COUNCILMEMBER SAWYER: COUNCILMEMBER NEIGHBOR: Present. CITY OF SHAWNEE CITY COUNCIL MEETING MINUTES 7:30 P.M. Jeff Meyers

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1 Page 1 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15095 CITY OF SHAWNEE CITY COUNCIL MEETING MINUTES July 8, :30 P.M. Jeff Meyers ~ Mayor Councilmembers Present Staff Present Councilmember Pflumm City Manager Gonzales Councilmember Neighbor Deputy City Manager Charlesworth Councilmember Sawyer City Attorney Rainey Councilmember Kemmling City Engineer Wesselschmidt Councilmember Kuhn Fire Chief Mattox Councilmember Vaught Police Chief Larimore Councilmember Sandifer Public Works Director Freyermuth Councilmember Distler Planning Director Chaffee Finance Director Rogers Parks and Recreation Director Holman Assistant City Manager Killen City Clerk Campbell (City Council Meeting Called to Order at 7:31 p.m.) A. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE & MOMENT OF SILENCE B. ROLL CALL MAYOR MEYERS: Good evening and welcome to tonight s meeting of the Shawnee City Council. I would ask that you please silence your electronic devices at this time. I am Mayor Jeff Meyers and I will be chairing this meeting. I will do a roll call at this time. Councilmember Neighbor? COUNCILMEMBER NEIGHBOR: Present. MAYOR MEYERS: Councilmember Pflumm? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Present. MAYOR MEYERS: Councilmember Kemmling? COUNCILMEMBER KEMMLING: Present. MAYOR MEYERS: Councilmember Sawyer? COUNCILMEMBER SAWYER: Present. MAYOR MEYERS: Councilmember Kuhn?

2 I :-_-_._._\._._._..._.:;..:.-.~.-;-;-..-;. _'_'. J.-V.-3;-.1.-I-Z- - :. 4..'...'.'.'.'_ ' _-.-4. :A. _...-_.,.;.. -.._.,....: _-. -..~..-.-_-_-_-_-.-_--_-.-_.._.»_:.-_-.:.:z.;2.l;-.i;;g.1;;;;;-; _-;- 1 < - I - Page 2 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15094 COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Present. MAYOR MEYERS: Councilmember Vaught? COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Present. MAYOR MEYERS: Councilmember Sandifer? COUNCILMEMBER SANDIFER: Present. MAYOR MEYERS: And, Councilmember Distler? COUNCILMEMBER DISTLERI Present. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. Please join us for the Pledge of Allegiance followed by a brief moment of silence. Thank you. Before we being our agenda I'd like to explain our procedures for public to the audience. At numerous time during the meeting, I will offer the opportunity for public input. If you would like to speak to the Council at any of those times, please come fonnard to the microphone. I will ask you to state your name and address for the record, then you may offer your comments. After you are finished, please sign the form to the left of the podium to ensure that we have an accurate record of your name and address. C. CONSENT AGENDA MAYOR MEYERS: At this time we l begin with the Consent Agenda. COUNCILMEMBER SANDIFER: Move for approval. COUNCILMEMBER NEIGHBOR: Second. MAYOR MEYERS: A motion has been made and seconded on the Consent Agenda. Is there any further commentsor questions from the Council? Seeing none, all in favor signify by saying aye. COUNCILMEMBERS: Aye. MAYOR MEYERS: Opposed no. Motion passes. (Motion passes 8-0) D. MAYOR S ITEMS 1. BUSINESS APPRECIATION DAY PROCLAMATION MAYOR MEYERS: At this time we ll go to Mayor's Items, which is Item D. I have two proclamations that l m going to read tonight. And so l l have some people-from the audience coming forward. The first proclamation is to name July 10 as our Business Appreciation Day. If we could have Andrew Nave and Linda Leeper come forward, d like to read and present this proclamation to them. Andrew is our Economic Development Director and Linda is our Chamber President. g,»

3 Page 3 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15093 From the Office of the Mayor of Shawnee, Kansas. Whereas, Shawnee businesses play a pivotal role in strengthening our community by encouraging job creation, innovation and employing a diverse work force to preserve the economic well-being of all our citizens; and whereas, Shawnee is pleased to recognize the accomplishments of our entrepreneurs, especially our many small and existing businesses that contribute greatly to the economic recovery; and whereas, it is appropriate to offer citizens a unique opportunity to recognize Shawnee businesses for the essential role they play in moving Shawnee forward; whereas, we celebrate Business Appreciation Day in Shawnee and thank the many businesses of Shawnee for their generous contributions to the quality of life we all enjoy. Now, therefore, I, Jeff Meyers, Mayor of the City of Shawnee, Kansas, do hereby proclaim July 10 as Business Appreciation Day in Shawnee and urge all citizens to salute local businesses and their employees for their outstanding contributions to our City and to join in this important observance. Thank you for accepting this proclamation. Thank you again. 2. PARKS AND RECREATION MONTH PROCLAMATION. MAYOR MEYERS: The second proclamation is to proclaim the monthof July as Parks and Recreation Month. And I would like to have Neil Holman, our Parks and Recreation Director, come forward to accept this proclamation. Hello, Mr. Holman. From the Office of Mayor of Shawnee, Kansas. Whereas, public parks and recreation systems are dedicated to enhancing the quality of life for residents and communities around the country through recreation programming, leisure activities and conservation efforts. Public works embody the American tradition of preserving public lands for the benefit of all citizens; and whereas, parks and recreation and leisure experiences provide opportunities for young people to live, grow and develop into contributing members of society, create lifelines of continuous life experience for older members of the community, generate opportunities for people to come together and experience a sense of community and pay dividends to communities by attracting businesses, jobs and increasing housing value; and whereas, we recognize the important contribution of our City s Parks and Recreation staff, the Parks and Recreation Advisory Board and the many recreation re ated civic groups and non-profit organizations in our community. This dedicated core of citizenshelp make our public parks clean, safe and attractive, provide diverse recreation opportunities for residents and visitors to our community and lend essential support to projects throughout the year; and whereas, we join the National Recreation Parks Association to call upon all Parks and Recreation supporters to join us in recognizing the importance of our local parks and to learn more about how to support the green spaces that bring our community a higher quality of life, safer places to play and healthy alternatives through recreational programming for citizens of all ages. Therefore, I, Jeff Meyers, Mayor of the City of Shawnee, Kansas, do hereby proclaimthe month of July 2013 as Parks and Recreation Month in the City of Shawnee, and encourage all citizens to enjoy what our community has to offer by attending special events and visiting our parks and pools during the summer. Thank you again for accepting this proclamation. Very good. Thank you, Mr. Holman. E. APPOINTMENTS 1. Consider Appointments to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership. Appoint Becky Bieker to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership with a Term Expiring July 8, 2016.

4 into '.n.~.m-.«.-l;-..;-...:.;,:.:.:..u_. :.;.;.;._.~ 'y;';.;.;.; Page 4 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15092 MAYOR MEYERS: And now we l move to Item E, which is Appointments. Item Number 1 is to Consider Appointments to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership. The Downtown Partnership is recommending the appointments of Becky Bieker and Jeff Vaught to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership with terms expiring on July 8",2016. We need actions on each one of these. Item A would be to appoint Becky Bieker to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership with a term expiring July 8, 2016.,. l.. ; C I {. 1*: L :i f COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: S0 moved. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Second. MAYOR MEYERS: A motion has been made and seconded on this item. Any further discussion from the Council? is there anyone from the audience that would like to speak to this item? Good evening. MR. MORRIS: Good evening. My name is David Morris. I live at (Address Omitted). MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. MR. MORRIS: I come before you to read a letter that I had sent to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership in regards to this. It was not acknowledged, so I wanted to read it before the the public record. Before I start, I wanted to say that my concern is not with who is potentially being appointed to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership, but to the current makeup of the partnership at this point. So, I will read my letter. Paul, I wanted to share my concerns about the makeup of the current Shawnee Downtown Partnership Board in light of the Shawnee Downtown Partnership voting and new members. Sorry, l m nervous. Harder to be on this side. The Shawnee Downtown Partnership was formed and was always intended to be an equal partnership between public officials, downtown business owners and property owners and neighborhood residents. Might I add, it was always intended that the majority of the board s makeup always be a majority of non pub ic officials. It was formed this way to get the widest range of perspectives and input to solve downtown issues. My concern is that the Shawnee Downtown Partnership is currently heavy with public officials and business owners and very little residential or neighborhood representation. Downtown residents have a very different perspective on downtown issues than public officialsand business owners, and their input is crucial for true downtown progress to occur. I respectfully ask that additional residents be appointed to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership from the Trail Springs neighborhood and surrounding neighborhoods prior to the appointment of the current nominees. Thanks for your time and attention. Former Shawnee Downtown Partnership Chair and downtown resident, David Morris. So, my concern, Ijust wanted to restate my concern is not with who is being appointed, but the current makeup is overwhelmingly public officials and business owners with very few residents being on the Shawnee Downtown Partnership. i s MAYOR MEYERS: Very good. Ms. Distler and then Mr. Pflumm. COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: My only question. Did you say you edthat? MR. MORRIS: To the Shawnee Downtown Partnership.

5 ' think l m I how Page 5 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15091 COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: Okay. So, we did not receive it? MR. MORRIS: Correct. COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: Okay. Thank you. I just wanted to clarify, because I didn t receive it. MR. MORRIS: No. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Pflumm. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Well, and I had some questions in reference to this, because I myself had asked to be put on the Downtown Partnership during the makeup, and the mayor at that time actually he gave it to Councilmember Sawyer, and the reason being just because it was Councilmember Sawyer s ward. And I understood, not that, you know, hey, that s great. You know, he's got to take a role in where he lives and the people he represents and all that kind of stuff. And, you know, and then when I saw this come up, I thought, you know, I think it s great that we ve got people that want to serve, want to help and all that kind of stuff. But I would like to do it myself. So, I it s great, and I don t think know they got some bylaws that say one councilmember and the mayor. At least what they told me when they originally made it up. But I also think that they shouidn t limit it to the number of people. Like if you had 20 residents that wanted to not, l m just throwing a number, right. But if you had more residents that wanted to members, I think that that would be great also. So, I think that, you know, agree a little bit with your concerns. But I also agree that, hey, the more people that we get involved and try to help out downtown, then maybe the better off we all are. MR. MORRIS: And m not here to limit that. I think there is possibly a limit, I don t remember the bylaws verbatim. But I'm not -- I don t think it s -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: m - thinking from ten years ago ten years or -- MR. MORRIS: More than that. long has it been, CITY MANAGER GONZALES: The bylaws were updated in what, Paul? MR.-CHAFFEE: O3was -- CITY MANAGER GONZALES: Was when it was originally established, and then we updated the bylaws to -- MR. CHAFFEE: We changed the bylaws in 10. And there s no -- CITY MANAGERGONZALES: Right. But there s no limiton the number of people. MR. CHAFFEE: There s limit on the number. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: There is on the standing council position. It is a Ward ll

