AIRMAIL 14 th May 1964

Transcription

1 JOEL JOFFE 2ND FLOOR, ATTORNEY PROVIDENT ASSURANCE HOUSE, cor. COMMISSIONER & SIMMONDS STREETS, JOEL GOODMAN JOFFE, B. COM., LL.B. JOHANNESBURG TELEPHONE P.O. BOX 6314 AIRMAIL 14 th May 1964 Messrs. Frank Bernadt and Joffe P.O. Box 252 CAPE TOWN Dear Sirs, I read a report in yesterday evening s Star to the effect that there is a trial carrying on in Cape Town in which 28 men and 2 women are being charged with furthering the aims of the A.N.C., and reference was made to a certain witness who had gone to Ethiopia for military training. The witness in question is obviously the same person who gave evidence in the Rivonia trial, and it occurred to me that the attorneys handling the Cape Town trial might be interested in what evidence he gave over here. For this reason, I am enclosing a copy of Counsel s notes relating to his evidence. In addition to him, the State have three other professional witnesses, all of whom have given evidence on various occasions and one, Essop Suliman has been disbelieved and discredited. The witness in question are:- (i) (ii) (iii) Essop Suliman Piet Coetzee Isaac Rani If you are aware of the name of the attorney handling the case in Cape Town, I would appreciate it if you would hand this letter to him, and tell him that if he requires any further information he can communicate with me direct. JJ/DM a.m. ALFRED JAANTJIES: Yours faithfully JOEL JOFFE. - C 7 -

2 I am 28 yrs old I am serving 2 yrs sentence imposed by Regional Magistrate on charge of leaving country without the necessary permit. Q. I wan to know why you left country come from Cape Town? Q. Do you belong to any organisation? A. Yes I was a member African Youth League. Q. For how long? A. I joined in Q. Did anybody approach you after you joined? Q. Who? A. Mr. Qunbella. Q. Who is he? A. Just a person. Q. Did he belong to any organisation. A. Yes to same org. as mine. Q. Did he make any requests to you. A. He asked how far I had got at school I had got to Std (?) Q. He made certain suggestions to you? Q. Did you give him a reply there and then? Q. As a result did you meet anyone else? A. You mean after he spoke to me? YUTAR: Yes WITNESS: Met Mgula. Q. Do you know his full names? Q. What did Mgula say to you? A. After we had been taken to him we were told schools would be open for those who want to study further. INTERPRETER: Ngundle is the name. WITNESS: We did not find N. but his wife not certain if it was his wife was at home. Q. Did you meet N? A. Next day. Q. What did he say? A. Are you the people. Q. How many were you? A. 3. He said we were going to JHB gave us money we to go to Bellvile he would book accommodation on train. Q. What were you going to JHB for? A. Spoke about school. Q. Did you have to make any contribution. A. No he gave the money. Q. What about money for schooling? A. N. said schooling was to be free.

3 - C 8 - Q. Did N. say what you had to wear in JHB? A. We were given black tie and black arm band Q. For what purpose? A. Because we did not know JHB on our arrival at JHB we would be recognized by a person. Q. Were you in mourning? A. We were not in mourning. Q. Who bought your ticket. A. N. bought tickets himself. Q. Were you given money? Q. What did he give you? A Q. And your ticket? A. He bought ticket. Q. Was place on train reserved? Q. In your name? A. Not in my name. Q. In what name? A. There were other names. Q. Your companions were seats in their names? A. No not in their real names. Q. Any reason why seats not booked in proper name? A. I never thought to ask why. Q. That you get the train at Belville? Q. Who saw you off? A. N. came before train had arrived he look at the names and by that way found Apartment and said that is your compartment. Q. Can you recall when that was? A. In June Q. Were there any precautions taken as to what to do at JHB if nobody arrived? A. He gave Goodman Mhlasiele an address. Q. Was G. one of the party? Q. What address was this? A. I remember asking him where we had to go if nobody arrived he said he had an address in Commissioner St. JHB. We had food for road and cigarettes Q. What quantity? A. 30 Gold Dollar. Q. What happened in JHB. A. There was a person on train from whom we enquired how far near JHB we put on black bands. We were not met at the station. We went to one of the police on station and then engaged a taxi. Address was wrong and taxi took us to another address. Place was in Commissioner St. but lower down not that other place. Q. What was the number. A. I don t remember number in Commissioner St. Q. I don t mean first place, I mean second place. A. Commercial Trading Co. Q. Do you remember address?

