MULTNOMAH COUNTY GRAND JURY DEATH INVESTIGATION

Transcription

1 0 0 MULTNOMAH COUNTY GRAND JURY DEATH INVESTIGATION Deceased: Terrell Kyreem Johnson ) Date of Incident: May 0, 0 ) DA No. Location: SE Flavel Street ) - Portland, Oregon ) Volume TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS BE IT REMEMBERED that the above-entitled transcript of GRAND JURY proceedings was heard, commencing at the hour of 0:00 a.m., on Wednesday, June, 0, at the Multnomah County Courthouse, Portland, Oregon. APPEARANCES Mr. Brian Davidson Deputy District Attorney On Behalf of the State of Oregon * * * COLLEEN R. MCCARTY, CSR, CRR, RPR Certified Shorthand Reporter Portland, Oregon

2 0 0 INDEX TO WITNESSES PAGE TODD GRADWAHL, 0 MEREDITH RIVERA BRENDALIS RIVERA SANCHEZ JACOB LEIKER TREVOR HIGGINS PAUL LEIKER STEVEN ALEXANDER JACOB HOWELL JULIE FRIESEN AARON CROSBY 0 WILLIAM MANGOLD AERIC ARNOLD

3 0 0 P R O C E E D I N G S Wednesday, June, 0 TODD GRADWAHL, a witness called on behalf of the State, having been first duly sworn, was examined and testified as follows: EXAMINATION BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. Go ahead and have a seat. And can you please state and spell your full name for us, please? A. My name is Todd, T-O-D-D; last name Gradwahl, G-R-A-D-W-A-H-L. Q. And how are you employed? A. I'm employed with the Portland Police Bureau. I'm a homicide detective. I've been with the police bureau for years. I've been a detective since 00, I believe. 00. Q. And during your time with the bureau, other than being a homicide detective, what other kinds of assignments have you had? A. Prior to the homicide unit, which I've been in for two years, I was a detective with the

4 0 0 gang enforcement team for approximately eight years. And prior to that I was an officer with the gang unit for ten years. And then prior to that I worked patrol assignments. And then prior to that was the academies and training and all that type of stuff. Q. And not to go into too great of detail at this point, in order just to become a police officer, what kind of academies do you have to go to? A. There's a basic academy that I went to that was, I believe, eight weeks at the time where you just -- it's -- you're starting from scratch. You have some people with some experience maybe with other agencies or out of other states that have to attend our academy or maybe they were cadets with the police department, reserves, all the way to somebody that's just finished college or, you know, had another profession, teachers, whatever it may be. Attended the basic academy. And then after that, Portland has an advanced academy, which was around eight weeks also that we attended after that, which is more of the same training as far as some of the legal things, but also, you know, kind of this is

5 0 0 Portland, we're a little different than maybe a small agency that has one or two, whereas the basic academy is trying to teach everybody for the whole state, where this is focused on Portland and kind of dealing with the dynamics of working with Portland. Q. So more like big city policing? A. Yeah. And our defensive tactics are -- you know, some of the defensive tactics are a little different or maybe some of the terminology or firearm stuff might be a little bit different. And then also just to even refine those skills in addition to basic academy. And then after that you get assigned to be with a coach. And so we did rotation. I went through the domestic violence unit, traffic unit, all the different precincts. And then at some point during that, after being coached up, the coach says, Okay, now you're -- we believe that you're good enough to work on your own, and so then at that point you're still on probation and you go work on your own in a patrol car all by yourself. And then if you do good and finish that up, then your probationary period comes up at a

6 0 0 certain point and they say you're now permanently hired. And then at that point you're assigned a precinct and a shift and go to work. Q. Did you attend college? A. I did. Q. And did you achieve a degree? A. Yes. I have a degree in criminal justice and minor in sociology and a minor in political science at Washington State University. Q. So you're a Cougar? A. Yes. Q. All right. Now, you've had quite a bit of experience, I believe, in investigating shootings in general; is that right? A. Yes. As an officer in the gang unit, and this is in addition to just being a patrol officer and going out to different shooting scenes. But in the gang unit, as an officer, we responded with the detectives to investigate shootings and played a large role in those. Opposed to where a homicide unit calls in a criminalist and maybe a bunch of other detectives to investigate a homicide, the gang unit, the only difference may be is the person didn't die, you know. Same circumstances

7 0 0 involving a shooting. We would -- as officers, we would do the crime scenes, take pictures, you know, search during the search warrants or search for evidence. We played a lot of investigative roles as an officer in that unit. And then later as a detective in the gang unit, our gang unit was, on average for the last few years, doing over a hundred shooting cases a year for six detectives. So even if you weren't the lead detective, oftentimes we'd go out on a lot of those. So been involved in a lot of shooting cases over the years. And then also we would assist the homicide unit, add a gang nexus to the shooting or homicide, gang unit would help out with that. I did a rotation through cold case as a detective. Q. What is cold case? A. Our cold case homicide unit, sorry, for, you know, old homicide cases that need to be investigated, I was the acting detective as an officer for that unit to help out some gang homicide cases that had happened years back. And then now the last couple years as a homicide detective, I've -- even if it's not my

8 0 0 case, I've went out on most of the homicide cases to help out. Q. So as an officer, a gang detective, and now as a homicide detective, how many homicide investigations do you think you've been involved in, estimation? A. Estimate maybe. Q. All right. Now, it's my understanding that you were assigned as the lead investigator for this officer-involved use of force incident that occurred back on May 0th; is that right? A. That's correct. Q. If you could just let the grand jury know before you give a PowerPoint presentation, kind of how you got called out there and kind of what that process looked like. A. This one was after hours. So I -- usually that -- the way that works, I either get a page or a phone call or both saying respond to this location, which this one was th and Flavel area. And officer-involved shooting, I believe it said. And so at that point, whether it's the person's deceased or officer's injured or if it's merely the fact that an officer fired rounds and