6 Page 6 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15090 Council position that s in the bylaws, so. But there s no limit on the number of people. And we had published it recently and these were the two letters we received. But the partnership conversation last week was certainly love to see some more residents interested and open to those submit a letter MAYOR MEYERS: And, Mr. Morris, your e mailwas discussed at the last meeting, because I was in attendance and it was brought up about your e mailand that situation. And one of the points that I made, and many times I get requests from people that want to serve on these different boards. And I have not had any single residents, just individual residents ask to be, you know, put on the board by any type of letter or anything of that nature. So, I think, again, I have I m all for residents being involved in -- the Downtown Partnership. But I haven't received any requests from any individuals. MR. MORRIS: l d like to sort of address that to a little bit. I have been on the Shawnee Downtown Partnership and I know -- I understand that. And sometimes it can be difficult to get residents to sort of participate. But you have Mark Mollentine who is a former Shawnee Downtown Partnership Chair. You have Dr. Alan Martin who was formerly on the Shawnee Downtown Partnership; And you have myself which was formerly on the Shawnee Downtown Partnership, all within the Trail Springs neighborhood. And I have checked with them and nobody has contacted us to see if we could recommend anybody or that we could let the neighborhood know that there was a need for someone to be on the Downtown Partnership. I know that you know the Gandys which live in our neighborhood. I know Neal knows a lot of people within the Trail Springs neighborhood. I m just thinking if we really want residents, and specifically Trail Springs residents within the Shawnee Downtown Partnership, it would seem to me a good policy to sort of reach out to people that used to serve on the Shawnee Downtown Partnership that live in Trail Springs to request at least some action on that. MAYOR MEYERS: And I know that, again, you are a resident of that neighborhood and I would say, Mr. Morris, if you find someone that s wanting to be involved in that activity, have them send me a letter of request and I can present that. I'd be glad to present that to the board. MR. MORRIS: But this the first time somebody has reached out to anybody in the Trail Springs neighborhood to request that that be the case. And so it just feels like -- feels like that sometimes there s not a desire to have residents on that, so. MAYOR MEYERS: I don't think that s ever been the case since l ve been on the board or when you were on the board or when Mr. Mollentine or Mr. Martin or anybody else had been on the board from the time that I've served as part of it. I think everyone has been more than welcoming of anybody serving on the Downtown Partnership board if they showed interest of wanting to be on that and it was within the parameters of the bylaws. I think that s the way it s been run since l ve been a part of it. MR. MORRIS: I would just encourage, you know, Julie Hurley is the Neighborhood Coordinator. You know, she would be a good person to reach out to the neighborhoods, not just ours, but neighborhoods throughout the downtown area to get representation for that. MAYOR MEYERS: And again, I would encourage you to have her Contact anyone that

7 there Page 7 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15089 would have an interest of serving on the board and have them send, you know, a letter of request and they would definitely be considered. Ms. Kuhn. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Mayor, I m going it s so easy to try to want to engage David, because I m so used to conversing with him. I m going to try really hard to not do that since we were trying to listen to comments ago. My question I guess is directed to you two, which is that the thought that s brought up is that is there may be some interest in being more proactive and adding some additional people to it. Before us today is two people who are interested in it and have expressed it. And if the Council moves forward and accepts them, is there anything that anyone knows within the bylaws that if in the next month, now this being more of a public topic, they come forward and say I m also interested in it, that would negate our ability to also appoint them if this moved forward in a positive direction? MAYOR MEYERS: N0. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: No reason not to. MAYOR MEYERS:And again, I would say that myself and the City Manager and Mr. - Sawyer, we re just members of the board and they have is a leadership of the board. I guess we call them chairman or president. I don't know what title we have given. But there is a person that is, as Mr. Morris served as the chairman of the board, and they are the leadership of that board and run the meetings and things of that nature. Mr. Vaught. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: And I just want to clarify something, because obviously some of the comments are about public officials as would be directed towards my -- appointment. And, you know, when I got elected a few years ago I had an interested in being on the Downtown Partnership. And, you know, obviously I couldn t, because Neal, which understandably so and it makes sense, would be the Council representative. It s his ward. You know, a couple of years ago I bought a building two blocks away from City Hall. Not only is my business downtown but I own property downtown. I have a vested interest in downtown. So, you know, and my letter to the partnership was not that I want to be there to represent the City or be there as a Councilmember, it would be as a business owner and a property owner in downtown Shawnee. You know, I have no interest in being the representative of the City in the Downtown Partnership. But I do have a vested interest. I do have an investment in downtown. And the industry I m in offers me a tremendous amount of insight into A, what s happening in downtown, what s happening in real estate, what s happening in development, what the wants and needs are. I see opportunities and it I think it does -- put me in a unique position. So, but Ijust think it's important that I clarify that as I m not trying to be on the Partnership as an elected representative or as a City Councilman, but as a business owner and a property owner of Shawnee, of downtown Shawnee. MR. MORRIS: I do have one last comment. If there aren t adequate numbers of residents that do come forward, it is still skewed heavy on the public officials and business property owners. Still a concern, because there s not that representation for neighborhood issues and neighborhood perspective on downtown issues. Thank you. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. Mr. Sawyer.

8 :.~.: we ' y;-.~;-;-:- - ~ <.;~;-:«;~;.:.:.:.: ~ >.-.-;<._ -.;,... M....- ;. :-_. _..: c.»._. ~.». 1.-.~:..-:~:..~:._-:.:..:;,:.:..:».u-.-,~.a:.~.- km.-.-:2;-;-; :.d'4 :4:g:L -:':L ; :-0: <:-:-. ~:--_i,_c; Page 8 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8,2013 Journal Page #15088 COUNCILMEMBER SAWYER: I believe I did read in the bylaws that there be, I don t know whether there s a set number, but maybe it states, and I didn t bring it, but there s an ideal number of 16 to 18. And I think this puts us at 14 if I m not wrong. My only question is, and I think I know the answer, but I don t think we ve ever put out in the CityLine that we are looking, you know, there s possibly openings on the Downtown Partnership, if you re interested, please apply. I don t ever recall seeing us do that. Maybe we did. I m not saying we didn t. I just don't recall ever seeing anything like that out there in the CityLine. But I do have concerns that it is becoming very top heavy in public officials. MAYOR MEYERS: Ms. Kuhn. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: I can t speak to whether or not it was in the CityLine, because I don t know it all. But I will say at least as far as general public knowing it, I received a phone call, an e mai actually from someone in Ward IIIwho was interested in serving on the Downtown Partnership and thought that it might have a different voice as a resident of another part of the town who saw the value in the downtown area and the growth and asked me about how to go about becoming one of the folks that might be looking at it. And then, because I was leaving town at the time, I know I referred them and they had a long conversation with Carol, which I think at the time made the decision that might not be the best fit for them. But obviously some waythe City must have had some information on it, because somebody came to me from Ward III interested as a resident and potentially finding out more information. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: We did just recently haven't used the CityLine, partly just because it s only published three times a year. But we did just recently put the notice about civil service opening, planning commission opening and the Downtown Partnership in the Dispatch and on our web page. So, that must have been what prompted them. And I do also just want to comment. We re having the Check-Up Meetings for our four neighborhoods on the eastern part of the community. And over the next two weeks, we ve got four meetings scheduled and that s one of the items we were going to make sure that those folks are aware of, that the Downtown Partnership board exists and we wouldwelcome membership from the neighborhoods, so. MAYOR MEYERS: Very good. Any other questions or comments? Anyone from the audience wanting to speak to this item? We ve got one before you. Good evening. If you state your name and address for the record, please. MR. BURKE: My name is David Burke. I live at (Address Omitted). That s Goddard Heights. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. MR. BURKE: t s the newest neighborhood in one of the oldest areas of Shawnee. I m a recent resident. l ve had property here for all my life and I just recently moved to" town. I am definitely an urban Shawnee individual at this point. I agree completely with David, "whathe has said about the makeup. We do need representation from the residents. And I m proud to be a property owner, a business owner and a resident of downtown Shawnee. There are a lot of people in this town, in this part of town that would serve. We need to have a little outreach in this direction. And I absolutely agree

9 being the Page 9 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15087 with David about this it s top heavy with City. Now, most of the stuff comes from the -- City. The staff works hard, staff does a good job. Neal does a good job. Everyone I've ever seen on there does a good job. But with all organizations as they age, a little burnout creeps in, a little complacency creeps in and some other things. I don t want this organization, which I have been more or less a part of for ten years, to go downhill, not represent what it shouldrepresent, and that is downtown. Yes, there are varying points of views. Yes, there are new ideas that can come from anywhere. All of these meetings are open meetings. Anyone can come. And as long as they re respectful, would be heard. Ideas come from everywhere and that s what we should keep in mind. I would propose, and this is not the forum to propose it at, but we have a lot of standing members on the SDP. In fact, they may outweigh the at arge members. I'm not certain of that. I did count them the other day, I think it s six and seven. There are, according to the way it was when I first came on the SDP, there were 18 members. There are currently 14. In the last month I have been approached by a banker, who is a resident of Shawnee who wants to be on who says he li be at the next meeting. l ve been and we had a banker, we no longer do. And this banker was speaking to me and said he can do us some good especially in the buy-down loans and those interest rates and it would save the City and the loan one taking the loan. Most of them good. And I'm all in favor or saving money. The other individual is an attorney. In the past we have had a local attorney on. Very good job. We could use both these positions. One is a resident, the other lives in an adjacent city. But they re both a very integral part of the City. And I will try and get both of them there at the next meeting. That has really nothing to do with what you re voting on tonight, whether to accept these two appointments. Mr. Vaught s name was brought up and I think he s well aware of my position on that. There sno point in going into that. I think we need to keep this thing vital and I think we need to keep it as individuals and without the slightest professionalism over individual ideas. And that s all I have to say. coloration of MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. This way. Good evening. If you l state your name and address for the record, please. MR. SNELL: Yeah. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. Gregg Snell, (Address Omitted). MR. SNELL: Are there current restrictions in the bylaws that members need to own business property in downtown? MAYOR MEYERS: Not to my knowledge. MR. SNELL:No. Okay. serve on the City Council? Are there any restrictionsin the bylaws for membershipif you MAYOR MEYERS: Ifyou serve on the Council -- MR. SNELL: Yes. - MAYOR MEYERS: a part of it? No. Except that, again, one Councilmember is part of the Downtown Partnership.

10 commercial ;-;.;.;.;.-.z.-.-. L~L«.-_.-;»;;;;;;.:2."-."; ,' -:~;.';: Page _ IO CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15086 MR. SNELL: But other than that there s no restrictions. So, the entire City Council could request to serve on the Downtown Partnership and they could and not violate the bylaws. COUNCILMEMBER SANDIFER: You have to own property. MAYOR MEYERS: No. They don t have to own property. MR. SNELL: You don t have to own property. participate, right? You just have to be a citizen and want to MAYOR MEYERS: Pardon? MR. SNELL: The restriction for the City Council representative is that s the representative. MAYOR MEYERS: Yes. MR. SNELL: Other than that, the entire City Council could also serve? COUNCILMEMBER SANDIFER: Don't you have to be in the downtown district or something, don t you? CITY MANAGER GONZALES: The intent and purpose of the membership talks about downtown property owners, people with a downtown interest and downtown residents. - It doesn t there s nothing binding about that. MR. SNELL: Okay. So, Dr. Kemmling as Ward ll representative could. Not as the Council representative, but as a member in that area. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: Legally there s nothing that I know of, could read the code and should read the code before I answer. But legally, there s nothing I know of that would preclude the possibility of every Councilmember -- realistically that would never be a possibility. MAYOR MEYERS: Or any citizen within the community. MR. SNELL: Right. Okay. From what I heard, what you said about the bylaws, the restrictions of the City Council representation is that at face value, Mr. Vaught s recommendation or appointment should be rejected outright. I understand that he s not going to be the representative, but he s not going to be able to separate and not bias any of his opinions from what he s doing on the City Council with what he s doing on the Downtown Partnership. He s also a commercial property realtor. As such, I believe he has an inherent conflict of interest. And again, being on the City Council, he can influence Council decisions that can personally benefit him. I believe there s an inherent conflict of interest. I also think that he should be rejected, in that, just last week he expressed his dislike of public scrutiny of oversight of his official City business. And as such, I think that would persist a suspicion of backroom deals throughout his term. And for those reasons, Iwould urge you -- o