4 - C 9 - Q. Is it in Commissioner St.? Q. Who went into store? A. Goodman and Isaac Rani. Q. Where did you remain. A. I stood in front of shop with our luggage. Q. Were you called in? Q. Went to? A. A basement. Q. Who did you see there? A. The people of the store appeared to be Indians. Q. Did you say what you were doing? A. Some spoke to them. As a result of what we told them they took steps somebody arrived he spoke to us a white man he was not there when we arrived. He came after we had spoken to Indian. Q. Will you be able to identify White man? A. I am not certain. Q. Did you speak to him? A. Not personally. Q. Look at Exh. D can you identify him? A. No I can t find him in D. Q. Did you hear his name at all? A. I heard name but I had no reason to remember name. White man spoke to Goodman. Q. As a result did anybody else come? A. Yes, a Bantu man. He explained to us that he was Kumalo he took us to Marabi Hotel all 3 of us. Q. Did you meet any other Bantu there? Q. How many? A. 7 from Port Elizabeth. Q. Did you make arrangements to pay hotel expenses? A. No person told woman she must give us all we required and payment would be made. Joe arrived later first time I met him got to know him as Joe Modise. Q. Do you remember what he said on first time? A. He asked where we came from we explained to him. Q. Anything else? A. I don t remember. We were not told where we were going to school. We did not know for what purpose we were in fact going. 7 Bantu from Port Elizabeth I will try to remember their names.

5 - C 10 - Macdonald M No. 22 Matthews Makarena 18 Ngebisile Mbaba 36 could not be Ncobo Jack Mzuzo 44 Maxwell Mayekiso 21 Ernest Malgas 19 Alfred Khoriza 15 Q. Any more? A. 4 from Durban I will try to remember their names. I only know him Bhengu No. 3 Matthews Makarena 18 Philemon (forget 2 nd name) 2 Eric I no him only by that name 33 Q. Did any Africans come from anywhere else? A. Yes 5 others. Q. From where? A. Bloemfontein I don t know their names. Q. What did 16 of you do? A. Just sat around. Q. For how long? A. 3 weeks. Q. Anybody give you instructions? Q. Did Joe Modise come there? Q. Anybody else come? Q. Who? A. I only knew him by name Mr. Elias. Q. Look in Court and see if you can find Mr. Elias 9 pointed out. Q. What did No. 9 and Modise do there during 3 weeks. A. Asked us if we had any complaints. Q. Anybody say why being held for 3 weeks? Q. Were you removed from Marabi Hotel? A. We went to location on one day and came back. Q. Did you play football at hotel? Q. Did you assemble as a football team? Q. Who said so? A. I don t know who said that we were not told we were a football team we were Told we must say so if we were asked. Q. Did you play football at Hotel? Q. Were you going to play football?

6 - C 11 - Q. Did you go to a wedding? We went to a wedding we went with Joe to a location in JHB. Q. Did you go to any wedding beyond Zeerust. Q. Did you go to any funeral? Q. Did you leave Marabi Hotel for good? We went to a white house. Q. What kind of white house? A. It is a flattish sort of bldg with an upstairs portion Q. Could you recognize photo of it? A. I am not able to recognize it because it was dark at time. Q. Who took you to house? A. Taken to house by No. 9. Q. Where were you placed? A. We were taken upstairs remained there no. of days we did not sleep or eat there. Q. Did you leave that place for good? A. Yes, after dark. Q. How did you leave? A. There were 2 Kombis and a van outside we got into van and drove off. Q. Do you know who driver was? A. Their name? Q. No race will do. A. They were coloured. Q. Both coloured? A. One was Indian. We were stopped on way by a traffic cop. Afterwards lights of van got into trouble. All I know is that van stopped. Somebody said van had to travel between Kombis because it had nolights. This was done. Q. How long did tip last? A. We travelled into place where there was a post we were told it was border It was at night I don t know whether before or after midnight. Q. What happened at this place? A. We stopped Mr. Joe came there He told us to pack luggage in one Kombi then we went on along a fence and took another road on foot We walked through bush as we were walking one youngster from Bloemfontein started crying until we reached Lobatsi about 5 a.m. COURT: Who showed you the way? A. Joe Modise. We were taken into house it was cold we sat down. Q. Did you have any school books etc.? A. Luggage including only clothing. Q. On whose instructions? A. We were just told to take clothes. We left Lobatsi same day.