9 0 0 nobody got hit, we're going to come out and investigate those. As a homicide detective, we do the officer-involved shootings, no matter what the result is. On this one, you know, learned that the subject that was shot by the officer was deceased, the officer was okay. And so that was kind of my knowledge base going into this. Didn't have a lot more or a whole lot more from that. I think as I was going in, I started making some phone calls and trying to figure out how many people were -- or how many shooters there were. Learned that there was just one officer that fired rounds, but there were other officers that were present. And that's the information I had when I arrived on-scene. When I arrived on-scene, there was a lot of people there. There was several agencies involved in this because it's a transit unit call and so -- Q. Transient unit? A. Transit unit. Q. Transit unit. A. Yeah, transit unit, the TriMet police. There was officer -- there were officers from

10 0 0 0 multiple jurisdictions. So they had support staff from all those other jurisdictions on this one, too. Q. And maybe you could just spend a little time right now, since I think it will be relevant as we proceed, discussing how the transit unit is a little different than maybe just kind of if this occurred just at a regular precinct in Portland. How is the transit unit different? A. So the transit unit's a lot like our gang unit. It's citywide, whereas the gang unit for Portland is for Portland. Theirs is the multiagency unit with multicounties: Washington County, Clackamas County, Multnomah County. Where they're -- they'll hire officers or have officers work from all those agencies. So you'll have -- for example, on this case you had West Linn officers, Clackamas County officers, Beaverton officers, Portland officers all part of this a team that patrolled that south area down there; Clackamas, South Portland, and Clackamas area or county area. So that was their district. So they would -- the way they do it, they'll partner up. So might have officer from

11 0 0 Portland working with Clackamas County, like what happened in this case, as partners because they're all one unit. They'll get a page usually, if they don't hear on the radio. They all have pagers or might go to their phones now where a call will come out. And so they'll all get it and then they'll go to the right radio channel because it may be on somebody else's dispatch, and then respond to those calls. And also through their computers they can look at those calls and read those calls and see what that call's about. And so they'll answer up for calls related to the MAX line, the buses, the platforms, anything TriMet related. And that's, you know, a funding thing through TriMet to do that. So if officers from Portland get assigned to the transit unit, my understanding is that TriMet is paying their salary, essentially. Q. So I'm assuming the logic behind this multiagency approach is because, for example, the MAX trains and lines go through Portland and Gresham and out to Lake Oswego and Clackamas County. Since the lines themselves, and the bus lines and the train lines, you know, cross city and county jurisdictions, that this

12 0 0 multijurisdictional approach is the reason why it's structured that way? A. Correct. So everybody -- I think if it's more if it's in Portland, there's probably going to be more Portland officers assigned to that, just kind of the way they figure it out. Q. Okay. So when you responded it sounds like there was quite a bit of police presence, by the time you got there, from multiple jurisdictions. And just tell us kind of what the process is at that point. A. So the process with that is, you know, when we get there -- and usually it's already done -- make sure any officers that had witnessed anything, you know, that they're separated so they're not -- we don't want the officers that were involved in a big huddle trying to like, What'd you see? What'd you see? We want it to be clean from everybody when we hear what they had -- or what they have to say. There's some initial things that, you know, when it's happening they're going to be talking for safety reasons, all that. But then after the break in the action we like to have them separated. Same with witnesses. And then we'll

13 0 0 try to get detectives assigned to interview witnesses, or reinterview them maybe, if they just gave a short version of events, let a detective interview them. The other thing we're trying to do is make sure the crime scene's surrounded with tape, you know, so nobody can get in there. There's usually media showing up. We're trying to make sure that we have a nice working area, that we're not going to compromise the investigation. So all those things are happening as we're talking to maybe other people that were there that weren't maybe a witness at that point just to try to get a feel for what happened, where it happened, what time it happened, all those type of things. Q. So it's my understanding when there's an incident like this, for example, that involves a Portland officer potentially using deadly force, that detectives from other jurisdictions are called in to participate; is that right? A. Correct. Q. Why don't you talk a little bit about how that worked in this case. A. Yeah, major crime teams will come in. So

14 0 0 it's detectives from other agencies will come assist us. So if an officer needs to be interviewed, for example, that was a witness, we'll have a detective from maybe Multnomah County, detective from Portland and do the interview together. I think it's just for transparency so it's not -- doesn't look like, you know, it's a Portland officer that fired the rounds and it's all Portland people involved. You get -- so there's other agencies involved in it. Q. Some outside involvement -- A. Outside involvement, oversight and just transparency, like I said. Q. So this particular instance do you know what other jurisdictions that provided detectives to participate in the investigation? A. Gresham and Multnomah County. Q. All right. So you arrived, you're the lead investigator on the case, and you get to work the process. Assume that involved crime scene, photographs, documentation, interview of witnesses, both civilian and police. And subsequent to that, I'm assuming that's just the beginning, there's lots of folks to be interviewed subsequently; is that right?

15 0 0 A. Correct. Yeah. When I arrived on this one, there was already persons from our forensic evidence division taking pictures, taking videos. There was -- so the witnesses were separated. So it comes down to working with our sergeants just trying to divvy up roles and responsibilities for these scenes. And there's -- on this particular one all the officers that were witnesses to this that, you know, maybe were just pulling up as the shots were fired or maybe went up and rendered aid, those type of things, they all went back to a different precinct, each precinct, and they were interviewed by detectives back there. Q. Okay. A. And then the civilian witnesses, there were some at the scene that were interviewed, then later some had to be tracked down that maybe gave their name and initial statement that detectives later went to interview, to include myself. Q. So, obviously, video was collected, things of that nature. And I'm going to hold this -- this is, I think, binder of the police reports that -- A. Right.