11 S that Page 11 CITY COUNC L MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15085 COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Could I get a clarification on what you re talking about? MR. SNELL: Excuse me? COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Well, you just made an accusation. Could you clarify what you re talking about? MR. SNELL: If you want to hold your questions for the end, you re interrupting. COUNClLMEMBER NEIGHBOR: Mr. Mayor, I object to this line of questioning. MAYOR MEYERS: Yeah. Yeah. MR. SNELL: Now, m not questioning. MAYOR MEYERS: But, Mr. Snell. Well, you re making statements of something that there is, you know, no basis for as far as -- MR. SNELL: Would you like me to quote? MAYOR MEYERS: I understand the quote you re going to read. And again, that -- MR. SNELL: So, then it does have basis? MAYOR MEYERS: No, it doesn t have basis. person. And -- You re reading a quote of an opinion of a MR. SNELL: Mr. Vaught. m quoting Mr. Vaught from last week s Council Meeting. l can quote him verbatim. MAYOR MEYERS: That he does backroom deals. MR. SNELL: That he himself said. MAYOR MEYERS: Again, I don t know what you re -- MR. SNELL: I mean, if you -- just that doesn t merit consideration here? COUNCILMEMBER NEIGHBOR: This is not a -- we are here to debate this. Weare not here -- MR. SNELL: Right. COUNCILMEMBER NEIGHBOR: -- for a personal drudging or finding of information. And we re not here for you to cross-examine the members of the Committee and we re not going to get involved with Q&A, something that is you re bringing up. MR. SNELL: Great. Sorry, Jeff. I'd love to engage in Q&A. But backto my request, that you oppose his appointment, because he has expressed those opinions publicly. And if you examine the audio record that you ve recorded, you will see that that does

12 ,,.»' _\'-;» ~L»C-I-..-I-L SL '. J -:.~.'.-.'-'.'-1'-'.-. L-L;.:.; _'-; ;--.-_\_-.<.-,-_ ~_.. _-.' _ '.'l;..;.';.;..:;.:;-_-.-.:4:-,-.2 _ _~;-'._-_:,-;~:;I_;;;;:L;L-( UL-:i*:'L~_; _ _..LL..1LL:. -_-_-.~.~_-_-.-.-.« ~.-..:....,.. _-.~... ' Page 12 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15084 have basis. And I think that s an important consideration. He s on the Council. You have bylaws that restrict it to one Council representative. And I think you re splitting hairs on trying to slip him in here. MAYOR MEYERS: The bylaws don t restrict to one Council representative. there can be or one of the members will be a Council representative. It says that MR. SNELL: So, the rest of the entire Council could, theoretically? MAYOR MEYERS: Theoretically, yes. MR. SNELL: Great. Are we doing Q&A? MAYOR MEYERS: No. MR. SNELL: I'm happy to Q&A. MAYOR MEYERS: No. But what I will say is, again, the Council will have the final vote on these appointments. MR. SNELL: No. lunderstand that. MAYOR MEYERS: But the board -- MR. SNELL: And you re taking input from the public. MAYOR MEYERS: The board had the opinion that they were in favor of both these individuals being put onto the board of the Downtown Partnership. MR. SNELL: lunderstand that. All right. Thanks. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Mayor, can I ask a question? MAYOR MEYERS: Yes, Mr. Vaught. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: And you just brought that up, so people understand this process. Our names came before the board of the Downtown Partnership and you guys took a vote. So, this is clear there on me, how many votes were there against me? CITY MANAGER GONZALES: Yeah. I honestly didn t see. It was a ballot and I honestly didn t see the final tally. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Okay. MAYOR MEYERS: And I don t see the final tally either. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Okay. But we know that I was obviously approved by the board?

13 Page 13 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15083 CITY MANAGER GONZALES: Yes. MAYOR MEYERS: Both. ' COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: The majority of the board, because that s why I m on there. MAYOR MEYERS: Yes. Both you and Ms. Leeper. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: And which the board is a mix of people that -- COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Is not made up of the City Council. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: whoever, so. that s not the City Council. It s business owners. lt s MAYOR MEYERS: Again, I don t know how many were totaled present that night. I think we, as Mr. Sawyer said, we have 14 total members, but I don t think all 14 were in attendance that night. But there were a good number. MR. SNELL: And this is great, Mr. Neighbor, because we got opinion and opinion. It wasn t Q&A. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Burke made, in fact, I think you said 7-6. MR. BURKE: I d like to make a clarification on that. Two people left before the vote on Mr. Vaught was taken. And I questioned before the vote was taken whether we still had a quorum at that point. It was a whole question of procedure in my opinion. But that s my opinion. I would really like to see the Councilmembers at least table Mr. Vaught s appointment, at least until we can look into this a little further. And the last comment that Mr. Vaught just made about his approval is very questionable. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Chaffee. MR. CHAFFEE: Yeah. At the Partnership meeting there were 12 members that were present. There were two members that left prior to the item being on the agenda for the appointments to the board. There were 10 who voted. With the 13 members that we have currently, 7 would be a quorum. So, there was a quorum and then there was a majority of those who voted that recommended approval of the two individuals this evening that have been brought forward to the governing body. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. Ms. Distler and then Ms. Kuhn. ii 1 i ; : I2 " COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: I actually didn t have any questions until we started talking about the whole Council could be on the board. 80, because it's an open meeting, there wouidn t then be any type of quorum issues or binding decisions made or anything like that if we had a majority of Councilmembers on the committee? If all eight of us and the Mayor were on this committee and discussions were had and decisions were made, would that be a problem or not?

14 we would in ~ :~: :4:.;.;...-.'.:.:u:y,E-.-;-..-_~ <.~.-.-.r _-.~. ;;.:,:.:.-.:a:.?;: ;.;;;;a:u:e:--:-:-1~;-;-;-.-;*.-.~.-.~.-.-aid«.... r_l._......,. -.. LI.-.. «_.,..._.;... CITY MANAGER GONZALES: It would be a problem. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Yes. CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15082 COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: And that s what m trying to clarify. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: And I don t believe that any of you all ~ COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Would be that. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: let that even happen. That would not be a - reasonable thing. And I might just the packet on page 57, it specifically lines out the criteria and the kinds of people that we re looking for. At arge positions shall include individuals representing the following downtown interest, business owners, commercial property owners, neighborhood groups, downtown churches. So, it s fairly clear on what kinds of interest. And I find it hard to believe that the majority of Council would want to serve on that. It would certainly change the whole nature of it. COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: But we could have possibly Mr. Pflumm, Mr. Kemmling, Mr. Sawyer, Mr. Vaught. Mickey throws me in there because of our family business. - So, we could. We could all all do have a, I mean, most of us have either a business or residence in the area. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: Well, I could argue every Councilmember has an interest in downtown and cares about downtown. COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: Right. Well, I mean, I just -- my only concern is possibly that the Downtown Partnership should look at their bylaws so we don t get a majority of Council representation on, I mean, two members is not a majority. But I m talking about in the future that that couldn t happen, where binding decisions are being made or decisions of agreement before they re coming before the City. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: Yeah. The bylaws could certainly state that. They could state lots of things. You know, it s hard to think of all the possible scenarios that might happen and write bylaws that would preclude every one of them. So, I -- COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: Well, I think it would be really clear if you d say it had to be no more than two or no more than three Councilmembers, governing body members or something. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: And would we want to say no more than three Planning commissioners. And where do you draw the line? COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: Yeah. See, to me, that -- I don t know. Just with past experiences of things that have been put in the context, they ve been put in - okay. I just wouldnot want to ride the slippery slope I guess is what I'm saying. m not making any accusations whatsoever. I just see that there could be potential ugly situations.. And if I were on the Downtown Partnership, I would think I would want to ook.at the bylaws to try to prevent anything like that from happening or assumptions being made

15 like Page 15 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Joumal Page #15081 or, you know, things being seen, whether true or not that, well, you know, you ve got a majority of you on there so this is how, you know, accusations and that s all l m saying. I just l m just offering a suggestion to the Downtown Partnership. Personally I would -- - try to avoid the slippery I said, two Councilmembers isn t an issue. But when you all said we could all be on it, itjust kind of bothered me. So, that s -- MAYOR MEYERS: Ms. Kuhn. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: ljust wanted a clarification from Mr. Chaffee. Mr. Vaught s vote was not done with a totally different number of people in the Downtown Partnership than Ijust blanked on her last name. l m sorry. Becky -- I - MS. BIEKER: Bieker. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Bieker. l m so sorry, Ms. Bieker. I apologize. I just blanked on here name. l m so sorry. MR. CHAFFEE: I can t remember if Councilmember Sawyer had left between the votes or before both of the votes were taken. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Okay. So, Mr. Sawyer was one who was absent at Mr. Vaught s? - MR. CHAFFEE: Right. And Ms. Copp had to leave the meeting early to attend a Rotary function. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Okay. MR. CHAFFEE: So, she wasn t there for those. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: So, on top of it, the City Councilmember was not there to advocate or negate Mr. Vaught s as well. So, it was made by non Counci member members of the DowntownPartnership for the recommendations. MR. CHAFFEE: And the members of the Partnership who voted on the recommendation for Mr. Vaught did not include Councilmember Sawyer. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Did not include a councilmember. Okay. MR. CHAFFEE: He had left prior to that. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: That s fine. And then I wasn t even going to this one. But I would just say to Ms. Dist er s thing. That when we have Downtown Partnerships or any other thing that we have, they take letters in and it went to the Downtown Partnership. I would assume that the Downtown Partnership folks would see some of that slippery slope and wouldnot probably vote to recommend the third, the fourth, the fifth, the sixth, the seventh and the eighth Councilmember to be members of their 18 person group. Common sense is sort of just one of those things. And, gee, if we could make it any easier, Ms. Distler and I could probably say right now we won t put our names in when they ask for it while the other two are sitting there. And we ye just solved the problem.

16 I - ~.-.-.~--..*.:.,p;.,-; _.,.;2..::.~..a:.;:;;.:.. L ;-:.«:~:.;=...'..~.'..:;.:-. _~. _-_v.-_ _-_-.-_-_-_-.2-.~_-,4--_.-_~ -.---_-..::.-.:~..-:.~.-.~. -:. -.:...L-_...:.;.;;:--;-: :-:-:-3:».-_-_--_». -_-.-: ~-.-,-, :1-;-Lil;'.l". _ ;'_ ; V.2:?'_?_'.'_L"_ \~_r_\:-_ v :';~L*' ~.';._*.;;.;.;'\;.- _.;.;.-_, Page 16 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal P_age #15080 So, maybe we don t need to borrow quite that much trouble. MAYOR MEYERS: The board had a definite discussion about the number and the different types of membership of the board. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Exactly. And I think it is completely true to say that A, every person in this Council has somewhat of a vested interest in it. And B, in Shawnee everyone is married to somebody, related to somebody and has a cousin who is somebody that we would all fit in it. My fiancé s building is going to fit within something that would qualify as a Downtown Partnership. I hereby tell you I will not put my name in submit at any point in time while sitting on the Council to be a Downtown Partnership member while we have other sitting ones. t s solved. lt s kind of silly in some ways. I,, MAYOR MEYERS: Anybody else have a comment? Mr. Pflumm? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: I've probably got a lot of lot of comments. But I think it s great that he s wanting to be on there. I think the first thing we have is we have a motion and a second I believe for Ms. Bieker on here. MAYOR MEYERS: That s correct. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: So, we would just go with her for now. MAYOR MEYERS: Okay. We l move forward-with the appointments. We have a motion and a second to appoint Becky Bieker to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership with a term expiring July 8,2016. All in favor signify by saying aye. COUNCILMEMBERS: Aye. MAYOR MEYERS: Opposed no. Motion passes. (Motion passes 8-0). Appoint Jeff Vaught to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership with a Term Expiring July_8, MAYOR MEYERS: Item B would be an Appointment to Jeff Vaught to Shawnee Downtown Partnership with a term expiring July 8,2016. _ COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT:CanI ask a real question? Well, go ahead. COUNCILMEMBER SANDIFER: Motion to approve. MAYOR MEYERS: Yes, Mr. Vaught. ' COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: m quite comfortable with the Downtown Partnership s vetting on this and am comfortable with a second. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Vaught. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: And can I clarify. Carrie said there s no conflict on me voting. a