7 - C 12 - Q. Who was in charge? A. Jack I don t know his other name. I heard Jack came from P.E. Johnny Makahetle also in charge said he came from Durban. Joe put them in charge of us I did not see them being given anything. We set off Lobatsi Jack bought tickets at station Joe Modise remained at Lobatsi Jack bought tickets for all of us. Tickets were to Palapye in Bechuanaland. Q. Where did you stay in Palapye? A. Nipho s house. Q. How far is that from Palapye station? A. A considerable distance I cannot say how far. We got from house to station by lorry. Q. On arrival at house how long did you stay there? A. We slept there for night house had no roof where we slept then we were divided up and taken to different places remained there for 3 days from there to Francistown by bus. Q. At Francistown were you met? A. No we did not arrive at F. we arrived at place one mile from F. We met people there. One of them had been in JHB it was Joe Modise he was with 2 others. Q. How long did you stay there? A. Not long. Q. Then? A. Joe Modise gave us money. Q. How much? A. Each one received 11. Q. For what purpose? A. In case we met with difficulties which could cause us to separate. We left this Place by lorry one lorry. Our destination was Masolose Hotel we slept there - next morning about 2 o clock people arrived from across the river. They enquired for people going to Buluwayo they spoke to those people (i.e. others who were now in charge) names were Eric and Molooi. There were 30 in the party. After these people had spoken to our leaders we crossed the river found 2 vans we got in travelled to Buluwayo. We arrived at Revy Station. Q. Any instructions as to what to do station? Q. Who? A. Molooi. Q. What happened at Buluwayo station. A. I was in van which arrived first at time of our arrival our train was leaving we were as a result requested to sleep at station we were told by police that we could not sleep without tickets. One of us found accommodation at Hotel next morning we went to another station and caught train to Lusaka we were still one group of 30. Q. Who paid for tickets to Lusaka? A. Molooi bought tickets.

8 - C 13 - Q. Were you met at Lusaka? A. Yes we joined Jack and Makatini there. We sat in waiting room they left to find transport a van (small) was found we tried to get all of us in but we could not. We came back and slept again at Lusaka. Next day they found a big lorry which took us to border of Tanganyika and Rhodesia. I can t say how long it took - several days though. Lorry stopped at a place where there was a church we got off there people Who were escorting us spoke to others. A person wearing waterproof boots Came with them he took us across border on foot. Q. For how long did you go on foot? A. We walked through day but not a full day. We arrived at Tunduma we arrived at offices of UNIP. Q. Do you know what UNIP stands for? (ADJOURNMENT) COAKER RENEWS APPLICATION BY J. KANTOR FOR BAIL (GRANTED) JAANTJIES Q. How long did you stay at T? A. Just one night next day we left after lunch to Mbeye same group we went in a Police vehicle. From there to Dar-es-Salaam. On arrival there we got off one of escorts went to fetch people who were going to take us there. Q. Who arrived? A. Mrs. Xabaniso a nurse. Q. Anybody else arrive? A. A Kombi came to take us away we were not all taken to same place. I did not Go. We were taken to another place and next day brought together at nurse X s place. Q. How long did you stay there? A. I think 3 weeks. We went to Nairobi. Q. Did you see A.N.C. offices at Dar-es-Salaam? After we had been there for a while we met Mr. Tambo Oliver Tambo James Radebe and Denis Makiwane (when we were already at nurse X s place). Q. We have surname right what is First name. A. Denis or Tennyson. We were in Dar-es-Salaam for 3 weeks. Q. What did O.T. have to say? A. Nothing that he said. Q. And James Radebe? A. No, he also said nothing to us.