16 0 0 Q. -- represent this investigation; is that right? A. Yes. That's mine next to it. Q. Right. So maybe inches of police reports, approximately, as well as multiple disks or video files, audio files, things of that nature? A. Yes. Q. So it was a pretty comprehensive investigation? A. Yes. Q. All right. So I think what we should do at this point is jump into your presentation as far as summarizing what you were able to determine during the course of your investigation. A. Okay. A GRAND JUROR: Can I ask a clarification question? MR. DAVIDSON: Sure. A GRAND JUROR: Is the TriMet unit, you said, is that completely separate from Portland Police Bureau or Portland Police Department or -- THE WITNESS: That's a good question. They'll wear Portland uniforms, they'll drive Portland cars that generally look like Portland

17 0 0 police cars but will just say "Transit" on it. That they're still Portland police employees, it's just they're temporarily assigned there, but they follow all of our rules and union representation and all that. It's just they work for TriMet. I think maybe the funding, TriMet pays the bureau back for their wages or however that works out. But they're still Portland officers. BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. But it's just the Portland officers who wear the Portland uniform, obviously, if you're -- A. Right. Q. -- from West Linn or -- A GRAND JUROR: TriMet doesn't have its own police force, they have -- THE WITNESS: Correct. So when the car pulls up, if it's a Clackamas County deputy, he's going to be wearing his uniform, and then the Portland officers are going to be wearing their uniform. A GRAND JUROR: Thank you. MR. DAVIDSON: Anybody else? THE WITNESS: So this is the Portland police Case Number -, May 0, 0. MR. DAVIDSON: Can you guys -- is it

18 0 0 better for you guys to turn the lights off? Is this okay? This is fine, okay. THE WITNESS: Southeast Flavel Street. This is a timeline. It's, you know, not a whole lot of time here for the whole incident; less than a half hour. At : p.m. is when Terrell Johnson approaches Meredith Rivera, Brendalis Rivera Sanchez, who is her stepdaughter. And Jacob Leiker. At :, five minutes later, is when -- we're going to watch some videos -- Meredith Rivera and Brendalis Rivera Sanchez walk off. Jacob walks off a different direction. And then Terrell Johnson gets up off the ground and chases Jacob. At : Meredith Rivera calls. At :0 TriMet group page goes out. At :0 Officer Howell self-dispatches, which is on the computer they can just type in a code or push a button that says, I'm responding. They don't actually physically get on the radio and say anything. BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. When you say "computer" in this context, my understanding is there are what are called MDT terminals in the vehicles that are like computer

19 0 0 terminals that are in the cars? A. Yes. So they have -- there's a screen with keyboard and touch screen, and they consult dispatch that way. At the same time, or in the same time frame, Unit, Officer Samson Ajir and Deputy Ali Ajir -- he goes by AJ, so if I say "AJ Ajir," that's referring to him -- notify dispatch they're responding to the call. At :0 Officer Howell shows that he's arriving on-scene. At : Unit, Officer Ajir and Deputy Ajir arrive on-scene. And so when you arrive on-scene, you could either say it via radio or push a button, I think is which way it happens now, just tap a button that says I'm on-scene. But a lot of times that means you're in the area. Doesn't mean, like, I'm physically talking to this person right now. And this will explain that later when we watch some videos. At : Officer Ajir broadcasts that he's in foot pursuit. And then that's when the first transmission about the foot pursuit. And seconds later he's broadcasting shots fired, suspect down. At medical responders announce

20 0 0 0 that Terrell Johnson is deceased. And that's going off a medical report that shows that they arrived at :0 and : is, like, their last entry for that. Q. Now, Detective, I've sure everyone's noticed that there's a reference here to Officer Ajir and Deputy Ajir. Can you -- I'm sure that piques some interest. Can you just explain the relationship there? A. They're brothers. Samson Ajir is a Portland officer and Deputy Ajir is with Clackamas County Sheriff's Office. But they're both assigned to the transit unit and they're partners. This is kind of a map of the layout. Down in this area is where Jacob, Meredith, and Brendalis, who also goes by Brenda, were initially contacted by Terrell Johnson. There's a ticket booth right here on the south end. And Mr. Johnson was laying down on the ground here that we'll see in the video. Jacob gets chased up in this area, turns to run away, and Terrell Johnson stops in this area after chasing him. Meredith Rivera calls, goes up here to keep an eye on what's going on.

21 0 0 Officer Howell has driven by here, stops, gets out, approaches Mr. Johnson. Ajir's Unit pull in this area and drive their car up through here. That's why I say on-scene, because when they arrived is, you know, right when they're getting out of the car is when the foot pursuit happened, which is at :, but I believe that when they arrived they showed themselves on-scene here and just shaved a minute or whatever off looking for this Mr. Johnson as they're driving up here and stopped. Q. Is that what's referred to as, I think, the multiuse path in a number of reports? A. Yes. This path here is for biking, jogging. You see it has yellow dots to differentiate which side. When Officer Ajir and Deputy Ajir arrive, start getting out of their car, that is when Terrell Johnson runs to the west, cuts across to the north, runs eastbound back toward the MAX tracks, and then runs north up to this area. And that's where the shooting happened. Q. So what -- A. North side of the bridge. Q. There's, like, a rail bridge. Is that