17 ' Page 17 CITY COUNCILMINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15079 CITY MANAGERGONZALES: That s correct. I talked to Mr. Rainey prior to the meeting. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Thank you. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: So, I do have a question. Are all the Downtown Partnership meetings publicized for like news media or are they open to the public? MAYORMEYERS: They are open to the public. CITY MANAGERGONZALES:Uh-huh. PFLUMM: They are open to the public and they are COUNCILMEMBER means the Dispatch or whoever can be there at any time? which CITY MANAGERGONZALES:Sure. MAYORMEYERS: Sure. CITY MANAGERGONZALES:Sure. MAYORMEYERS: Yeah. We have a motion and a second to approve Jeff Vaught to the Shawnee Downtown Partnership with a term expiring on July 8",2016. All in favor signify by saying aye. MR. ERLICHMAN: No questions? No comments? MAYORMEYERS: Opposed no. COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: No. MAYOR MEYERS: Do what? MR. ERLICHMAN:I thought separately. you were taking each nominee, l m sorry, each nominee MR. ERLICHMAN:I do not want to speak about Ms. Bieker s application, but I do want to speak about Mr. Vaught s. MAYOR MEYERS: Okay. We will not count the vote until we have any other comments on this item. MR. ERLICHMAN:Thank you, Mr. Mayor. MAYORMEYERS: Good evening. please. If you ll state your name and address for the record, MR. ERLICHMAN:Ray Erlichman, (Address Omitted). I had two comments, but I'm going to have to hold off on one of them. I did not hear Ms. Gonzales reply as to - Vaught s question about a conflict with him voting on this or what I think he did ask a

18 - or will when ;.~_._-.;._,1._,v.;.;.;._.L.;.;..;._.;~_._;..;._-;~_-;:;-;-..-:.-;r..~.:.-.-.".:.:.;r:-:-c-:-:-:.:.:.«:.:-:-:~2; :iv;-;~.»~;- :. C:~.~:.. :.-;-.--»~_-:.' :- - _'v;-:-2-;-gs;-:j:ca: ;5:;:;;:;:;2.:-;S;L. :$:-:;: - Page 18 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15078 minute ago if there was a conflict. And what was the response? CITY MANAGER GONZALES: I spoke to Mr. Rainey prior to the meeting. conflict of interest. There is no MR. ERLICHMAN: There is no conflict. Okay. I didn't hear it. And the old ears are getting old. So, two comets are almost diametrically opposed. Number one, I agree with Mr. Burke that the application of Mr. Vaught should be tabled, but for a different reason. Even though there s no conflict, I just think, I don t know, he should have recused himself from this whole section of the meeting just out of courtesy. That s number one. Number two, it s no secret that Mr. Vaught and I have been at ends or loggerheads or butt hitting - head-butting many times. And when I heard that he had relocated his business from Kansas City, Kansas, I was kind of happy. I thought it was very nice. I thought it was a good move. More businessesin downtown. And he kind of reminded me a little bit of Mr. Pflumm taking over the bank across the street. So, for that I d like to congratulate you. I think it was very nice, because we all talk about economic development in downtown Shawnee and bringing businesses in brings people in and brings additional spending in, because employees will go out to lunch and all that, you know, I don t have to go through that. l m preaching to the choir in that, and that s some of the comments you guys use when you talk about bringing new businesses into town. So, congratulations on opening up your business in downtown. I was just curious though, how many - employees are there be active in that business, sir? MAYOR MEYERS: Yeah. Again, Mr. Erlichman, this is not a question/answer time penod. MR. ERLICHMAN: Oh, I see. MAYOR MEYERS: lt s time for you to make comment. And so if you could just -- MR. ERLICHMAN: I was just curious, because - when we talk about Mr. Nave comes up, he talks about businesses moving into town. He always gives us an overture an overview of how many employees are in the business. And I just thought that was an appropriate comment as far as how many -- MAYOR MEYERS: And comment is fine. But your - question. MR. ERLICHMAN: Well, question. l restate that. I thought it was an appropriate question. How many employees are involved? That s all. And we re not going to get an answer on that. MAYOR MEYERS: No. MR. ERLICHMAN: All right. Sounds good. You have a good evening. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. Is there anyone else from the audience that would like to speak to this item? Please come forward. MR. SNELL: Just a point of clarification --

19 Page 19 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15077 MAYOR MEYERS: If you l state your name and address forthe record, please. MR. SNELL: Gregg Snell, (Address Omitted). Haven t moved. As a clarification, I want to read the quote that was the basis of my comment previously. This is from Mr. Vaught on July 2 at the Committee Meeting. This is in the context of the discussion of acquiring, potentially requiring ipads for the Council. I would say just, I would like to, and if we do something I would rather have an allowance than the City would provide us, and that s because, you know, when we say ipad, I d rathersay tablet, because I would rather have an Android device than an ipad, But, and then also because it s something that I would rather own myself and not be subject to requests that, you know, give it up because someone else wants to see what s on it, because it s a City owned device. Direct quote and you re welcome to check that against your own audio record. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. Is there any other comments from the audience on this item? Seeing none, we have a motion and second. Mr. Kemmling? COUNCILMEMBER KEMMLING: Can I make one comment? COUNCILMEMBER KEMMLING: I think probably everyone up here has said something at this point in time. I wasn't around when we formed the Downtown Partnership so I don t know the original intent of why they specified one member from the Council. Whether they meant to preclude others or not I really don t know. We heard a lot of input tonight as far as having the diversity of opinion on it. It sounds like we might not have that as much. I think Mr. Vaught has a lot of the qualifications that would make him a good appointment for this. I know Dan had expressed interest as well. I think he also has qualifications. The question that just kept getting brought up tonight was whether there was a conflict, because of their position here and whether that mindset could be separated from the other. And as far as that slippery slope goes, it s easy to say it won t be an issue now. I don t know going forward if it would be. I personally feel it s probably not the best precedent. So, I don t think I would go to support either Mr. Vaught or Mr. Pflumm if they were to put in their nominations as well. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank._you. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Mr. Mayor. MAYOR MEYERS: Yes, Mr. Mayor. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: And I don t think the conflicts he s referring to a Councilmember. I believe the conflict is referring to me being a commercial real estate broker. So, the question would be, does a commercial real estate broker have any possibility of bringing anything of value to the Downtown Partnership, who one of his missions is to attract business to downtown Shawnee, right? ii. i? MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. Any other comments from the Council? We have a motion and a second to approve Mr. Vaught. I I take a roll call vote. Mr. Neighbor? COUNCILMEMBER NEIGHBOR: Aye.,MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Pflumm?

20 Page 20 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15076 COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Aye. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Kemmling? COUNCILMEMBER KEMMLING: No. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Sawyer? COUNCILMEMBER SAWYER: l m going to abstain. MAYOR MEYERS: Ms. Kuhn? COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Aye. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Vaught? COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Aye. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Sandifer? COUNCILMEMBER SANDIFER: Aye. MAYOR MEYERS: Ms. Distler? COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: No. MAYOR MEYERS: Motion passes 5-2 and one abstention (Councilmember Sawyer). (Motion passes 6-2 it is common law and Kansas rule that the abstainer is counted with the majority. AG Opinion et al.) F. PUBLIC ITEMS 1. Establish Budget Limit and Set Public Hearing for the 2013 Amended Budget and the 2014 Budget. A. Approve the Notice of Public Hearing Amending the 2013 Budget for July 22, 2013, at 7:30 P.M MAYOR MEYERS: At this time we move on to Public Items, which is Item F. Item Number 1 is to Establish a Budget Limit and Set a Public Hearing for the 2013 Amended Budget and the 2014 Budget. Kansas statutes require the City to set a public hearing for the 2013 amended budget and the 2014 budget. Included are the notices setting the time and date for the public hearing for July 22",2013, at 7:30 p.m. Item A would be approving the Notice of a Public Hearing amending the 2013 budget for July 22",2013, at 7:30 p.m. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: So moved. COUNCILMEMBER SANDIFER: Second. MAYOR MEYERS: A motion has been made and seconded on this item. Any further

21 since since I I ve ;;~;~.--;~;-3; '...:.?.'r..'xbkii -. ~;-.':. 2'.-;-4:. Page 21 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15075 discussion from the Council? Is there anyone from the audience that would like to speak to this item? Seeing none, all in favor signify by saying aye. COUNCILMEMBERS: Aye. MAYOR MEYERS: Opposed no. Motion passes. (Motion passes 8-0) B. Approve the Notice of Public Hearing for the 2014 Budget for July 22, 2013 at 7:30 P.M. Establishing the Tax Levy at $17,023,956 with an Estimated Mill Levy of for a Total Budget of $85,596,049. MAYOR MEYERS: Item B would be to Approve the Notice of a Public Hearing for the 2014 Budget for July 22,2013, at 7:30 pm., Establishing the Tax Levy at $17,023,956 with an Estimated MillLevy of for a Total Budget of $85,596,049. COUNCILMEMBER SANDIFER: Move for approval. COUNCILMEMBER NEIGHBOR: Second. MAYOR MEYERS: A motion has been made and seconded on this item. Any further discussion from the Council? Mr. Pflumm? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: I don t have a problem with setting the public hearing. But I was asked at the last Council meeting to kind of put togethersome issues I myself have and a drastic belief that we need to spend more money on roads than we currently have over 2008 or since actually And so I can just read them off to you. I - know Carol sent out an e maiiwith a limited number of items on there that and with the staff recommendation and looking for a recommendation. And I believe we all sent that back to her. And in that we ve got some land assessment software which is like $300,000. CIP tracking system software, that was $50,000. Vehicle replacement for non publicsafety, that was 100,000. Facility repairs, $300,000. City Hall generator and the PIO. I don t know where they re at in this whole budget, because I don t know exactly how that ended up. But I would recommend that we take that $890,000 right there and apply that to roads and road repairs. I also have went through some of - the information that Carol provided all of us and have come up got some concerns. I know that, and I brought this up several years in the past about the transportation and reception and I like our police officers and firemen and all that kind of stuff. But I kind of haven t been to one of those receptions where, you know, we either have a retirementguy or something, and it s not because I don t like the guy or we get a new guy. I think it s great that we have people retiring, then we got new firefighters and police officers. I just don t want to go to the reception, because the City is paying for that kind of stuff. And so that s in my own opinion, which I brought it up five years ago, that doesn t happen very often in the private sector. So, those are and I just picked a -- couple of them to reduce. And the Public Works and IT and Parks, that comes up with about $39,900 worth of funds just for transportation and reception. Okay. An.d then if you go to dues and subscriptions which is another item in the budget, and both of these items seem to have been reduced largely. But then in 2012 to 13, to 13 to 14, have seen, you know, drastic increases. And so, you know, I think if we were doing okay in 2012 with those reduced numbers, because of the economy, I don t know why that we would increase those at this time. And so -- D