9 - C 14 - We did not know ultimate destination or for what purpose. THEN went to Nairobi. We were told we were leaving and we have left by bus. We arrived at Nairobi. Q. Who did you meet there? A. 5 others. Q. Who were they? A. Edmund Fazi (no. 7). Q. Other four. A. One was Thami I only know that one name and Zoni, Dzanani and Magalo (item 39). Q. How long at Nairobi? A. Can t say how long- a few days. Q. Then a person arrived there by plane? A. James Chirwa. Then we all came together. Passports were arranged for us then we left Nairobi By plane for Ethipio Da-bra-seur. YUTAR: I want you to leave yourself on your own tell all you can remember when you Landed etc. A. We got off plane we met the Captain Captain Marmo we were put into Kombi taken to a camp. Q. What sort of camp. A. Soldiers camp. They pointed out places where we were to stay gave us clothes to wear taught us how to drill. Q. Did you see soldiers there? Q. How many? A. Many. Q. What sort of clothing? A. Khaki trousers, shirt, 2 prs boots 2 blankets, two bedsheets 1 pillow and a bottle. Q. What kind of bottle? A. Special bottle for water with covering over it. Bottle attached to belt round body. Q. What about protection against the sun? A. You mean to wear? Q. Yes. A. A steel helmet. Q. What about name. A. Name was changed. Q. To what? A. To Apiri Q. Were your companions called by original names? Q. Any reference to payment? A. We got pay in camp. Q. Were you told before? A. Yes in camp. Q. Who told you? A. The Captain came there with somebody else. Q. In plain clothes? A. Uniform.

10 - C 15 - A. How were soldiers dressed at camp? Q. Khaki clothing. A. Plain clothes? Q. NO soldiers clothes. A. What was your payment? Q. 45 dollars per month. Q. What kind of drill? A. On foot. Q. For how many days? A. 2 weeks. Q. Then after that? A. Then taught how to handle rifles. Q. Any further detail about handling rifles? A. To shoot with them. Q. Did you do shooting yourself? A. Yes I also shot. Q. You and your group? Q. For how long did rifle practice continue? A. Altogether for 3 months for quite a long time we handled firearms. Q. Only rifles? A. Different types? Q. Types of what? A. Hand grenades we were shown how machine guns work and others. Q. Can you give us others? A. Carbines and Bar Bar Pistols.45 and others that I have forgotten. Q. What other things did you receive there try and cast your mind back and tell us what else you did? A. We were taught First Aid taught to swim how to walk in bushy areas YUTAR: Fieldwork? A. We were taught practical work taken into bush and left there to find our way Back by aid of map. We were given ropes which we had to climb. Q. Is that all you did to ropes? A. Something else also also to go down a place by way of a rope. YUTAR: WITNESS: Take your time, don t rush. Also to do sketch drawings also yow to read a map might be something else I have forgotten. Q. Do you know what a radio is? A. Yes we were taught to speak over radios also radios (but not all the same) taught to operate them to speak to somebody else also on radio. Q. Do you know what target is? A. I do. Q. What can you tell us about targets? A. We were taught if we want to operate from one place to another taught the Degrees i.e. work out how many degrees between objects and target.

11 - C 16 - Q. If things in way and wanted to get of way were you taught about that? A. What do you mean? Q. Do you know what bridges are? A. Yes to destroy them. Q. How? A. By demolition. Q. Tell us all you were taught about demolition. A. We were taught how to destroy bridges. Q. How were you taught that? A. Small pockets of material called TNT. Q. Tell us about it? A. Connected to safety fuse lit up safety fuse that would explode. Q. With what result. A. There was no bridge blow up but we were taught how to do it. Q. Was TNT only substance? A. Also taught about mine bombs. Q. What about mine bombs. A. How to find them if situated at certain places. Q. Anything else? A. Ambush. Q. What can you tell us about ambush? A. That is also in way of destroying something. Q. Can you recall any particular type of bombs? A. I have forgotten some of them. Q. What were bombs used for? A. To blow up things. Q. Do you know what boob trap is? Q. What is booby trap? A. Walk along nothing cause you to be suspicious then it can injure you. Q. Who taught you that. A. In Ethiopia. Q. Do you know road block. A. Yes- we were taught that. Q. What is a road block. A. To block a motor car to stop is using road. COURT: How did you do that? A. By way of demolition. Q. Do you know what signals are? Q. What? A. By those you can indicate what is at different places. Q. Do you know what bayonet is? Q. What is it? A. It is put into front of rifle. Q. Any training in that? Q. Did you have one?