22 0 0 Johnson Creek? A. This is Johnson Creek right here. This is I-0. Q. So it's my understanding that various people who were involved in various parts of this incident lived at a nearby apartment complex; is that right? A. Yeah. And that's off this map. It's over in this area, so to the west. So this is video from Southeast Flavel Street transit station. Q. And maybe before we go on to it, might pause again for a moment. Can you just describe -- we're going to be looking at a variety of video, and maybe it's not news to everybody, but, obviously, TriMet and MAX in particular have quite a few video cameras set up at various places; is that right? A. Yeah, there's -- throughout the tri-county area there's lots of cameras on the platforms, at the stations, on the trains, some buses. You know, it's kind of a variety, depending on how old they are, the quality. But there are quite a few cameras. Q. And that's one of these cameras we're

23 0 0 about to look at? A. Yes. (Video playing.) THE WITNESS: So this is -- when I showed you this screenshot here, this is a camera up in this area pointing down to where Mt. Scott Boulevard comes in. BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. So pointing south? A. Pointing south. So this is where Mt. Scott Boulevard comes in. So this is looking south. This will be going west. Q. Can you see Terrell Johnson in these images? A. This is Terrell Johnson on the ground over here. That's Meredith Rivera and her stepdaughter Brendalis Rivera Sanchez. And Meredith is the one that later called. That's Jacob. He got off the MAX, they see each other, and start talking. Q. And they all reside at that same apartment complex that was referenced earlier? A. Yes. Q. And, obviously, there's no audio; is that correct?

24 0 0 A. Correct. No audio. Q. Approximately how long is this segment? A. This segment is about five minutes long. Q. So this seems like something's going on in the background. That's Terrell Johnson? A. That's Terrell Johnson approaching them and asking for a cigarette. Q. And you know that because you've spoken with both the girls and Jacob Leiker? A. Yes. And you can see smoke coming up in the picture, too, they were smoking. Q. And do they, in fact, offer him a cigarette? A. They declined. Q. So you can see in the video after they tell him that he can't have a cigarette -- how would you characterize that response? You kind of see his face and hand movements. Is there a way to characterize that or -- A. Well, I think just based on their demeanor that it seemed odd to them. I don't know if -- didn't seem as odd that they were asking for a cigarette, but just kind of his reaction. They said he just stared at them. But then they kind of, like, kept their distance, I guess, and kept

25 0 0 an eye on him. Q. So in the video he goes and, I guess, Mr. Johnson lays back down where he was originally? A. Right. Q. And how old is Jacob Leiker? A. I believe he's. Q. Do you know why the two girls were at the MAX station that day? A. They were going to a concert; they were waiting for the MAX. Q. That was at the Moda Center? A. Yes. Q. So Mr. Johnson seems to be doing something in the background. A. He's standing up now. A GRAND JUROR: Standing up, yeah, I see. THE WITNESS: This is going to be another angle. This is the camera a little bit further to the north still looking southbound. Here's the walking off. A GRAND JUROR: There we go. And Terrell starts to chase. THE WITNESS: Yeah, they're running

26 0 0 down the tracks. A GRAND JUROR: Was he yelling anything at Jacob at that time? THE WITNESS: No, I don't believe so. A GRAND JUROR: He's just chasing him. THE WITNESS: And I think Jacob will be in here to clarify. But not that -- didn't say anything. BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. So the two young ladies are now walking in the frame, and what do you see there? A. She's -- Meredith's on the phone at this point. Q. With? A. Calling. And the call records show that she called at :. Here's another camera angle. Q. What angle is this? A. This one's also looking southbound. A GRAND JUROR: The trail is in the far right? THE WITNESS: I'm sorry? A GRAND JUROR: The multiuse trail is on the right? THE WITNESS: Yes, yes.

27 0 0 BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. That's Jacob. If you could just maybe describe what we're observing in this video. A. So this is Jacob being chased by Terrell Johnson up the tracks and then onto the concrete area between the tracks northbound. Followed by Brendalis and Meredith with Meredith being on the cell phone. This camera is from Flavel or the south sidewalk of Flavel looking southbound. And this is, again, the multiuse area. A GRAND JUROR: There he goes. THE WITNESS: Jacob being chased by Terrell toward Flavel. A GRAND JUROR: That's the north end of the platform? THE WITNESS: Yes, yes. So when Deputy Ajir and Officer Ajir arrived, they pulled up this area and stopped right in here to contact -- or cover Officer Howell, who was out with Mr. Johnson in the area just off the screen. And Meredith right now is talking to dispatchers and telling the dispatchers what she's seeing. And this day was a nice day out. It was one of the few that we had at that time frame. I

28 0 0 believe the web site, I think it's called Accuweather, I looked it up and it showed degrees that day. So a lot of people were wearing T-shirts and shorts. A GRAND JUROR: So that was her and stepdaughter walking back? THE WITNESS: Walking back down toward where you get on the bus. A GRAND JUROR: Is Terrell right behind them? THE WITNESS: No. He's off -- A GRAND JUROR: Oh, somebody else. THE WITNESS: He's off the screen right now. So this is the call that Meredith made. ( phone call:) :. MS. RIVERA: Hi, I'm at the Flavel MAX Station and there was some homeless guy that I was with my friend. He's only -- he's our neighbor. He's only. And we're waiting for our MAX, this guy just starts chasing him out of nowhere, threatening to attack him for no reason. He's crazy. : Okay. And you're where? At what?