22 ' Page 22 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Joumal Page #15074 MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Pflumm, do you know what those increases were? Do you have that or -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Actually I do have that. So, in Public Works we went from 44 well, actually if you want to go to Transportation and Reception r I. MAYOR MEYERS: I was talking about the dues and -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Okay. MAYOR MEYERS: it might have the other number. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: No problem. give you the dues and subscriptions. Went from $4,477 to $5,800 just for Public Works. IT, $315 to $600. Parks went from $16,127 to $20,900. E COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: I m sorry. Can you repeat that, Dan? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: $20,900. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: What was it prior? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: $16,127. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: So, it was $6,000 total between all ofthose less the -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Well, if you add it up. Go ahead and add it up. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: I did. The one was like $300 different. The one was like $1,300 different. And I think that one was like $4,100. I mean, that s ballpark. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: I m recommending really getting rid of those. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: So, we don t do any dues or subscriptions? We don t -- they don t belong to professional organizations? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: I don t know. I m trying to figure out in Public Works and T s and Parks why you would actually have to have those over our road maintenance. So, that s my opinion. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: So, we should -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: And I still have more to do here. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: So, like our engineer folks wou dn t belong to CCIM? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Repair office furniture is another item. So, that Public Works budget in 2012 was zero. And that s $1,000 now. IT, and I m not sure what this is, because I don t have good, you know, call out into all these numbers. But $31,695, and that number is fluctuated and it s at $31,000 for Parks, cultural, you know,

23 why six if it s I I ' Page 23 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15073 basically the Parks Department is $9,229 in 2012 and $52,000 in So, not quite how we had such a drastic increase. And then really the only had asked for a lot of information on land improvement, because that s been a big item of question for several, several years of, you know, what that is and all that kind of stuff. And got a little bit of the input from Carol. And basically what I would say on that one is reducing Parks from $493,000 or reducing it the $93, , the total savings of just those items there is $961,000. So, and then I went ahead and gone into the checkbook. You know, we ve got -- we get checkbook items. So, I went ahead and just -- I searched on a couple things. I think when we first got the checkbook online, the very first thing that I did was I searched Starbuck s. And I brought this up, I don t know even know. How many - years ago, I m not sure, but there was $1.89 or a dollar some could go back in our minutes and find out. But basically I said at that time, that s most likely someone from the City going into Starbuck s and using either their purchasing card or I m not sure how they do that, but they went in there. They didn t buy, you know, the whole department, you know, Starbuck s, but it looks as though the individual bought themself Starbuck s which is really not frowned upon in the business world. So, I did it again. And there s -- I searched on Starbuck s. There s some Starbuck s charges in there. I understand that s not a big deal. But several of those were written against Transportation and Reception which is understandable. That s what they should be coded as. But then there was three of them that were directly against Parks and Rec equipment. So, I don t know how that s just an accounting issue or whatever it is. I would think we d want that to be accounted to the right department and all that kind of stuff. So, those are just little things. And, you know, I mjust going to throw out another. I m not worried that we're spending money on certain items. _ t s,you know, some of the things when you go and look, it s a little bit alarming when you get that. And another thing, and I don t know this is probably totally legitimate and all that kind of stuff. And Cindy Swartz had a charge in there, not sure when it was, for a Journalism class. And it was under Parks and Rec. So, I don t know if those type of things, training and all that kind of stuff comes under Dues and Subscriptions. I don't know how the Police Department does it, but I know they have to go. But I don t believe that Parks and those guys need to go to training and to be in, you know, a lot of engineering type of associations and stuff like that. So anyway, and then the last one is -- I was just scrolling down through there and I saw the Cinderella Ball. And, you know, I know that we spent several thousand dollars on the Cinderella Ball. And I don t really know exactly what that is. So, if, you know, anybody wanted to explain that, that would be great. MAYOR MEYERS: I'll let the City Manager. I can explain it, but it s the Father/Daughter Dance that we have had for as long as l ve been a Councilmember that I can remember. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: We have to have two now, because they sell out. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Right. night of it. It sells out so much and we had to have a second COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Well, how come if it s selling out, how come we re spending -- I don t know. I didn t even add it up, but it s several thousand dollars. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: You see the expense side. You didn t see the revenue

24 Page 24 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15072 side. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Okay. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: There s a fee -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: I would like to see that. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: -- for that. COUNCILMEMBER DISTLER: (lnaudible) tickets are incredibly costly. :-2»:-;-;--;-:;4_4;.4.iLE1;-:4...-c».-1.1;-.u_._l.'5 7"._._._._.: ; 3' " So, (inaudible). COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: And that s why l m not arguing that we re spending some of these things. l m just saying ljust don t know, l m talking about, you know, the other side of it, so.._ r? 5;-..5.'3..~ "5. _.. - E~" -'.": " -3L. ', FẠ 3 MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Pflumm, I would say anytime you have questions of that nature, all you have to do is ask staff and they give you an answer. But especially that one would have been easily -- ti, COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: You guys had asked me to come up with some specifics. Now, the Cinderella Ball I didn t even care about. MAYOR MEYERS: Well, you say you guys, I didn t do that. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: (lnaudible) MAYOR MEYERS: Yeah. And so is there anything else that you wanted to add on that? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Well, I could go through a lot more detail. But I just figured for tonight, I mean, just throwing out, l m not saying down to pennies or anything. I know that wefrejust voting on a limit tonight and setting a public hearing. 80, otherthan that -- MAYOR MEYERS: But it s a good to have a discussion, that if you re having a specific proposal that you re making to the Council, and then the Council can have a discussion or rather they, you know -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: l m aware of that. - MAYOR MEYERS: what they agree or disagreewith or if they want to make any changes so that staff is prepared to make those changes by recommendation of the Council, I think that s most appropriate. So, do you have a total amount that - COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Just those (inaudible) items, those $961,000. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: And I want to be clear that $300,000 is not included in the budget, the land assessment software.

25 I I -_.:. :.'.'.-.2:.:-.:.:.;.:.:.;.:.:.:.:.;.:.;.;._._._.._v.._._..._..._-.._~.;.;;;'.:.;\:.;-;~; 4-;~;-..1-;.'-. Page 25 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15071 COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: So, but I didn't get a clear indication of what was and what wasn t and so -- CITY MANAGER GONZALES: The memo for the packet, for the Committee Meeting -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Okay. - CITY MANAGER GONZALES: listed exactly all the items that were included. And in fact, on the front page of this memo I believe they are listed on page 63, the issues that we ve talked about at many of our committee meetings. The ones that are included in the budget are listed on page 63 of the packet. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Great. And I just want to thank you for sending the information out in detail on the, you know, on the items that I had asked you for. l m still going through that. So, you know, I appreciate it. I think it was great. l m not sure when you sent that out. Was it -- MAYOR MEYERS: So -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Was that Friday or was that Monday? COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Well, let me ask a question real quick. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Vaught. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Oh, l m sorry. When you started ~~ items or five items right off the bat. you named off four COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Yep. Those are right off of Caro s sheet. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: I know. But can weget a clarification on those, that first group of which ones are and aren t in the budget, because you made it sound like they were all in the budget. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Well, there was only one that she indicated that wasn t in the budget. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: You might list them again. Capital Improvement software was not in. I can t remember what all you listed. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: But also there was $100,000 vehicle, new vehicle -- or non-emergency vehicle replacement? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Not in public safety. is that in there? COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Not in public safety I mean. CITY MANAGER GONZALES: The vehicle. Some amount is in there for vehicle replacements. i>

26 3 hang and Page 26 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15070 COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: So, it was 100,000 in our spreadsheet. MS. ROGERS: There was a reduction of 100,000 that was proposed. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: So, it s not in there? MS. ROGERS: It's not in there. Right. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Okay. MS. ROGERS: The $50,000 for e-ticket, or not e-ticketing, the Capital Improvement Plan tracking system is not in there. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Yeah. It should mention that. So, facility repairs of 300,000 and City Hall generator and PIO, are those the only three items that are in there? Well, excuse me. I didn t say those are the only three. Those are the three on my list that I just mentioned. MS. ROGERS: The $300,000 for facility, that s also a reduction of 300,000. The generator is in the budget in 2013-R. What was the -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: PIO. MS. ROGERS: The PIO is in the budget. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: So, on my list you're telling me that there's only two, the PIO and the -- COUNCILMEMBER NEIGHBOR: Generator. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: -- generator. MS. ROGERS: Right. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: There s no repairs? on a second. There s no facility MS. ROGERS: There are facility repairs. They re not the $300,000. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: What are they? MS. ROGERS: lt s $800,000. It was originally larger than that and it was reduced by $300,000. The $800,000 also includes equipment. lt s the total transfer to that fund. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: So, that s a little confusing in our spreadsheet thing there, because it said $300,000, you know, do you recommend it was under Staff Recommends in our original spreadsheet from Carol. MS. ROGERS: On the worksheet. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: The worksheet.

27 all -=:-;'~:-:~:~:»;-;3il:i;i: :-':l_.t- ~. -.'-.g._p ~ Page 27 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page # '- -;::'.._m -'~ ~ ci::;'a3 ;"-ic;3.* CITYMANAGER GONZALES: Correct. Meeting, the numbers were -- In the budget packet memo for last Committee MS. ROGERS: The worksheet said staff recommended reduction, deferral, mill shift or reserves. So, it was talking about reductions or deferrals. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: It didn't have a negative $300,000 in that worksheet, is that correct or not correct? MS. ROGERS: lt s not shown as negative. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: lt s positive, correct? CITY MANAGER GONZALES: lt s in the reduction column. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Is it in the reduction column? MS. ROGERS:lt s a number in the reduction column. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Is there positives in that same column or is that -- MS. ROGERS: They re all positive in the column. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Okay. So, it's reductions? of those in that column are MS. ROGERS: Yes. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: I'lljust pull that up from my own personal knowledge. MAYOR MEYERS: Ms. Kuhn. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: How do we get on here again? COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: I think this is where we go every time. You know, I think Dan said it before. He s talked about some of these things for the last six years. COUNCILMEMBERPFLUMM: Eight years. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: And I got a look from him and a rolled eye and kind of a comment back wheni said at the last meeting we were at that I didn t want to just have this come back again and be here. I didn t want this to say there s lots of places we can save money, there s things we don t need, give us specifics. And the answer I got back from you is, that s what I said I m going to do, I m going to give you specifics. But I m listening to the stuff again tonight, and I will, I think there s a couple on them". That's what we should be as Councilmembers voting yes or no. You gave us one specific. Your recommendation is we do not pay any dues or subscriptions at all for the Planning and Engineering Department. is that what I m getting from you currently? The budget had $1,300 in it and you say we should pay zero.

28 how first so ' _._=;._.:.:...:.:,.:.;1;; :-.2.2>.:e;:L-1; 2.;._.;»:; ;;:4:;;-:;;:.:.:.:l: 5? Page 28 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15068 COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Thirteen hundred. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: I think that s what your number was. I apologize, I don t ~ have it right in front of me. You quoted it and I think it $1,300 for COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Dues and Subscriptions, there s no 1,300. But I, yeah. I think roads are more important, yes. - COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Okay. So, you re saying we should with that, can you tell me what that equates to? Because l m assuming since that was the idea you wanted to go, you ve talked to somebody on staff and said what is that that we re canceling. Because my first assumption would be that in Planning and Development, that means that we are canceling membership to CCIM. It means we re canceling membership to professional organizations. That means we re canceling subscriptions to to gain better information and peer group publications on things that we are working on in the City. So, in essence, your suggestion is that our people belong to no professional organizations and do not get any of the additional information that comes from that, and then we take that $1,300 or $1,500 instead and put it, this year alone or forever into potholes? I mean, do they never belong to them? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: l m just throwing Ifyou got to really -- l m throwing out some suggestions. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Right. And l m listening. So, right now as a Council -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: If you got a really good reason to be in a professional organization of all, l m an engineer and I know that most engineers pay their own dues and subscriptions. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: I belong to banking organizations and I don t pay it because I work for a company. So, everybody that works for you pays all of their own? I mean, do any of your folks, do you belong to professional organizations? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Absolutely. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: So you do. And everybody that works for you pays their own? Because my brother in lawis an engineer and he doesn t pay his own, his company pays them. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: The largest engineering firm in Kansas City, every single guy there pays his own. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: So. I 5 1 COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: The largest in Kansas City. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Okay. So, if our people can t afford it or choose not to, then the opinion that you re telling us is that it is better for our people to choose not to do it and we don't value those things as a City, we. don t feel like we should have that as something they belong to? This is a yea or no. As a Council our answers are really

