right away that it is correct. This child is saying right. And the adult one who is insistent, is considered one kind of darkness (ignorance) only. It is one kind of love, but it is called a crazy love. What do you think? That person is so persistent; tremendously so. Slowly and slowly the insistence was whittled away through polishing the rough edges of insistence. One has to smoothen the roughness and become free from insistence, no? Much of the insistence is gone; otherwise he would not have allowed me to take a bath today. Questioner: No, but I did not speak, Dada. Dadashri: Yes, you did not speak. I was seeing only that, what is he saying? This one here also used to harbor insistence, but she also understood. Path of liberation gets obstructed by inflexible insistence One cannot speak one word (letter). It is a mistake the moment one speaks. One cannot give advice at all. O ho ho! Are you giving advice to the one through whom you attained moksha? And we would be dependent on karma. We are dependent on unfolding of karma. We would not eat that at all. I do not eat anything at all. If she says not to eat sugar (saakar), so then what will she ask me to renounce? Questioner: Dada, I had not insisted, I had just requested. Dadashri: Yes. You did request but now this insistence. Now if you become insistent then the path further will get obstructed. Progress stops and looks bad. You should immediately let go. If that person says, No brother, it is like this, if he is stuck, then you should let go. And whatever vyavasthit (scientific circumstantial evidence) will be there, then only it will leave at that time, will it not? And if vyavasthit is with insistence then he will have to give it up after taking a lot of beating. rather giving up with lots of difficulty! And you should not have any insistence in front of the Gnani Purush, or not even with these people. Not only no insistence with this person, once

21 you became insistent, you became like him. Who you became like? If you become insistent with me then you cannot become like me, there you will look bad. So all that will happen. Now you do such thing that it all gets settled. Your heart is very good, but do you need something or not! He is saying, I was the one who had asked him to hold onto insistence. No, so you cannot become obstinate with me. I will help you to become free from insistence at every other place. Once you got stuck, that very insistence (graha) created obstruction and the very same graha would have grabbed you. Not outsider is obstructing you. These grahas tugs of insistence hinder us. Do we the Gnani Purush have unyielding insistence at any place? We do not have any divisiveness due to differences of opinion (matabheda) at all! This is because the moment insistence happens, we understand that the vyavasthit is pulling on that side. Very stubborn and inflexible ego Questioner: Everyone does have insistence for his own religious events, that I want to celebrate Mahavir Jayanti. But when Krishna Jayanti comes, he does not have the same intent (bhav) for celebrating Krishna Jayanti. Dadashri: But the insistence there is of the pudgal (mind-speech-body complex), the Self is separate. Questioner: So Dada, the clash happens to me, this very same clash happens with my father. Dadashri: No but your s is a rarity, one in a hundred people. Everything is not like this. All these others are clear, all these people are clear. Absolutely clear, straightforward (sarad). You are not considered sarad. So it may be with some person. He would not be a person who would turn if we try to turn him, on the contrary he would turn the one who tries to turn him. Questioner: It is exact, Dada. I would turn the one who tries to turn (change) me. Dadashri: Yes, so you are a very difficult person, are you not? And all these other poor people would turn if we ask them to. Sooner or later they would turn.

22 Now if you want to have a next life of a woman, if you are interested in wearing sari then do like this. Then he says, No, I am not interested. I do not want to wear a sari. Then I said, Be careful. Would anyone have interest in wearing sari? Someone may feel like wearing, but all will not have that interest. Questioner: He would turn if someone turns him. What causes must he have laid down in previous life, on the basis of which his situation is like this right now? Dadashri: I am intelligent, and all these people are like this. Out of all these people, you would not listen to anyone. So you became inflexible. So then you will not turn. Not only will you not fit in anyone s account, but you will also turn the one who tries to turn you. Insistence is wrong, both in the relative and for the real Questioner: Dada, It comes to my observation that, the one who tries to turn (change) verily, is not turning. Chandu sees such a way that we would give the entire ready balance-sheet to the one who tries to turn and say that, there is this much loss and this much profit by doing this. This much is like this. And yet that other person holds on to his own viewpoint. Dadashri: One should not be unyielding and insistent (pakkad pakadavi). And if you do then when can you finish with this person? If you want to do according to your will then go ahead and be insistent. Otherwise you will have to take the beating with this person. In vyavahar worldly interaction the one who becomes obstinate wins. That is his safe side. Questioner: No, so, safe side, perhaps it may be for one s own ego, otherwise I do not see any safe side in relative. Because the entire Dadashri: No, safe side! You are totally going on the wrong path. Everything, a hundred percent yours is wrong over there. Questioner: So, is entire thing wrong in vyavahar (worldly interaction) too?