29 0 0 MS. RIVERA: At the Southeast Flavel MAX Station. : Okay. And where is he now, the guy that was doing the chasing? MS. RIVERA: He's still over here. He chased him. My friend ran, but now he's over here threatening me and my pregnant daughter. : White male? Black male? MS. RIVERA: He's a white man about '", like 0 pounds. He got on a gray striped hooded sweatshirt with a gray knitted hat. : Okay. MS. RIVERA: And he's standing over there by the fence. He already tried to come at us once. There's two other kids that are here, seen the whole thing, also. : Is he wearing blue jeans or -- MS. RIVERA: I -- yeah, he has on -- I think he has -- he's got blue jeans on, right? I don't even remember. I think so. He's walking down now. He's walking down Flavel, like, over the bridge. Oh, he got windbreakers on. : Okay. Does he have any weapons? MS. RIVERA: I don't know. He just started running from out of nowhere. He was

30 0 0 0 laying on the ground one minute. He came over, asked us for a cigarette. We told him no, and then all of a sudden my friend went to walk to go home, we went to get on the MAX, and he just started chasing him. : Okay. Did he say anything, is what I'm asking you. MS. RIVERA: I don't -- he -- I didn't hear nothin' -- : Okay. Did you see -- MS. RIVERA: -- because we were walk -- : -- any weapons? THE WITNESS: No. : Okay. MS. RIVERA: I just seen him running. : All right. And your name is? MS. RIVERA: Meredith Rivera. : And are you gonna wait on the platform for the officer, Meredith, or are you gonna catch the next MAX? MS. RIVERA: We're on our way to a concert. : Okay. That's a yes or no, are you gonna? MS. RIVERA: No, we can't wait.

31 0 0 : Okay. All right. And you last saw him going which direction? MS. RIVERA: He's standing over -- he's standing right there by the fence. He's actually walking to -- oh, no, that's somebody else. He's standing, like, right by the fence on the Flavel side of the MAX station. : Okay. MS. RIVERA: Like -- : And about how old, if you were guessing? MS. RIVERA: Probably about, 0. : Okay. And does he look homeless? MS. RIVERA: Yes. : Okay. MS. RIVERA: He was sleeping in the grass. : All right. Okay. We'll send an officer to there, Meredith. MS. RIVERA: Thank you. : You bet. (End of call.) BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. So did Meredith -- is that the end of the call?

32 0 0 A. Yes. Q. Did Meredith, in fact, then -- and her stepdaughter end up staying or did they end up leaving? A. They left. Q. On the MAX train? A. Yes. Q. And you also heard her describe Terrell Johnson as being white. A. Correct. Q. And what is your understanding of Mr. Johnson's ethnic background? A. His mom is African American, his dad's white. And he is light-skinned. As far as there was, you know, other confusion, you know, even when officers were there, and then when -- even when I got to the scene, you know, I couldn't tell you his ethnicity. Q. And, in fact, in various accounts he's been described as being white or Hispanic even? A. Correct. Q. All right. What's our next slide? So before we get to this, Jacob Leiker was, obviously, interviewed subsequent to this, correct?

33 0 0 A. Yes. Q. And did Jacob Leiker -- obviously, we're going to hear from him hopefully later today -- describe what occurred as far as this whole interaction? A. Yes. I talked to him, and he described that he was talking to Meredith and Brendalis. And the females went toward the MAX, and he started to go home. You know, that's the closest path to getting to his house right there. And as soon as he started to walk away from them, the guy just started chasing him. He said that he saw him looked like folding something out, which he thought was a knife. And he just got out of there as fast as he could. And he was screaming for help as he was being chased and called his dad, and then ended up going home and then coming back. Q. So he described to law enforcement as believing Mr. Johnson, who was chasing him, was armed with some kind of weapon, potentially a bladed weapon? A. Yes. And he was afraid he was going to get stabbed. Q. So he goes home -- or calls his dad, goes

34 0 0 home. And he ends up returning to the MAX platform; is that right? A. Yes. Q. And kind of tell us what -- because we're about to -- without that background, this next slide kind of makes no sense. A. So he goes home, he's -- the word's spreading throughout the apartment complex because a lot of people are out. And he ends up getting a knife from his kitchen and going back with some friends that he either saw in the apartment complex or after calling his dad. So it ends up being several people showing back up to confront this guy that he felt was either trying to rob him or stab him, including his dad that showed up. Q. What's his dad's name? A. Paul. Q. All right. So what are we about to see on this next slide? A. The next slide is this is a TriMet bus that's going east on Flavel. So as it's going east, off to the right is going to be the area of interest. It's that sidewalk area that was out of view of that camera.

35 0 0 This is east from. So this group here is going to be Jacob and his dad and that group -- A GRAND JUROR: Some friends. THE WITNESS: -- the people that came down there. A GRAND JUROR: Apartment houses right there? THE WITNESS: The apartments are a little ways away further to the southwest. But my understanding is, like, a few people were kind of in the area, people who kind of just started showing up as this was going down. A GRAND JUROR: This was roughly four minutes before the shooting occurred; is that correct? THE WITNESS: Yes, yes. So Officer Howell is not here yet, which -- A GRAND JUROR: This is about ten minutes after the chase scene that we saw earlier; is that correct? THE WITNESS: Yes. So there's Jacob right there. BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. Can you point out Terrell in this photograph?

36 0 0 A. Right here. Q. And is this -- as far as your understanding, is this after, I guess, the confrontation is kind of diffused between Mr. Johnson -- A. Yes. This group is walking away, Mr. Johnson's remaining there. A GRAND JUROR: They've already had contact? THE WITNESS: This is already -- they've already confronted him and talked to him. And that's where they had seen him with the box cutter. The dad had talked to him and -- BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. Maybe you can tell us your understanding from the various interviews from folks what transpired. Again, we're going to hear from all these people. A. My understanding is they show up, they're fired up about this incident. You know, My son's just been chased by you, that they get there. Jacob has a knife, like, a kitchen knife in his hand. And they confront him and, you know, yelling, drawing attention. But his dad talks to this guy.