29 I - - our T -_',\'.»'A' - 'n.n-.n.; o->. f L'--4'. :-;'L-...'_'A'L _ ; \;:; :C::; :J? 1>i'i,I :L l.'_~:'_ ; :"\:\ Ls;.LnL-:' Page 29 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15067 simple. We don t have a, is it good, should you belong, should you not. We have a yes or a no to whether or not something goes in the budget. All we get is a staff provided us with this is what we think is the best and most balanced way to meet the very differing needs of our community and here is how we think it could be best. And then it comes to the Council and our answers either are, yes, we agree with that or no, I'm not going to approve it. And if we say no, we re not going to approve it, then as a Council, our responsibility is then to say, I would approve this. I think we should cancel all memberships for this and move that over. And then as a Council as a whole we have to say, yes, I agree, none of our folks are going to have any of their professional organizations paid at all and we will not have any subscriptions to any professional publications for our Planning and Development Department at all and then we will move that $1,500 or $1,700 or whatever that number is into roads. And then we have to make a decision, is our policy that they never belong to those, they never have a way to i participate in that funded by the City or is that just a one year thing. I'm good with it. That s what l ve asked you for for all of these years. Tell me specifically the ones that we re on, then as a Council we can vote yes or no. Me personally, I think that as a general rule, it is responsible as an employer to have your people educated, informed and continuing to learn. That to me is a priority as a city that we maintain a high developed and educated workforce. Ifthat isn t as much of a priority for you as roads in general are, then you would vote no to this budget and you would vote yes to canceling every educational and professional organization for our Planning and Development Department and you would ask the rest of the Council to do the same. That s all I'm asking from you. Specifically tell me what is involved in the dollar item and then ask me to vote yes or no on it so we can make that educated decision. But all you re telling me is, we had $900,000 in this that we could put to roads. But in the two packets we ve had last week, and I wasn t even here for and was able to read it, and tonight s packet on page 63, clearly it tells us what s included in the budget. And most of what you just said we could put easily money towards roads, wasn t allocated in the budget in the first place. So, $900,000 that we have we could have easily put towards, and I would suggest we do, wasn t even there. So, look at the budget that s proposed, what is in front of us, what we clearly received on multiple occasions as the proposed budget, tell me what you want to cancel, what you want to stop funding, what you think is not as important and then ask me, to move it to roads. But I haven t heard that from you once. - You said haven t got an e mailfrom you that when you said you were sending specifics. We ve got nothing. I COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Well, I probably wou dn t send it directly to you. I brought up these items here as a discussion COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: At the Council Meeting we were at last time you specifically said you would e mailit to us, that we would have from you specific items that we would be able to consider and programs to cancel. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Well, I didn t e mailthem, I brought them here tonight. ' Okay. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: So, you re telling me you didn't make any decisions of this or any ideas or recommendations? on any COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Well, absolutely I did.

30 anybody it s - ~,:;~. ~;4~L-2-L1-.2; L:-'~=.;.'.'...-.l;?.::.-;-.: :; ;r; ::--'-*- v.-( ;..-1.; :4.-;-.~ -;«;-.-.-;-;-.-L- ;._-.;..'_.'_-.;.;;-.-r.-.~ ~.-_~_-;-'.';;; >2};-_-;~ '2 Page 30 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Joumal Page #15066 COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: So, you thought it was a better place to have this discussion was to not go to any department heads, not to go to the City Manager, not to go to the Mayor and ask any clarification questions on this. You didn t think that if the Starbuck s card was such a big deal that you needed clarification on why somebody might have used once, twice or three times, you thought it was better -- and you were so concerned about it. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: That was not the thing that I brought up about the Starbuck s. You completely missed that. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: That was one of them. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: You completely missed that. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Okay. Then how about -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: lt s coded as Parks and Equipment, not as Transportation and Reception. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Is there a reason for that? Was there any reason? COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: I don t know. Ijust think there was -- COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: And that s my question for you. You didn t -- COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: - If it was Transportation and Reception would normally -- COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: That s my point, Dan. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: fall under that category. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN:It normally would. And you might be a hundred percent right that that was coded wrong. But we would already know that in this Council - Meeting if you had asked anybody in Finance or the City Manager or the department head and said, this is something I noticed when I received this days ago and I noticed this seems like it s not coded right, can you tell me why that is. But instead, you came to a Council Meeting on the night we re talking about the budget and went, well, I don t know why this is coded wrong. I can't believe nobody has told us why this coded wrong. You do that all the time. You often, just like you sat here and told us we had $900,000 in this budget that you think should have been allocated differently, because it should have went to roads. But it wasn t even presented in the budget as something we were spending. We didn t have that software in the budget. We didn t have those programs in the budget. We had not allocated those dollars towards them so we have no ability to remove those from the things that you didn t support and put them into roads, because they re not on the budget. So, give us some stuff that is in the budget, tell us what you want to cancel and maybe ask the questions before you get here if you re really interested in balancing it instead of interested in grandstanding. Because for six years, I m sick of grandstanding, Dan. I want a plan. lg I '.~ l;- '

31 I I - r.-.-.-o~_-;._'-.<;;:.;:.:.;.:.;.:.;.:r: :--;-';?;~;i Page 31 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15065 COUNCILMEMBER NEIGHBOR: Mr. Mayor, call the question. MAYOR MEYERS: I guess I would like to make a comment that as Mayor I would hope that some of the discussions of what the Council is wanting to do or make changes within the budget as being presented by staff, that those discussions would take place during the Committee Meetings on the budget. Not that there s not going to be discussion about the budget in a Council Meeting. But the meat of the discussions of. how thebudget is going to transpire and be brought to the Council as a whole for approval, I would think those discussions would take place, the majority of them, during our scheduled budget meetings. And that would be a good time for suggestions. I don t mind anybody from the Council bringing forward a plan or a suggestion of change before the Council if that s something that they need to do or want to do. But I think, again, if it is a plan, it would be helpful if it was stated as an item or a suggestion of what to either delete or to add, specifically instead of just throw out some numbers. And then I think communication with staff is extremely important on getting the best information to provide when discussing that opinion of plan by making sure that those items are included or that we re getting accurate information for the plan that s being suggested for the Council to consider. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Mr. Mayor. MAYOR MEYERS: And there s where I m having a difficult time with your proposal tonight, Mr. Pflumm, of understanding what is exactly the plan. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Oh, I understand. And I just got some of the information yesterday morning, you know, that is pertaining to, you know, what l m talking about, right? So, all that detail has not really been readily available to myself, (inaudible) because ve asked. MAYOR MEYERS: Well, I think again it s always readily available to a Councilmember. And especially when we begin budget discussions any of that information can be provided or discussed with Councilmembers by staff. I think the very best way of doing it is by person, coming in and sitting down with staff. Here s a question that I have or something that I don t understand, and sitting down with staff so that they can personally explain it to where before you leave you re satisfied with the information that you re given. I know when I was a Councilmember I did that on many occasions. And I always got the information and felt comfortable with understanding what I was doing when it came to making budget decisions. Mr. Vaught? COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: You know, my voting on the budget is have to go with just have to Iookat my election. I mean, I campaigned on economic development. I campaigned on quality of life. I campaigned on quality parks and I campaigned on moving the City forward and I won by two-thirds of the vote, and I had a worthy opponent who was endorsed by a lot of high profile people and I still beat him by two-thirds of the vote which means the people in Ward III, I think they support the agenda I put outwhen I campaigned, and I haveto go with that. You know, I think roads are important. We ve talked about it; We're spending money on roads. But like I said before, I don t think you can sacrifice everything else in the City solely for capital - improvements. You know, it s like a company. You still everything else in the company still keeps happening. I would like to bring up something about dues. You

32 hold ' ' ':~;-2. ;-;-;~;._.;.».~.: - ~ »: Page 32 CITY COUNCILMINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15064 know, you said you paid your own dues. You know, in real estate we pay our own dues on things, but we re also contract labor. You know, do you personally pay your dues or does DanCo Systems pay your dues? COUNCILMEMBER the company so that s a little bit different. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Exactly. PFLUMM: Well, l lianswer that one. Yeah, I pay them, but I own COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: But the other guys don t get that. - COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: 80, but let s talk about on. Let s look at let s talk about GBA though. Let s take something like GBA or who is the other big who am I thinking of? Who is a big giant engineering firm and UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Black & Veatch. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Yeah. Black & Veatch. I could not think of the name. You know, would they pay for, you know, a thousand people to be a member? No. But I guarantee Black & Veatch writes a membership check to an organization and they re probably their head engineer, the top guy is that named member of that organization. He s not paying that himself. No different than the City. Are we, you know, and I guess that s a question I would have, and I don t know the answer. Are we just paying anybody membership to any organization they want to be in or does the City pay membership to ABC Engineering Association with Doug Wesselschmidt the named contact person for that, because he s the head engineer? Which would make -sense, because as a company, no different than any other company, you join those organizations and you name a person that s that person for that organization, that whether it's the president of the company or the chief engineer, whoever it is. Now, would GBA pay for a thousand memberships into an organization or a hundred of them or, you know, however big the company is, probably not. I don t think it would be very cost efficient for them to do this, especially a junior level or entry level engineer. So, yeah. I could see where they wouldn t do that. You know, we have how many engineers? UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: I think eight. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Yeah. Eight engineers. So, you know, do we and I don t know. I don t know if we pay for all eight of them. I don t know if eight of them are members. But do we, you know, we obviously as a city are I would think we as a city -- would pay for the head engineer. And when we talk about not being important to join those things or to be a member, I think is very important. No different than, you know, if - m going to pay for an appraisal for a property, l m not going to I would be less likely to pay somebody who is not involved in that organization or has a proper designation. Even Dawn brought up CCIM, and it's a, you know, CCIM and SIOR are pretty prominent tag lines after your name in the real estate business, and people choose to _ use those and have confidence in them because of that. So, I do think that matters. You know, and I don t want to go into the diatribe about what we said, I ve brought it up with you before. I mean, and I would love to look at some of what_you re talking about. I think just to drop bombs though is not the way to do it. There could possibly be

