Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 1 of 87 PAGEID #: 5915 IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF OHIO EASTERN DIVISION - - - 1 Libertarian Party of Ohio, : et al., : Plaintiffs, : : : Case No. 2:13-CV-00953 Robert Hart, et al., : Judge Watson : Magistrate Judge Kemp Intervenor-Plaintiffs. : : vs. : : Jon Husted, in his Official : Capacity as Secretary of : State, : : Defendant, : : The State of Ohio, : : Intervenor-Defendant, : : and : : Gregory A. Felsoci, : : Intervenor-Defendant. : - - - DEPOSITION of Aaron K. Harris, taken before me, Carolyn D. Ross, Registered Professional Reporter, and a Notary Public in and for the State of Ohio, at the offices of 30 East Broad Street, 25th Floor Conference Room, Columbus, Ohio, on Tuesday, September 9, 2014, at 11:20 a.m.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 2 of 87 PAGEID #: 5916 1 APPEARANCES: 2 2 Mr. Mark R. Brown, Esq. 3 Capital University Law School 303 East Broad Street 4 Columbus, Ohio 43215 On behalf of the Plaintiffs. 5 Mike DeWine, Ohio Attorney General 6 By Ms. Bridget C. Coontz, Esq. Assistant Section Chief 7 Constitutional Offices 30 East Broad Street, 16th Floor 8 Columbus, Ohio 43215 On behalf of the Secretary of State 9 Jon Husted. 10 Zeiger Tigges & Little, LLP By Mr. Steven W. Tigges, Esq. 11 3500 Huntington Center 41 South High Street 12 Columbus, Ohio 43215 On behalf of Gregory A. Felsoci. 13 - - - 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 3 of 87 PAGEID #: 5917 3 1 Thursday Morning Session, 2 September 9, 2014. 3 - - - 4 STIPULATIONS 5 It is stipulated by and among counsel for 6 the respective parties that the deposition of 7 Aaron K. Harris, a Plaintiff, called by the 8 Intervenor-Defendant under the applicable Rules of 9 Civil Procedure, may be reduced to writing in 10 stenotype by the Notary, whose notes thereafter may 11 be transcribed out of the presence of the witness; 12 and that proof of the official character and 13 qualification of the Notary is waived. 14 - - - 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 4 of 87 PAGEID #: 5918 1 INDEX 4 2 - - - 3 WITNESS: PAGE 4 Aaron K. Harris 5 Cross-Examination by Mr. Tigges 5 Cross-Examination by Ms. Coontz 64 6 7 - - - 8 HARRIS DEFENDANT'S EXHIBITS IDENTIFIED 9 1-12-18-13 E-mail 43 10 2 - Form 14 for The Strategy Network, LLC 50 11 3 - January 2014 E-mails 54 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 5 of 87 PAGEID #: 5919 1 AARON K. HARRIS, 5 2 being by me first duly sworn, as hereinafter 3 certified, deposes and says as follows: 4 - - - 5 CROSS-EXAMINATION 6 BY MR. TIGGES: 7 Q. Good morning, Mr. Harris. 8 A. Hi. 9 Q. Would you state your full name, please? 10 A. Aaron Keith Harris. 11 Q. And where do you live, sir? 12 A. Fairborn. 13 Q. What's your address there? 14 A. 57 South Pleasant Avenue. 15 Q. Are you employed? 16 A. I'm self-employed. 17 Q. What do you do? 18 A. I'm a freelance writer and political 19 consultant. Right now I'm running campaign manager 20 for Chad Monnan, who's running in the 19th District 21 Ohio House. 22 Q. Okay. For how long have you been doing 23 that kind of work? 24 A. For his campaign, since he filed, so
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 6 of 87 PAGEID #: 5920 1 late January, early February. 6 2 Q. What kind of writing do you do? 3 A. All kinds. I write about bluegrass 4 music, I'm helping someone ghost write a biography, 5 I'm helping someone -- a friend of mine in LA works 6 at a movie studio, I'm helping her with a couple 7 scripts, so do lots of different stuff. 8 Q. For how long have you been 9 self-employed? 10 A. It would have been since spring of 2013. 11 Q. What did you do before then? 12 A. I worked for a company here in Columbus 13 called the Old Machine. It's a film company, and we 14 made a documentary movie. 15 Before that, I was an English and social 16 studies teacher at a charter school in Dayton for 17 about three years. Before that, I was a newspaper 18 reporter. 19 Q. Where were you a reporter at? 20 A. Xenia Gazette and Fairborn Daily Herald 21 near Dayton. 22 Q. Okay. How long did you work as a 23 reporter? 24 A. Almost four years.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 7 of 87 PAGEID #: 5921 1 Q. What's your educational background? 7 2 A. I have an undergrad in Political Science 3 from Wright State University, and a Master's in 4 Journalism from Northwestern. 5 Q. Okay. When did you receive your 6 Bachelor's Degree? 7 A. '97. 8 Q. And your Master's Degree? 9 A. 2004. 10 Q. Do you have a political party 11 affiliation? 12 A. Yeah. I'm a Libertarian. 13 Q. For how long has that been the case? 14 A. I guess officially by the -- well, 2010 15 I got involved with the state party, and I think late 16 in that year I was -- well, I voted in the 2010 17 primary as a Libertarian; so I became officially a 18 Libertarian then. 19 Q. You said in 2010 you became involved 20 with the Libertarian party. Describe your 21 involvement for me. 22 A. Yeah. Just wanted to be a volunteer. I 23 started -- there was a couple people in the Dayton 24 area that I got involved with trying to get kind of a