37 0 0 Q. Jacob's dad? A. Jacob's dad, Paul, talks to Terrell, says, "Why you'd chase my son?" "Because he was looking at me funny." And then tells him, "It's not worth it. Just put it away." And then Terrell puts the knife away at that point. Or the box cutter at that point. Q. The box cutter? A. Puts the box cutter away. Q. So Paul Leiker describes at some point in this interaction that Mr. Johnson used a red box cutter? A. Yes. I can't remember on the color, but he saw him with this and he's, like, Just put it away, it's not worth it. Q. Just one more. The situation is then diffused and Jacob Leiker and the group leaves the MAX station? A. Yeah, they're walking away westbound right now. A GRAND JUROR: What happens -- so we see in the video that he's chasing and is relatively close. But he was able -- Jacob was able to get home. So at some point Mr. Johnson stops chasing and he is able to just go home?

38 0 0 THE WITNESS: Mr. Johnson lingers in this area. Jacob -- there's a pathway that cuts through back to the apartments and goes back. Other people from the apartment, you know, return with him. And that's when they confront him now that they have numbers, I guess. A GRAND JUROR: And Mr. Johnson had not continued to follow him, he stayed in the area? THE WITNESS: Correct. My understanding is from talking to everybody that Mr. Johnson stayed in this area where he's situated right now. A GRAND JUROR: And this is them walking back after talking to him? THE WITNESS: They had talked to Johnson. A GRAND JUROR: Yeah. THE WITNESS: Now they're walking back westbound toward their apartments. A GRAND JUROR: And the father's still with them? THE WITNESS: Yes. I believe this is the father right here, I believe, standing there. A GRAND JUROR: And they never reported the incident, so they weren't there when the

39 0 0 police got there, right? THE WITNESS: I believe they were just down -- I believe Officer Howell drives by focused on looking for the person that's, you know, matching the description of -- that chased somebody and drove past them at some point. BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. You can go ahead and play -- is that the end of this video or is there -- A. So now he's there, essentially, by himself. Q. So when Jacob Leiker is originally contacted and interviewed about this, was he a hundred percent forthcoming to police about everything or was there -- A. No. It wasn't until I talked to Julie Friesen, that is a witness to this, that had also drove by that same scene that we just looked at but maybe a little bit before when they were still confronting Mr. Johnson. And had seen somebody with the red/black jersey on that matches Jacob's description with a knife. She had called me when she saw the picture of Terrell Johnson in the paper on the news and said, "That's not the person I saw with

40 0 0 0 the knife. And the knife that I saw wasn't a folding knife, it was like a bigger kitchen knife." So I called and talked to Jacob again, and he was forthcoming at that point that he had returned with a knife. Q. So Jacob's first account to you omitted -- A. To another detective. Q. -- omitted the fact that he had returned armed with a knife himself? A. Correct. Q. And then when you confronted him, he admitted that he had a knife when he came back? A. Correct. This is Terrell Johnson. This is Officer Jacob Howell with West Linn Police Department. Q. And these photographs were taken -- A. They were taken that night when they were getting interviewed at the East Precinct. That's how he was dressed on that occasion. A GRAND JUROR: The time stamp June th, is that -- I suppose it's irrelevant but -- THE WITNESS: Yeah, that's -- when I

41 0 0 was putting this together, that's just when I pulled it -- A GRAND JUROR: Just a tag with all the information about the case. THE WITNESS: Correct. This is Officer Samson Ajir from the Portland police, Unit. This is his uniform that he was wearing that night. He's years old. Hired April, 00. Eight-year veteran. This is Deputy Ali Ajir, who also goes by AJ. Clackamas County Sheriff's Office. He was a partner with Officer Sam Ajir. Also Unit. Q. What does that mean, "Unit "? A. It's -- officers are assigned to units. So you have a call number that if you're on the radio so you don't have to say this is Officer Samson Ajir, you know, going to this call. When they log on with their computer, they'll just fill in their unit number and their name so then everything -- all they have to do is say "" and it will be linked to them. Or the dispatch is going to dispatch a call, they'll say Unit or just say. A GRAND JUROR: Is that a car number? THE WITNESS: What's that?

42 0 0 A GRAND JUROR: Is that a car number? THE WITNESS: Nothing to do with the physical car. But the two of them in that car together mean Unit. That computer is assigned -- that car recognizes that computer, and then with them logging on to it, it attaches them all together with that car. And they could track, you know, like, for example, even if they're logged on and somebody else drives that car, you know, it'll show, you know, how fast that car was going and stuff for. So it's until they log off and somebody else logs back in it's theirs. A GRAND JUROR: So these gentlemen are brothers? THE WITNESS: They are brothers, yes. When Sam Ajir, Officer Ajir, was driving that evening and Deputy Ajir was a passenger, when the foot chase started, Sam Ajir chased, Ali Ajir got in the driver's seat and drove the car to try to get out ahead. This is a compressed version of the radio transmissions. So it's going to be east dispatch. So some of it's going to be related to this call and some of it's going to be related to