33 they or here's _ 'xa; :i:u:n:<»1-l-li-:5;. CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15063 savings in the budget. But I think sitting in a meeting where we're voting like this and at the final hour and say, well, we could do this and this and this, I would think would be things that we could bring up throughout the process and say, well, I think we should spend less on this, because of this and l ve looked into it. I mean, one of the things you threw out immediately was $100,000 I don t think is in the budget. But"you understood it - to be there. You know, you wanted to that we re spending $100,000 on non-public safety vehicles and that we shouldn t do that. You know, I can tell you from experience in the car business, and my brother is still in it, buys and they sell vehicles, I mean, Shawnee gets all the life out of their cars. If we're buying a carin Shawnee or vehicle, we pretty much need it, because I guarantee what they re replacing, it s run its course. - Nobody beat them. Police cars, public works, you name it. We get the life out of our vehicles. And that s been that way for years. I used to, you know, go to Shawnee when they did the sealed bids. I used to go bid stuff for Shawnee. And I remember looking at the vehicles going, wow, there s nothing left to it. I mean, we get all the life out it. So, I guess the question is, you know, what kind of city do we want to live in and what kind of appearance do you want to have. You know, is it good for our residents to drive down the road and, yeah, the road, I mean, we could have perfect roads. But if we have beat up old cars smoking down_the road with the, you know, tailpipe dragging on the ground, what would look better? What s better for the image of Shawnee? Or, you know, a guy is sitting on the side of the road four hours, because the car breaks down, or for three hours and then he can t go to work for the next couple days, because, you know, something drastic happened to the car, it s got 250,000 miles on it. Is that cost effective? You know, no different than why any other company replaces its fleet in a timely manner, because down time costs money. So, little things like that. I think, you know, to just sit and throw we could save this, we could save this, could save this, I think is like anything else. You would have to put out the details of what it is and say, you know, this department spends this this expenditure. I think if we, you know, l ve looked at this and I think if we take this away, we can still accomplish the same thing if they do away with this, this and this. But anytime we take money away from something, it s going to alter the department. lt s going to alter how they do their business. And so the question is, does it have a detrimental effect on the department for doing their job. And so I think the assumption is with some is that all departments are strewn with waste andthatthere s always ten percent they can cut out of it, because they re just at least throwing ten percent of that budget down the drain on whatever or five percent. And, you know, I don t know. Could be true. I think if someone could show me on paper and say, look, this is where I know it s going. But l m not seeing that. And, you know, what I've looked at and what I can tell and what I know about business, I don t see anything that this seems grossly out of line, so. But like I said before, I mean, you know, even if you had something in writing for us and if you had had this on a nice on paper with stuff spelled out. But, you know, Dawn was sitting here trying to -- write numbersas fast as you could rattle them off just getting an idea of how many dollars you were talking about, there s nothing to look at. it s, you know, if we re going to do this, and l d welcome anybody to do it. I think anyone of us that has an issue with the budget kind of put something together on paper. And just for an example, I know Unified Government, and I know Neal loves when I bring them up. But each one of those commissioners, they re assigned to a different department. And during the budget, they re the ones who go out and they put together a report on that department. Each individual councilmember or commissioner kind of does a report somewhat on that department and gathers the information and presents it or looks for savings or whatever it is on each individual department. And, you know, ifjrhat s what we all want to do, then

34 anyway, ' July Page 34 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES 8, 2013 JournalPage #15062 we do that. But I think just sitting here from this high altitude say, let's cut this million dollars off the budget I don t think is going to have an effect. You know, I can t get behind that, because I don tknow if it does or not. I would need to see that in more of a presentation on this is what werecutting and this would be the detrimental effect of the department or this would be the effect or this is what they would have to do without. I mean, but I welcome anybody. You know, I mean, l m all for it. If you find me half a million, million dollars that we can free up that s not going to negatively affect the business we do in Shawnee and how we do things. But I just know in Ward III, the feedback I get is, people are very happy with the way the City is run. People are very happy with how things look. I think honestly in Ward III, I think people would like to see us probably increase our spending in various areas that are more visual and aesthetics, just for an overall appearance. That s in the feedback I get is they want that. And they want that quality of life and they want the quality parks and they want the activities and that s who votes for me and that's who I've got to support. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Pflumm. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: I just want to throw out, I think I did comment on all of the spreadsheet items that Carol had put out there, like the PIO, the generator, all of those items in that list there. I know I've asked for land improvement information several times. Got that yesterday, which is great, okay. And, you know, she gave it to everybody. And I think that s, you know, any of that detailed information, those spreadsheets were very small in retrospect. I think that even if there s a hundred of them (inaudible) you could, you know, fire them off to all of us so we'd have all of that detail. But anyway, I just think that ve brought up most of these things, especially like dues and subscriptions in the past. And I think the debt, that is going up, and it, you know, just in 2012, you know, we re seeing 25 percent increases and, you know, and - stuff like that. And I just that s my opinion. 80, you asked me to give you some detail so, and that s what I did here. So, that s what I did. I didn t believe, and even I told you, I didn t believe I should have to do that. Okay. That s not normally the way it works in the business world. Normally you go back to each department head. He knows wherehis budgets are and what he s got. Maybe he s got a little bit of extra money in this category or he doesn't need to increase his dues and subscriptions by 25 percent or his transportation and reception. So, that s what I originally said. We didn t get that. Okay. So, you asked me to give you some specifics and that s exactly what I did. l m done. Thank you very much. MAYOR MEYERS: And again, I would just think that if the Council had this discussion and then they could vote on that item if it was brought up in a motion and a second to make a change, then a change gets made. But if one Councilmember says here is my suggestion, you can t get upset that staff is not going to do anything with it, because it s an opinion of one Councilmember rather than the governing body making a change. And that is our purpose. That is what we re here for is to take a look at what's being delivered to us from staff and then making decisions on, is there anything in here that we seem to think as a whole that we think should be changed or added, you know, deleted or added from a budget perspective. And that is our purpose as a council, because we are the ones that are approving or not approving a budget that s being presented. But it s important that, I think, that if we are not going to vote for a budget that there is reasoning behind that. And I would hope that during the budget process there would have been discussion of a change of plan. And again, I think it does need

35 it s Page 35 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15061 to be different than just throwing out some numbers, but actually having a plan that the Council discusses and makes an agreement or has a disagreement of whether they want to add something or delete something from the budget process that we re being presented from staff. COUNCILMEMBER SAWYER: Mr. Mayor. MAYOR MEYERS: Yes, Mr. Sawyer. COUNCILMEMBER SAWYER: The only thing I would ask for by the time we have the public hearing is I know each one of us turned in a decision, or l m assuming we did. I think seven or eight, I don t know. The last I knew there was seven of us that turned it in. But on the decision packets, you know, I d like to see how that really came out by individual items. I don t think there s anything wrong with us seeing the number, you know, if it s 7 for it, if it s 4 and 3 or 2 and 5, who cares, except I would just like to see it. And then the other thing I would like to see is, you know, we talk about street maintenance and mill and overlay. I would like to see what we were spending in the years 05, O6, 07, before the downturn, and then what it has gone back up to. Throw out the year 2013, because we re borrowing money to make that happen. But those -- and I don t know what that number is. I know it s a percent of the budget, probably a small percent. It sounds like it s a huge number. But it s probably probably not ten percent. Probably never reaches ten percent of the budget, I assume. If I remember correctly, the one that I did find was somewhere, it was in the seven percent range. But I do believe that we have -~ that is the area of the budget that we decided in 2008 that we were going to take the hit on and not spend the money. And, yeah, we re putting somemoney in some areas before that, and I somewhat struggle with that as, hey, you know, let s fix what we had and then we can add the glamour that we all believe we need to keep up with our neighbors. MAYOR MEYERS: Any other discussion from the Council? is there anyone from the audience that wants to speak to this item? Good evening. If you II state your name and address for the record, please. MR. STRAUB: Kevin Straub, (Address Omitted). To me, you know, ve been sitting I sat through quite a few of these while I was on the Council, and you basically seem to be doing the same thing year after year after year. The department heads ask for what they want and you guys calculate it and then it goes to the Council. I don't believe anybody on the Council is an accountant. There are some business people so they know business, they know their own thing. I think Mr. Pflumm is just trying to figure out, hey, where can we sharpen our pencil. Mr. Vaught said that, you know, he thinks that we probably might be able to sharpen it five percent or ten percent, but he d like to have somebody to show him where to do that. And what I was thinking is, when I brought up, I believe it was 2008, maybe it was 08 or 09 or 07, to have an ef?ciency review of the City. To have an outside company, not your accountant that audits you every year that tells you your bills are paid on time, somebody that s not invested into this City and to actually like a Dave Ramsey guy. Somebody that comes in here and says, okay, let -- me look at all your departments. Let me look at all where are you using one thing in -- three different departments where you can say, you know what, if we merge this together, we can drop it down by a half or a third or ten percent or five percent. I believe a company that I brought in, and we had a fourto five vote, I can t remember t»_: f;'

36 if somebody I say it s Page 36 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15060 exactly what the night was. But they said that they would do it for free on a percent -- they would be charged, but it would be a percentage of the savings they found. And if they found no savings or if you guys decided not to make any changes, they wou dn t get paid. They saved Sedgwick County millions of dollars. So, they know what they re doing. And m not saying that we use that company. Butjust find a company that s not connected. I think that was addressed that night, that we get audited every year. That we and I go, well, that audit says you pay your bills on time. It doesn t tell you, well, -- we recommend you do X, Y, Z. No. And maybe it was because it was my idea and I heard a few people on the Council wasn t excited about it when I bring up things. lt s like those recycling bins in the park. We won t bring up that that was my idea. Anyway, something like that. And it gets outside of, because the department heads like saying they re going to ask for everything they want. They re going to ask for what s best for the City. Sure they are. But can they you didn t have the money, you had the money to spend. But if you - didn t have the money, how would you you had 20 percent less than what you need, how would you figure out how to make the City work without raising taxes. Is there a way to do that? There is. And you guys aren t set for this. The staff is not set for that, because the staff was trying to make their department the best they can. They re trying to and it's not cut back on Police, lt s not -- cut back on Fire, because that s what everybody says. It might be, see, we arrange the schedules. That might be one. I don t know. We need to think the City would be benefitted if they looked at somebody that outside, unconnected and looked at it and said, okay, these are my recommendations. You know, I said that in I think it was a pretty good argument. I think there were several people that were in favor of that. - But again, five years later down the road, you're still is coming up with ideas and the other person is shooting them down. We have to trust. Well, find somebody that knows what they re doing. Jeff, if you don t know how to do those ten percent down or out five or ten percent, find somebody that can. I don't think anybody up here is an accountant. So, just a suggestion. I know you guys will continue doing the same thing over and over again whether it s the right thing or not. So, good luck. MAYOR MEYERS: Is there anyone else from the audience that would like to speak to this item? Good evening. If you'll state your name and address forthe record, please. MR. HOUCK: Rod Houck, (Address Omitted). MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. MR. HOUCK: I think this is probably my fourth year now of coming to Council Meetings, coming to Council Committee Meetings or whatever the committees were called before then, and watching the budget process. And it's a phenomenal process. Staff does an excellent job at working the numbers. I think at least six weeks, it not eight weeks ago there was a decision package for all of you to review. Mrs. Gonzales, because she and I were talking about an entirely separate issue, offered for me to even comment on it, which I did. And I tell you there s a lot of items that I said if it doesn t benefit the citizen, don t do it. But what s really frustrating me tonight is, you know, going back ' at least three weeks ago I heard Ms. Kuhn say to Mr. Pflumm, if you have suggestions, bring them fon/vard. There s been another Council Committee Meeting since then, Mr. Pflumm. That would have been the time to bring them fon/vard. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Didn t have all the information at that time..,

37 O Page 37 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15059 MR. HOUCK: Okay. Huh? Well, I can't believe that you could have the information today that you cou dn t have gotten three weeks ago. But the process ve seen for four years is we re start nitpicking at dues and subscriptions and transportation and distribution at the eleventh and a half hours of the budget process. I wish you d have looked at that a month ago. Not now. That s what s frustrating to me about this process is that we seem to take this big picture and funnel it down and keep (inaudible) it down. One night, Mrs. Gonzales, you presented out of those major -~ the decision package, you presented some against, some for. I agree with Mr. Sawyer, d like to see the numbers too. d like to see the numbers of how many were for that item and how many were against that item so we get that down. And it seems like Mr. Pflumm isn t informed that some of those items were already on the not for list. And so do your homework, only sooner. Don t wait tillthe eleventh hour. And in terms of efficiency, we have a City Manager. This City is run by charter by a City Manager. She s the efficiency expert. If she needs to look at how departments are run, that s herjob, not an outside. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. Is there anyone else from the audience that would like to speak to this item? COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: Mr. Mayor. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Vaught. COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: I just want to clarify Mr. Straub s comments. I did not say I think there s five to ten percent savings in the budget. I said if someone thinks there is five to ten percent or five or ten percent savings, then please bring it fon/vard and show me where it s at. Number two is I do remember those discussions, because I was actually campaigning and sitting through Council Meetings when Mr. Straub and other Councilmembers were proposing the efficiency audit. And I do find it interesting that, as you stated again, that but don t include public safety, which is over half the -- budget, I believe. Yet, we re going to do an efficiency study of less than half the budget. And, you know, the assumption is that public safety runs a hundred percent efficient, everybody else doesn t, so let s not touch them, which to me that s a political way of saying I don t want to pick,_onpublic safety so let s just look at everybody else, because that s a political hot button. And if you re going to do an efficiency study and you really believe it, then public safety isn t exempted, you do it. And the other question was I think posed at the time, and I think I remember,. if I'm not mistaken, it was Ms. Kuhn that proposed that said are you saying that if we do this ef?ciency audit and we do it on the whole entire city that you re willing to vote for every efficiency item that comes from the audit including public safety. And that s when everybody went, whoa, whoa, no, we re not going to support everything. So, in other words, you want to do an efficiency audit. And this was talked about three years ago, you want to do efficiency and then you want to pick and choose what items you really want to do, which then it just turns into a political nightmare. So, the only way you re going to be able to do them is for everybody to agree that they re going to do it and we re going to support a hundred percent of what they come up with including public safety. Nobody is going to get on board with that. And anybody who thinks we regoing to get on board withit and really starts thinking about it, they re not going to get on board with it. So, that s what I don t want. I m just going to put this out there too, Mr. Straub. And I m not addressing you, so please don t get up and respond to this. But the fact that you do live in Overland Park, I mjust going to wonder if you are here as a representative of Straub Construction or the Straub