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 8 of 87 PAGEID #: 5922 1 local county party going in Greene and Montgomery 8 2 Counties. In the fall of 2010, I was appointed 3 Deputy Political Director for the -- for the party, 4 and since then I've had a couple of different posts. 5 Q. Deputy Political Director for the 6 Libertarian Party of Ohio? 7 A. Correct, yeah. 8 Q. On a statewide basis? 9 A. Yes, yeah. 10 Q. Who was the political director when you 11 took that appointment? 12 A. Michael Johnston. 13 Q. Okay. How long did you hold the 14 position of Deputy Political Director? 15 A. It was a few months. I think it was 16 sometime in the summer of 2011 that I became 17 Communications Director, do PR and stuff like that. 18 I held that position up until this spring when I 19 resigned to go full-time on the Monnan campaign. 20 Q. So you were the Deputy Political 21 Director for how long? 22 A. A few months. 23 Q. Okay. 24 A. One of the things about me, I'm
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 9 of 87 PAGEID #: 5923 1 tremendously right brained and I'm not good with 9 2 dates. 3 Q. Okay. 4 A. So if it's important for some reason, we 5 can go back and figure it out, but... 6 Q. Sure, sure. And then you became -- 7 after Deputy Political Director, you became 8 Communications Director? 9 A. Correct. I believe that was sometime in 10 the summer or fall of '11. 11 Q. And you continued as Communications 12 Director until the spring of 2014? 13 A. Yeah. It would have been March or 14 April, I think. I don't know when I officially 15 resigned. I, you know, was transitioned to -- I had 16 a deputy and was training her up and at some point -- 17 yeah. 18 Q. How is the Libertarian Party of Ohio 19 organized? 20 A. Well, I mean, we have a state Central 21 Committee, which is kind of like -- some of these 22 analogies are inexact, because I know even less about 23 the business world than I do about a lot of other 24 things.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 10 of 87 PAGEID #: 5924 1 The Central Committee is like the board 10 2 of directors, then we have an Executive Committee, 3 which is -- does day-to-day stuff. The Central 4 Committee is elected by the voters of Ohio up to two 5 per each congressional district, and then the Central 6 Committee chooses the Executive Committee. We have a 7 constitution and bylaws and all that on file with the 8 Secretary of State and all that. 9 Q. Okay. And is -- there's an executive 10 director? 11 A. Yeah. 12 Q. And who is that? 13 A. It's been Kevin Knedler since the time I 14 got involved until now. I think -- and he had been 15 around in that position a couple years before, at 16 least a couple years before I got involved in 2010. 17 Q. Have you ever been a member of the state 18 Central Committee? 19 A. Yeah. 20 Q. When was that? 21 A. I was appointed to fill an open spot I 22 think sometime in 2010. I was -- I stood for 23 election, was elected by the voters of my 24 congressional district in the 2012 primary, which I
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 11 of 87 PAGEID #: 5925 1 think was in March. Then I was elected as Chairman 11 2 of the Central Committee, and I was Chairman until -- 3 I ran again in 2014 for the Central Committee, but I 4 did not run for re-election as Chairman. So I'm 5 still on the Central Committee, but I'm not an 6 officer. 7 Q. Are you a member of the Executive 8 Committee? 9 A. Not now. I was at -- for most -- I 10 think of the -- kind of the 2012 through 2014, I was 11 an at-large member, I believe. Yeah. 12 Q. During the time you were a member of the 13 Executive Committee, how frequently did the committee 14 meet? 15 A. Six -- every six weeks, a couple of 16 months. It wasn't monthly, but it wasn't quarterly, 17 somewhere kind of in between. 18 Q. Did the Executive Committee keep written 19 minutes of its meetings? 20 A. Yeah. We have a secretary -- we have a 21 secretary both -- for both committees, and they keep 22 minutes, and we approve the minutes at the next 23 meeting and all that, yeah. 24 Q. Uh-huh. In 2014, who were the other