43 0 0 other calls. But just remember it's compressed, it's not -- it's just kind of like the stuff that was said with little gaps. BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. Before we get into this, Detective, can you explain a little bit about how officers in the field communicate over the radio with dispatch as far as is it an open mic where you hear everything they say, or how does that work? A. So the officers, either there's a mic in the car and then also have mics on them. A lot of the officers wear earpieces and have a button they push to talk. So when they talk to dispatch, it'll be something similar to,, and then dispatch will say,, go ahead. And then they'll say, We're responding to this call. And dispatch may say, Copy at 0. So 0 will be your time. So they'll give -- depending on how much stuff's being said on the radio, the dispatch will repeat times back, so kind of little time stamps throughout the -- all the dispatches. But when things are happening fast, they're not going to give a time every time somebody says something. Q. And I guess just to be clear, an officer

44 0 0 wouldn't be transmitting over the air to dispatch and it wouldn't be recorded unless they were actually -- if they're out of their car keying their microphone; is that right? A. Well, they could -- you know, maybe I'm understanding wrong. But like in a car chase or something like that they may have the main radio in the car giving updates, you know, which direction they're going and things like that. And then when they get out of car, they'll go to their radios on their vest or on their hip. But they also use the computers in the car to update. Q. I guess what I'm asking is, if an officer got out of the car, as they did in this instance, not everything that they said would be transmitted over the air as far as to dispatch. They would have to push their radio button -- A. Right. Q. -- in order to transmit? A. Right. So you could -- they could get out of their car and talk to somebody for a half hour, and then get back in their car and push a button and say they're clear of a call. And so the whole half hour of interaction with somebody, you know, nothing was on the radio.

45 0 0 (Dispatch call playing:) UNIT :. OPERATOR:. UNIT : You guys have a call at the Flavel Center? OPERATOR: Yes. It is for a subject on the platform who the complainant was just threatening some riders when they wouldn't give him a cigarette. Caller was not a victim and was continuing on. He was a white male, about, gray-striped hoody, gray knitted hat, and blue jeans. UNIT : Copy. We'll be en route. OPERATOR: 0. UNIT : 0. I'm 0-. OPERATOR: 0 at 0, that information on a vehicle was eastbound I- and took the exit to southbound I-0 about three minutes ago. When somebody honked at him, he waved a gun out the window. It was a white Honda, Oregon plate Edward, Zebra, Lincoln. No description on the driver. UNIT 0: 0. OPERATOR: 0. UNIT 0: If there's somebody

46 0 0 available to come down and meet me, I'm gonna go to and Umatilla and try to pick a guy up on an RO violation. Two guys (unintelligible) that number. OPERATOR: copy, that's 0. UNIT 0: 0, 0-? OPERATOR: 0 at. UNIT : (Static) foot pursuit. OPERATOR:? UNIT : We're on Flavel headed eastbound. OPERATOR: Eastbound on Flavel. UNK UNIT: From where? OPERATOR: Eastbound Flavel from the Transit Station. UNIT :, shots are fired. I need medical Code- for our subject, he's down. OPERATOR: Copy. Nonemergency have shots fired, starting medical Code-. UNIT : Okay. Why don't you just stop the trains. We're in the middle of the tracks just north of Flavel. OPERATOR: Middle of the tracks north of Flavel. UNK UNIT: Where exactly are they?

47 0 0 UNIT : Just north of Flavel on the tracks. On the bridge. UNIT :, arrive. OPERATOR: arrived at. UNK UNIT: Stage me medical at and Flavel. OPERATOR: Copy. We'll stage them at and Flavel. UNK UNIT: I'm sorry, and Flavel. OPERATOR: and Flavel. UNIT :, just confirming our stuff. Subject's down. We're not setting up a perimeter. UNIT : Correct, suspect is down. If you want to bring a shield up, he's collapsed on the knife. We're not gonna approach until we have some cover. UNIT : Copy. And just approach from Transit Center, correct? UNIT : Affirm. We're maybe 00 feet down the tracks. UNIT :. I'm at and Foster. UNIT 0: 0. Take me off this call and head me towards that one, please.

48 0 0 OPERATOR: 0, copy. UNK UNIT: Is the officer okay? UNIT : Affirm. UNIT :. I think we have enough units here. UNIT :. Did you say you have enough people? UNK UNIT: Yes, we have enough people. Someone is walking up with a shield now. That's what we need. Then just stage medical at and Flavel. I've got a medical pack that I'll start until they get here. Once we have him detained. OPERATOR: And medical is staged, and Flavel. UNK UNIT: Copy. UNIT :. You can bring medical right up to where the tracks are. UNIT 0: 0. We're gonna need Flavel closed at and then at Knapp. OPERATOR: So you need Flavel closed? UNK UNIT: We're. You can have the air back. OPERATOR: and regular traffic and. UNIT 0: Andrusko, stay with him

49 0 0 right there. UNIT :. You want southbound blocked at Knapp? UNIT :. We're gonna need this bike path also closed off of looky-loos. Probably shut it off there at. UNK UNIT: That's copy. UNIT : And then north. (End of dispatch call.) THE WITNESS: So when they said, "We're," that means in custody and handcuffs, they can start rendering aid to him to make sure in case there's other weapons or wouldn't go for weapons. BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. One of the first things the dispatcher seems to say as soon as the officer calls out, "Shots fired. Suspect is down," was "Code- medical." What does that mean? A. Code- means as fast as you can get there, essentially, safely. That's lights and sirens, full on, everybody stop and let them through. Well, hopefully. A GRAND JUROR: What was the unit number for Howell? Did we -- we heard -- THE WITNESS: He's. The was