23 Dadashri: It is wrong in vyavahar (relative) too, and it is wrong in nischaya (real). In vyavahar, everybody would think and get fed up with you saying why is this person creating problems? Questioner: Dada, I got that point quite well a while ago. It makes the entire worldly interaction look bad. Once the worldly interaction vyavahar rots, then one loses the nischaya, the Self too. The limit of the limited intellect Dadashri: Gnani does not have insistence of any kind. We explain and yet if he does not understand then we say, it is your vision (drashti), yours is correct, we would walk away after saying so. Why would we sit along with him the whole night? It will not end if we wait with him. This is because the Self (Atma), is not such that it can explained. To understand this Self is not an easy thing for a person. And however many people talk about it, all that is verily a mixture (bhel) of the Atma. Bhel Atma (mixture Soul) means, what price do you get bhel (a dish made up of mixing different snacks and spicy and sweet chutney) here? The bhel that we eat, is sold at twelve-fifteen rupees, And the price of that Atma (Soul) is fifteen rupees! How is the Self? Atma is parmatma the absolute Self. Yes, when intellect ends then can one understand the Self. Otherwise one cannot understand, can one? Intellect will create interference (dakho). Intellect is limited. Do you know of anyone who has found the Self? Anyone? Questioner: I haven t tried that I can experience that. Dadashri: No, so if one makes an effort even then it is not possible. Wherever you go, you will come back wandering around. Atma is not such a thing which you can get it in your hand (attain). Atma is not in the form of Veda, it is not in the form of a book, it is not in the form of a scripture. The real form of Atma is beyond Veda-scripture-word. A human being does not have the capacity. So however many people say, many people in Hindustan say that we have realized the Atma (the Self). In that, on just a little provocation we can know that what kind of Atma he has realized! What will he do if you provoke him? Questioner: He will become angry.

24 Dadashri: He will become angry. It is when the ego destroys completely, intellect destroys completely, then, one can get Atma in his hand (realize the Self). It is not easy (ladva khavana khel nathi). Therefore, there is no problem in reading this book (a special book of a previous Gnani Purush). But while you are reading the book, if you do not understand any part, then underline it. And you should not believe from your side that this is like this only. This is because a human being does not have the capacity for this, in this. Therefore, there is no problem in underlining it. You should leave it that way and later the solutions can be received. Otherwise, human beings do not have the capacity. This book is not like other books. Some people say that ours is correct then we would say that is correct. We do not have problem saying that is correct. But if he wants to understand it right then we would tell him to wait a little longer. Otherwise if he says that it is correct then we would say that it is correct. Yours is correct and we would walk away. Why would we wait there? There is no end to it. Therefore in the matter of understanding the Self, it is not worth in just believing. I just tell you that all these are wrong beliefs. All are wrong beliefs related to Atma (the Self). Still people have not understood even religion. What is religion? They have not understood that. The seat of the Self is free from any beatings Questioner: You talked about Mahatma Gandhi, Hitler; they lived in the ocean of life. The life is verily vyavasthit. Vyavasthit comes. Then again, why do we have to think about that? The birth of Hitler, happening of a war, happening of Mahatma Gandhi s birth, happening of that over that, that Mahatma is not a cause, Hitler is not a cause, vyavasthit is the cause. Dadashri: That is the main reason, if we want to talk in the relative terms.. Questioner: Drama, right, whatever drama is happening, what you are trying to say is right. Dadashri: We have to talk in the drama, don t we? However the main cause is vyavasthit. Why it is called vyavasthit, it is because no living being has any controlling authority (satta) at all. All that realm and authority (satta) is of vyavasthit only. One sees the nimit (evidentiary doer) that Hitler became like this, that is how we have to speak in vyavahar (worldly interaction).