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 12 of 87 PAGEID #: 5926 1 members of the Executive Committee prior to your 12 2 stepping down from the Executive Committee? 3 A. So I guess for the first kind of quarter 4 of 2014, Kevin would have been chairman; Bob Bridges 5 was vice chair; Daryl Olthaus, O-l-t-h-a-u-s, 6 secretary; Bryant Callaghan, treasurer; myself. 7 And we had a little bit of turnover in 8 the other two at-large positions. Nathan Eberly was 9 at times, E-b-e-r-l-e-y (sic); I think Bonnie Kelly 10 was for a little while on that other at-large, and I 11 think we had a vacancy for a little while there, too. 12 So those other two at-large seats, I'm not exactly 13 sure who was in what spot and when. 14 Q. And when did you stop being a member of 15 the Executive Committee? 16 A. It would have been a -- the primary was, 17 when, March -- May 6th. Sometime later in May we had 18 basically our organizational meeting at which we, you 19 know, re-elected officers for Central Committee and 20 Executive Committee, and I did not stand for 21 election. I -- like Linden Johnson, I refused; if 22 nominated, I will not run. It was kind of that deal. 23 So at whatever time that meeting was -- happened, the 24 official sort of transition.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 13 of 87 PAGEID #: 5927 1 Q. Okay. So sometime in the May to June 13 2 2014? 3 A. I'm pretty sure it was before June. 4 Q. Okay. 5 A. It was -- 6 Q. But after the primary? 7 A. Yeah. It was -- we're required a 8 certain number of days after the primary. You know 9 what, I take that back. It may have been in June, 10 because it -- the trigger for, like, how soon we have 11 to hold that organizational meeting has something to 12 do with when the elections are certified, et cetera; 13 so it was May or June, yeah. 14 Q. Are you familiar with something called 15 the LPO Leaders? 16 A. Yeah. 17 Q. What is that? 18 A. It's an e-mail list that various state 19 leaders, you know, people who are on the Cen Com, Ex 20 Com, county leaders, some state-appointed positions, 21 et cetera, are eligible to be on that list at the 22 discretion of our Executive Committee. It's like an 23 internal communication type thing. 24 Q. Are you on the LPO Leaders list
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 14 of 87 PAGEID #: 5928 1 presently? 14 2 A. I think I am, yeah. 3 Q. Have you been on the LPO Leaders list at 4 all times since 2012? 5 A. Yeah. I should have been, yeah. It 6 doesn't mean I read every e-mail. I'm also notorious 7 for not reading e-mails because I don't like e-mails, 8 and some people I don't care to hear from; so -- like 9 Mark, I never read Mark's e-mails. 10 Q. Sure. You did attempt to become a 11 statewide candidate in 2014? 12 A. Correct. 13 Q. For what office? 14 A. Secretary of State. 15 Q. How did you come to seek that candidacy? 16 A. I decided to run. We had another 17 candidate who had declared he was running, and I 18 thought he is a person of low character and even 19 lower cognitive ability; so I decided to -- to run, 20 as well. 21 Q. Who was that person? 22 A. Jesse Leonard. 23 Q. Excuse me a second. Pen died for some 24 reason.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 15 of 87 PAGEID #: 5929 1 When did you make the decision to run 15 2 for Secretary of State's office? 3 A. I -- again, I'm really bad on this. I 4 think it was sometime summer or fall of 2013. To 5 maybe anticipate a couple of questions, nobody 6 prompted -- it was a -- my decision entirely to run. 7 I tried to recruit a couple of other 8 people to run because I didn't think Mr. Leonard 9 would represent the party very well, and I didn't 10 convince anybody else to jump in and so I did. 11 Q. Who else did you try to convince to run 12 for Secretary of State? 13 A. I don't really think -- I can't really 14 remember anybody specifically. I remember kind of in 15 some conversations kind of said, you know, just kind 16 of, "Hey, do you know anybody who would run," and all 17 that. I know it wouldn't -- well, of course, it 18 wouldn't have been Charlie, because he was running 19 for Governor, even though he ran for Secretary of 20 State and did a good job before. 21 Yeah, I can't really remember really 22 specifically approaching anybody. It was more, like, 23 "Hey, can we find somebody else to ask," and I don't 24 think it went beyond that.