50 0 0 0 the Ajir brothers. And then was Deputy Moyer from Clackamas County, and Officer Parker from Beaverton that showed up. They showed up really quick right after the shots were fired. A GRAND JUROR: And medical arrived :0; is that correct? Like a little more than five minutes -- THE WITNESS: It's going off their -- A GRAND JUROR: After the Code- came in. THE WITNESS: Yeah, in looking at these and other investigations, you know, a time could be -- you know, we'll say : and one second and then : and seconds. So where it's a minute apart it could be closer to two minutes. But, yes, 0 is what they show themselves arriving, and then -- or not. : with patient. And then according to talking to officers that as soon as medical arrived, they knew right away. A GRAND JUROR: Announced, right. A GRAND JUROR: They make a reference or use the word "shield" or something that indicated they weren't going to approach him until something like --

51 0 0 THE WITNESS: Right. A GRAND JUROR: What does that mean and what is the protocol for -- THE WITNESS: So the shields are approximately feet tall by maybe a little under a couple of feet wide. A GRAND JUROR: Like the riot shield we see? THE WITNESS: Yeah. So it's like a riot-looking shield that the sergeants carry with them. So they're saying he's laying down, they don't see the knife at that point, and it's underneath him, they can't see his hands. So they want the shield up there before they approach so in case he tries to get up they can push him down with the shield. That's one of the things we train with at the police bureau. So that's why -- the shield ended up being right there, so they were close by so they called for that. A GRAND JUROR: I'm sorry, that's carried in the car, then, so maybe -- THE WITNESS: Carried in sergeants' cars. A GRAND JUROR: So who ended up bringing that?

52 0 0 THE WITNESS: Sergeant Slyter showed up. I believe he's unit. Showed up with the shield and then went up the tracks. MR. DAVIDSON: You're going to hear from Sergeant Slyter tomorrow morning. A GRAND JUROR: So this call went really quickly. So when did Howell get there? THE WITNESS: Howell -- A GRAND JUROR: Because he was in a patrol car -- THE WITNESS: Officer Howell got there at :0 p.m. So about a minute or two before the -- Officer Ajir and Deputy Ajir got there. So he's out by himself contacting Terrell Johnson for a little bit before the Ajir brothers showed up. A GRAND JUROR: So he's on Flavel? THE WITNESS: Yeah, Officer Howell -- Terrell Johnson, where we watched the bus go by and he was on the sidewalk, he was right there. Officer Howell drove past him just like the bus did and got parked on the other side of the tracks. As he passed him, he recognized he matched the description. He parks his car, gets out and walks back to the west to contact him right there on the sidewalk.

53 0 0 And as he's contacting him, that's when Deputy Ajir and Officer Ajir drove up that multiuse path. And as they started to get out of the car, that's when Mr. Johnson took off running. A GRAND JUROR: Can I ask, was there just one call to, that initial call from Meredith? THE WITNESS: Yes, yes. A GRAND JUROR: How was it communicated to police that there was a knife involved? THE WITNESS: They didn't know. Officer Howell got there -- and there's going to be some other testimony, I believe -- or we can talk about -- want to talk about the CAD, what I saw in that? MR. DAVIDSON: Yeah, that's fine. THE WITNESS: The -- I don't know what all the officers saw as far as reading the call. There is -- you heard Meredith Rivera saying no weapons. The typed-out version of the call they were able to see it says N-O-W, space, and W-E-A-P-S, or something. So, like, now weapon. But then -- so that says that. The dispatch doesn't say anything about weapons. Officer Howell gets there and he learns

54 0 0 from talking to Terrell Johnson that Terrell Johnson has a knife because he told him. But when the Ajir brothers get out of the car, the foot chase starts and there's not time for Officer Howell to talk to -- A GRAND JUROR: To communicate to them that there is a weapon. THE WITNESS: -- Deputy Ajir and Officer Ajir. BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. So we'll learn, obviously, when AJ Ajir and Samson Ajir testify what they knew and when they knew it. But it's a little conflicted right now, I think. A. Yeah, I could just tell you kind of what I know from reading the call, listening to the dispatch, talking to Meredith, and then read some of the transcripts. So, you know, there was, I think, just such a compressed time frame for everybody to know all the same stuff that didn't happen. Q. So it's your understanding that Officer Howell was aware that Terrell Johnson had told Officer Howell that he had a blade in his pocket? A. Yes.

55 0 0 Q. But Officer Howell had not had an opportunity to communicate that to other officers when -- A. Correct. Q. -- Terrell Johnson ran? A GRAND JUROR: Could we take a little tiny break? MR. DAVIDSON: Absolutely. (Recess was taken : to :.) BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. So what's our next slide, Detective? A. The next slide is there was a train that was going southbound approaching that station kind of as all this was going on. So this is going to be some camera views from that train. A GRAND JUROR: This is police contact time frame, correct? :? THE WITNESS: Yeah. This is -- so right in the -- right before or during the foot chase stuff going on. And some of these time stamps from the train and radio transmissions and bus, you know, could be off a little bit. (Video playing.) THE WITNESS: This is going southbound. This is going across the bridge.

56 0 0 A GRAND JUROR: Whose patrol car is that, do we know? THE WITNESS: That is Deputy Ajir that was driving that. We can watch this again. BY MR. DAVIDSON: Q. Do we have this one in slow mo? A. We do. I can play it one more time here. They've seen it once. So if you look off to the right, you're going to see part of the chase going on, Terrell getting chased. A GRAND JUROR: AJ is driving the car at this point? THE WITNESS: AJ is driving at this point, correct. And this camera is out of the back of the camera, so the camera is faced to the north at this point as it drives by. A GRAND JUROR: From the same train? THE WITNESS: From the same train. A GRAND JUROR: Off to our left we'll see something. THE WITNESS: Yeah, it's going to come into view off to your left. A GRAND JUROR: So AJ had stopped the car right there? THE WITNESS: Yes. That's him getting