25 Questioner: Otherwise one will not understand. Dadashri: Yes, otherwise how can one understand? Questioner: On one side we are saying it is vyavasthit. On one side it comes into effect from previous life. Desires of previous life come into effect in this life. Therefore vyavasthit kept the account of desires of previous life in vyavasthit and that vyavasthit will keep the account of desires of this life in vyavasthit. And then it will come in the next life, is that so? Dadashri: Both are dependent on vyavasthit. As long as you keep insisting that I am something, then take the beating. And with I am Shuddhatma pure Soul the beating stops, says vyavasthit. I am something, as long as there is the divisive intellect (bheda buddhi), take the beating, it says. And it is false assertion, (aropit bhaav). Divisive intellect means false assertion. I am Chandu, that is divisive intellect. And I am Shuddhatma means no reason for any beating. Thereafter you do not have to take the beating. If one takes the beating, (after attaing the Self in Akram) it is because of one s weakness in understanding. There is absolutely no beating to be taken at all. Thereafter absolute vitaragata (absolutely devoid of attachment and abhorrence) can remain. But there is the mind inside, that mind tends to entangle. At that time stillness is needed. In the state of the Self insistence leaves No one can refrain from showing his nature. Until one becomes the Self, the nature of the Self cannot seen. Only the non-self (pudgal) nature will be evident. Questioner: So if one becomes the Self (Atma swaroop) only then the nature of the Self (Atma-swabhav) is evident. Dadashri: This pudgal swabhaav non-self nature ends and it becomes like the nature of the Self. When it imitates the Self exactly then it is considered completion (purnahuti). Questioner: So the self will imitate the Self, exactly that?

26 Dadashri: Hum, on this side this one will also appear Atma and this one also will appear like Atma. Questioner: So the original Atma (original Self) will appear and the self will become like the Self? Dadashri: Yes, I made you free from unyielding insistence (aagraha), that biggest insistence (khencha). Were they not happening? Questioner: Unyielding overt insistence (aagraha) and the inner tugs of insistence (khencha). Dadashri: Yes, we do not want insistence of any kind. Questioner: Like the image of the original Soul, so is it like gnanright knowledge, darshan- right vision, charitra- right conduct? Dadashri: There is gnan-darshan-charitra (right knowledge-right vision-right conduct) and tapa (right penance), similarly gnan-darshancharitra-tapa will be here in worldly interaction (vyavahar). There everything would be ideal. There would not be any obstinacy-insistence, no storm, no pain, and no bhanjghad destruction-repair of anything. Questioner: But this vyavahar (worldly interaction) means, it is pudgal the non-self only, no? So then pudgal will touch which pudgal? So all the imitations of pudgal are finished, all the nature of pudgal is finished and again Dadashri: This is my pudgal, is this pudgal not superior to yours? By rising higher and higher, when my four degree deficiency dissipates then the state will look like a God. My conduct everything; even this body will become a God (Bhagwan). The physical body of Tirthankaras also had become God. That is why these people out there would agree, would they not? Questioner: So inside means, this body is as it only; does the middle part change? Body remained the same; in which matter, on which side does the change in the four degrees happen?

27 Dadashri: People see the weakness in this physical body complex on the basis of these four degrees only. This attire, this other thing, this ring, this combed hair, this food and all that, all these are obvious, are they not? All these will not be evident. Disrespect of Gnani is a great danger You cannot say something that will not make him understand.. How much money he spends for the tickets for transportation to come here and sits in front of you with reverence. He has come to understand only. Thereafter you cannot speak that which he can not comprehend. Questioner: I understand and other person does not understand, is there such ego in that, Dada? Dadashri: Such ego may be there or may not be there, but this is not becoming of you. Worldly interaction should be beautiful. We never had divisiveness due to differences in opinion (matabheda) with anyone in twelve years. I must have met almost a hundred thousand people. But I did not have matabheda with anyone. Questioner: No matter how many questions one asks Dada, some one may try to insult Dada or ask questions which are inappropriate, even then Dada has the same mukta hasya (liberating laughter). Dadashri: No, never. I would not have the slightest scorn for him. Questioner: On the contrary you would tell him, you cannot understand? Let me help you. Dada does not leave him until he gets solution, and until his kashaya leaves. He would make Dada sit until twelve midnight. He will take the solution then only Dada will let him go. Dadashri: No, it is not his responsibility, it is Gnani s responsibility. That poor fellow lacks understanding, he may speak anything. Gnani cannot speak. Many good talks came about, but finally he selected only one sentence. I said, Even if you show disrespect and lack of humility (avinaya) I will remain in vinaya humility only. Then he says, I agree with this talk very much. Hey brother, there were so many other very good talks here in