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 16 of 87 PAGEID #: 5930 1 Q. Okay. 16 2 A. But I could be -- I could be wrong. I 3 honestly don't remember. 4 Q. Now, in order to become the party's 5 candidate for Secretary of State, you had to file a 6 certain number of qualified signatures on your 7 candidacy petitions. 8 A. Well, not only that, but you have to win 9 the primary. 10 Q. Right. 11 A. Yeah. I think it's 500 valid signatures 12 to be placed on the primary ballot. 13 Q. When you first decided to run for the 14 Secretary of State's candidacy, what plan did you 15 have for collecting the 500 necessary signatures? 16 A. At that point I had hoped that some of 17 our county organizations would help with that. You 18 know, I gather -- you know, planned to gather some 19 myself, other supporters, basically to find willing 20 volunteers, I -- you know, people that I knew on 21 Facebook from across the state and things like that. 22 Q. When you first decided to run for the 23 Secretary of State candidacy, did you at that time 24 give any consideration to using paid petition
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 17 of 87 PAGEID #: 5931 1 circulators? 17 2 A. Right off the bat, no. 3 Q. Okay. Was there anybody in particular 4 within the party who was responsible for your 5 petitions? 6 A. No. Our party doesn't endorse or, you 7 know, take sides in a primary. And for a while, the 8 other candidate was still active. But once people 9 found out I was running, people quickly dropped their 10 support for him and volunteered to support me or sort 11 of unofficially endorse me and things like that. 12 I don't -- you know, individuals can 13 endorse and whatever they want, but the party doesn't 14 sort of pick sides or anything like that. But once 15 there were -- the other candidate dropped out -- 16 again, there's never, like, any official vote or 17 whatever, but I -- I had support from Bob Bridges, 18 who's our political director. 19 I had also counted on some support -- 20 our Field Development Division is really sort of 21 expected to -- they kind of manage our county 22 organization, some of which are called affiliate 23 parties, others are community -- community -- county 24 development groups if they don't quite have the
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 18 of 87 PAGEID #: 5932 1 structure to be recognized as a party within their 18 2 county and within our bylaws. 3 We had a couple of different field 4 directors in 2013 and 2014, Brad Lowry and Nathan 5 Eberly. Both myself and other candidates hoped to 6 have some organizational support from them. Both of 7 them -- neither of them did a very good job at all. 8 In particular Mr. Eberly kind of -- I'm trying to not 9 use profanity -- but, yeah, he -- yeah, he didn't do 10 his job very well. 11 Q. What type of organizational support were 12 you looking to receive from the Field Development 13 Division? 14 A. It was more like, you know, I made my -- 15 you know, copies of my petition -- and I'll speak for 16 my own campaign because I don't know about the 17 others, but I would suspect somewhat similar. You 18 know, made copies of the petition form available 19 electronically and through the mail or, you know, 20 handing them to people. 21 And the -- again, how it's supposed to 22 work is that the field development person -- I think 23 at one point they actually did sort of draw up a plan 24 expecting county groups -- each county to get so many
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 19 of 87 PAGEID #: 5933 1 signatures based on their size and organizational 19 2 level to distribute the blank petitions to make it 3 available that way, and then to sort of follow up and 4 get the counties to deliver those, and that didn't 5 happen in very many cases. 6 Q. Why was that? 7 A. I think because Mr. Eberly was very poor 8 at his job. 9 Q. What specifically did he not do that he 10 should have done? 11 A. Not -- I had no evidence to suggest that 12 he did much outside of his own county, which is Wood 13 County. I remember at different, you know, Ex Com 14 meetings and things like that, I remember 15 specifically saying, "Hey, have you asked these 16 people to do it?" 17 And it wasn't -- you know, I was more 18 concerned about Charlie's campaign than my own, quite 19 frankly, and I think his approach -- again, I could 20 be wrong on this, but my perception was that he would 21 just every once in a while send sort of a mass e-mail 22 to everybody saying, "Hey, can you do this?" 23 And I remember saying, "Hey, have you 24 followed up with individual phone calls and e-mails