12 - C 17 - Q. Taught how to use it? Q. What is a bazooka? A. Another type of gun. Q. Were you taught use of that? Q. What were you taught there? A. If you want to fire at long distance object you use it. Q. Did you know any of these things before you went to the school? We were 3 mnths at school every day. Q. Who taught you? A. The Lieutenants. Q. Only Lieutenants? A. And Captains. Q. Anybody else? A. Other soldiers. When we completed course we were taken to town clothes were bought for us - after that back to Dar-es-Salaam by plane we stayed at Dar-es Salaam. Q. While at Dar-es-Salaam did you meet anybody? A. YES Eric James Radebe and others. Q. Any reports made to you apropos schooling you received? A. No not at Dar-es-Salaam. Q. Any reference to your conduct. Q. Who told you? A. James Radebe. Q. What did he say? A. That we behaved very well. On upward journey we met O.T. also when we came back at Dar-es-Salaam - he spoke to us. Q. What did he say? A. We must fix up luggage we were going to Palopye we were given 15. Q. Were you given any instructions as to what you should say about time in Ethiopia if approached? A. You mean if we were asked by people from here? YUTAR: Yes. A. We must not tell the truth. Q. Who told you that? A. Ambrose Makwane. Q. Anyone else? A. He was the only one who told us that. Q. What did you have to say about Ethiopia? A. I would not have told him, because I was told not to tell. Q. Training at military camp what were you to do with it? A. I was not told at Dar-es-Salaam.

13 - C 18 - Q. Were you told anywhere else? A. In Ethiopia person training us told us that each of us must go and teach 15 other people. Q. Where? A. When we arrived back at our homes. Q. From Dar-es-Salaam where di you go? A. Back to Mbeya, funduma, Lusaka and on our way from there we were caught at Buluwayo. COURT: Whole 30 of you? A. We were only 9 in batch at time. The rest were left behind at Dar-es-Salaam. We were arrested by police in Buluwayo handed over to S.A.P. There was found on me a passport and a sketch. Q. Is Exh. CC the actual sketch or copy? A. It is copy. Sketch was given to us when we were taken into veld then we were given compass and told to find way back. I succeeded with sketch and compass. Only passport and sketch found on me. Passport put in Exh. DD. Q. Any other documents attached to passport? Q. Such as what? A. Papers received when we were injected for yellow fever and other documents (Exh. DD) YUTAR: Shows photo which is enlargement of photo found by police do you recognize That? COURT: Where was it taken? A. In Ethiopia after we had completed our training. After clothes were bought. Persons on photo from back row left to right. 1. Sandile Ngalo (39) Bhengu (3) 3. Matthews Makalina (13) 4. Alfred Jaantjies (myself) (13) 5. Philemon (don t know other name) (2) 6. Henri Fazzie (7) 7. Alfred Khonza (15) 8. Janani (don t know other name) (9) 9. Mganisela (36) 10. Macdonald Marsala (2 nd last on top) (22) 11. James Chirwa (last on top) (4) Front row: 1. Zoni only name I know him by also called him Saydi (could be Sazi) (42) 2. Isaac Rani (46) 3. Ernest Malgas (19) 4. Jack Mzuza (with glasses (38) 5. Gangi Hnekani (11) 6. One with heavy jacket and glasses is known to me as Thami nd last is Matthews Ngo (43) 8. Last one is Maxwell Mayekiso (21)

14 - C 19 - Q. Of these 19 how many returned with you and were arrested at Buluwayo? A. 9 including myself. Q. You said you were asked if you wanted to go to a school? Q. Did you go to school? Q. What sort of school were you to go to? A. A school to get educated. Q. Did you go to such a school? Q. If you had known about such a place as you went to would you have agreed? A. I think I would not have agreed to go. Q. You have been sentenced to 2 years who was sentenced with you? A. 9 of us were stenced COLLECTION NAME: Rivonia Trial Collection COLLECTION NUMBER: AD1844 ITEM NUMBER: Bb2 DOCUMENT: State witnesses:: Letter addressed to Messrs. Frank Bernadt and Joffe with attached Council's notes LEGAL NOTICES This document is part of a private collection, the Rivonia Trial Collection, donated to Historical Papers at The University of the Witwatersrand, Johannesburg. Copyright Notice: All materials on the Historical Papers website are protected by South African copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, displayed, or otherwise published in any format, without the prior written permission of the copyright owner. Disclaimer and Terms of Use: Provided that you maintain all copyright and other notices contained therein, you may download material (one machine readable copy and one print copy per page) for your personal and/or educational non-commercial use only. Because of the possibility of human and mechanical error as well as other factors, the University is not responsible for any errors or omissions and excludes any and all liability for any errors in or omissions from the information on the website or any related information on third party websites accessible from this website.