38 I was -' <.A; _ 1d,',E,V7{fI_l Ln-4' ".:a ,..,.L..;.,.;..A._L.,_(.._-:... we're ' ' ' ' ' ~ - ~. even ;'.._;'.:c-; -Iv:.:;.:g:z.:.::;I.:.: _ -J. :..._.: '..._,.» _;L:.. A.;1;2;;:.i.*?L2La*;a:;Q??al-}.};'J" CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15058 I family. I don t understand how an Overland Park resident has that much interest in the Shawnee budget. 80, I'm just going to assume that you re a representative of the Straub family and - Straub Construction. Oh, please. You re not this is not a debate. MR. STRAUB: The floor has not been closed though, correct, for discussion? COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: You have one opportunity to speak. UNIDENTIFIEDSPEAKERS: Two opportunities. MAYOR MEYERS: Two opportunities. MR. STRAUB: I believe I have two opportunities, correct? COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: (lnaudible) MAYOR MEYERS: Name and address for -- MR. STRAUB: You can t make a -- MAYOR MEYERS: Name and address for the record, please. MR. STRAUB: I m sorry. Kevin Straub (Address Omitted). Now, there might be - ~ (inaudible). I m not not trying to be combative with you, Mr. Vaught. So, let's I - suggested understand you don t that s why I thought I repeated what you said. -- You don t know if nobody showed you to save the five or ten percent, so I said have an outside company show you. I didn t say that there was. I said if there is, they can find - it. And what was the other thing? The part about all or nothing. (That s not the efficiency people that came and talked about it, they didn t say you had to do all or nothing. Okay. They said these going to show you where to save money, you guys decide. And if you decide to do all, some or none, that s great. They didn t care. So, I was in that meeting. The next thing about police and fire. I said we don t have to cut back if that s a safety issue. I said if we have to change schedules. So, I did want them also to be reviewed. They might be behind too many pencils at a higher price and we can get pencils cheaper. I don t know. So, I was all in favor of having all departments be reviewed. 80, I don t have a problem with that. But the part when you bring up my brother s company, Straub Construction, I m not part of that company. I worked for him for nine months as a laborer. I worked for him as a kid when I was growing up for my father as a laborer. That s all ve done from Straub. I only got paychecks when I worked for them. So, I m not a part of that company. Never have been any type of ownership of that company. So, I don t know why you would bring that up. If you re doing this for your father that s on the council at Wyandotte County, I don t - know. Do you want to bring that up every night, too? Whatever. That s not a as far as I represent myself and myself only. So, if you want to bring my family members into it, I have no idea why. That s just vindictive. You re just trying to be hurtful and mean in my opinion. You know, it s like going to my father s house and accusing him of something and accusing me of something at my father s house that another Councilmember had done in the past. So, okay. That was all that I was going to say. I think that s it. But anyway, I do do business in the City of Shawnee. I still shop in the City of Shawnee. I have sold a lot of homes in the subdivision called Town and Country

39 s it > -.-.~...--_-.».u_;;.l *.~.*.*.'.c'.'._-..' ;,;.;.;.. Page 39 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15057 Villas. I currently have one pending, one listed and nine lots listed over there. So, I have an investment in the City of Shawnee, and I believe this Council Meeting is open to anyone no matter where they live. Or is it just a Shawnee only club? Mr. Mayor, can anyone speak at these meetings? MAYOR MEYERS: I think you know the answer to that, MrṠtraub. MR. STRAUB: d like it answered so Mr. Vaught will know. MAYOR MEYERS: I let you speak tonight and you are not a citizen of this city. MR. STRAUB: Well, anybody -- MAYOR MEYERS: Yes, sir. MR. STRAUB: So, anybody in the City can speak. Okay. Anybody from anywhere, Mr. Vaught. So, anyway. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. MR. STRAUB: I wouldappreciate it if you would not throw allegations of my family around. It's hurtful. MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. Where we are at in this point of the meeting is on Item B, to Approve the Notice of a Public Hearing for the 2014 Budget for July 22",2013, at 7:30 p.m., establishing a tax levy at $17,023,956, with an estimated mill levy of for a total budget of $85,596,049. We have a motion and a second on the floor. Mr. Pflumm. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: I just have one. Sorry I didn t ask this earlier. The , is that the exact same mill levy as 2013? MAYOR MEYERS: Ms. Gonzales? CITY MANAGER GONZALES: Ms. Rogers, do you want to address that? MS. ROGERS: Maureen Rogers, Finance Director. l l just show you on the notice. The 2013 column, the total here toward the bottom is And over under the 14 column, it s also There will may, and probably will adjust slightly, because there s another valuation that comes from the county in between now and then. But this noticeis set to be the same as last year in total. There s shifts between the General Debt Service and Public Safety Equipment, but the total is the same. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: Okay. MAYOR MEYERS: Any other questions Thank you. or comments? COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: I do real quick. MAYOR MEYERS: Mr. Vaught.

40 ...~.-.-.-x.-.-.«...._<.x.:.:;.;<.:ci:c;;:glltz;::21 :-:- Page 40 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal P_age#15056 COUNCILMEMBER VAUGHT: And I just think this, so everybody understands where Dan was going with that, is you approve -- we don t approve the mill levy, we approve the dollar amount. So, based on valuations we adjust the mill levy to meet that dollar amount. If we approved a mill levy and the market crashed, we d be in a world of hurt, because all we d be able to collect is the mill levy we approved regardless of what the valuations were. So, we need to prove a dollar amount and collect it and the mill levy needs to adjust to make sure that we collect that dollar that we budgeted for. _ 1,. L f r; 1 MAYOR MEYERS: Thank you. ll now ask for a vote. All in favor, signify by saying aye. COUNCILMEMBERS: Aye. MAYOR MEYERS: Opposed no. Motion passes. (Motion passes 8-0). 2. Conduct a Public Hearing to Consider Funding Application for the Fiscal Year 2013 Byrne Memorial Justice Assistance Grant Program. Conduct a Public Hearing. MAYOR MEYERS: We ll move to Public Items. I'm sorry. We re in Public ltems. Item Number 2 is to Conduct a Public Hearing to Consider Funding Application for the Fiscal Year 2013 Byrne Memorial Justice Assistant Grant Program. In May 2013, the U.S. Department of Justice, Office of Justice Programs Bureau of Justice Assistance announced funding available through the Edward Byrne Memorial Justice Assistant Grant (known as JAG) Program. Of the JAG funds allocated to Johnson County, the Clty s portion is $12,051, which will be used for holsters. And we need to have a motion to conduct a public hearing. COUNCILMEMBER PFLUMM: So moved. COUNCILMEMBER SANDIFER: Second. COUNCILMEMBER KUHN: Second. MAYOR MEYERS: A motion has been made and seconded to conduct a public hearing. All in favor signify by saying aye. COUNCILMEMBERS: Aye. MAYOR MEYERS: Opposed no. (Motion passes 8-0) We are in a public hearing. (Motion passes 8-0). This is a formal public hearing required by law. The hearing will begin with a presentation by Captain Doug Orbin. After Captain Orbin s presentation, I will ask Councilmembers if they have any questions specifically related to the presentation. I will then ask if there are any comments from the public. Following public comments, I will ask for a motion to close the public hearing and no action is required. If anyone from the audience would like to speak during the public hearing, please raise your hand and l llrecognize you to come forward. As I stated earlier, in order to have an accurate record of the meeting, when you come forward to speak, please state your name and address. Following your comments, please sign the sheet to the left of the l _-.-

41 _-«;-_;.:c4_-;;,_.;.;-:.;-:.;._ :.;.;_; Page 41 CITY COUNCIL MINUTES July 8, 2013 Journal Page #15055 podium. In order to have an orderly hearing, all comments must be made at the microphone and are limited to five minutes. No person shall speak more than twice to any one issue. Captain Orbin. CAPTAIN ORBIN: Good evening. I am Doug Orbin, a Captain with the Police Department. And I am happy to talk to you tonight. We were very pleased to learn in May and June of this year that we had available this $12,051 to us at the Police Department through the Justice Assistant Grant Program for crime and prevention and equipment. It came at a good time for the Police Department and it s going to fulfill an immediate need for us for some equipment. So, I want to briefly tell you why we were applying for that and specifically why we are wanting to use those funds to purchase holsters. First of all, we have three, basically three plus holsters that officers carry. We have the duty holster that you carry on your uniform. We have plainclothes holsters that are like paddle holsters that they carry on their plainclothes. And we have the tactical holsters for our tactical team that are on the thigh. To start with, the duty holster, this holster that we currently carry is ten plus years old. We have found out that it is now obsolete. These are retention holsters which means you just can t draw the weapon out of the holster. It actually has retention, which you actually have to rock or do special things to get it out so that guns are not taken away from us. But we can t buy these holsters anymore from the manufacturer. The last time we had to replace or buy new ones, they actually had to do a special order to get us by. So, we are faced with the fact that we have to replace this holster. Secondly, we did have an incident in April of this year at one of our qualification ranges. An officer was qualifying with his weapon while in a time stress event as part of the qualification. He went to draw his weapon out of his plainclothes holster which has a finger release, index finger release. As he did so, he didn t get it out on the first try. He went to do it again with more pressure on his index finger. As he came up, he discharged the weapon. Went through the holster and through his leg. He did suffer injuries from that. Minor injuries thank goodness, a few stitches, he s still carrying and he was back to work pretty quick. However, during the investigation of that incident we found that that particular holster, that same problem of accidental discharge had been occurring across the country between -- with other agencies, other officers. And as a matter of fact we learned that the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center, which trains a lot of the federal officer and is a Department of Homeland Security division had actually done a study, because they had four accidental charges the same way with that same type holster. Based on that, we and the Department of Homeland Security in August of last year basically banned that holster from any officers in their ranges from carrying that holster to qualify. And basically, since we had already had an incident and we learned about this, we have to replace it. We can t allow our officers to carry and qualify with this holster, because frankly, it's unsafe. And we were already in the process of looking for holsters to replace that one when we were notified about this money availableto us to apply for. So, what we are proposing is to use the funds to, and this $12,000 will actually replace every duty holster, every paddle or plainclothes holster and every tactical holster for every member of the Police Department. And those funds will cover every one of those. The good thing about these holsters also is that currently we have different retention and drawing methods for three plus holsters. What we re wanting to do is to get one holster, one type holster that has the same retention as we currently use and has the same drawing motion. So, if you re under time and duress, there is no thinking about which holster do I have on today and m able to draw my weapon. So, that s why we were looking to apply for these funds and what we would use it for. Thank you.