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 20 of 87 PAGEID #: 5934 1 to people to try to motivate them to do it?" And I 20 2 don't have any evidence that he ever did that. 3 Q. Why were you more concerned with 4 Mr. Earl's campaign than your own? 5 A. Well, I think he's a better -- a better 6 candidate for his office than I am for mine. It's 7 the Governor's race, I think there's the vote trigger 8 for ballot access retention. I know a lot of people 9 were supporting a lot of disaffected Republicans and 10 Independents, like, that were showing interest and 11 support for Charlie's campaign. 12 Q. What did you mean by "vote trigger for 13 ballot access retention"? 14 A. I don't know exactly how that all works. 15 Again, I'm one of the least detail-oriented people on 16 stuff outside of my field that I know, but -- and, 17 again, I could be wrong, but I think -- and, again, 18 I -- I don't know, but I know that -- I don't know if 19 it was in effect at the time or -- but if so many 20 people vote for a Libertarian candidate in a 21 Governor's race, that that could trigger some 22 automatic ballot access for the next cycle or two, 23 something like that. 24 And even that was secondary to I thought
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 21 of 87 PAGEID #: 5935 1 we had a good chance to make a very good showing in 21 2 the -- well, I still think we do have a good chance 3 to make a good showing in the -- this year's election 4 for Governor. 5 Q. What role did Mr. Bridges play in 6 assisting you with the collection of signatures for 7 your candidacy? 8 A. Well, at some point he -- he was also 9 the campaign manager for Charlie Earl and as our 10 political director. So I know he was one of the 11 people who -- I know at a couple of events and things 12 like that he had, you know, my petitions, as well as 13 Charlie's and other candidates' to gather signatures 14 that way. 15 Q. Aside from collecting signatures, did 16 Mr. Bridges play any other role with respect to your 17 petitions? 18 A. Specifically to mine, I never asked him 19 to treat mine any differently than anyone else's. 20 Q. Okay. But did he do anything for you 21 other than collect some signatures at some events? 22 A. Well, I know he tried to convince other 23 people to voluntarily -- I think he was trying to 24 pick up some of the slack that the Field Development
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 22 of 87 PAGEID #: 5936 1 Division had left; so I think he may have made some 22 2 efforts that way. 3 Q. What was the deadline for filing your 4 petition with the Secretary of State's office? 5 A. I believe it was February 5th. I think 6 it would have been a Tuesday, but I think it was 7 February 5th, if not a day or two either way on the 8 other side of that. 9 Q. Did you ever have a plan to file your 10 petitions early? 11 A. I think at some point we wanted to 12 file -- try and get some filed before the end of the 13 calendar year. I think, you know, with the SB 193 14 nonsense, that there was some -- it would have 15 perhaps given us a little better -- enhanced our 16 position in the lawsuit against that. 17 I think at one point Mr. Brown wanted 18 some people -- at least one candidate or something to 19 file before the calendar year. I don't know if -- I 20 think at some point maybe I had wanted to try and do 21 that, but found out, you know, I didn't have enough 22 to comfortably do that. Then later on I think maybe 23 we had wanted to file, you know, maybe a week early 24 or something like that and at different times.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 23 of 87 PAGEID #: 5937 1 Q. So when you -- when you -- if I 23 2 understand what you're saying correctly, at one point 3 you were thinking about filing your petitions prior 4 to year end 2013 so they would be on file before 5 SB 193 became effective? 6 A. I think it was something like that, 7 yeah. And I don't know if mine -- I -- again, I 8 believe that the -- that we wanted to either try and 9 get all of our statewide candidates or at least one 10 of them, and so I think it was considered at one 11 point to maybe try to do that for mine, as well. 12 Q. When did you actually -- well, did you 13 personally file your petitions? 14 A. No. I -- Bob Bridges took them down 15 with the other statewide candidates. I believe it 16 was the day of or perhaps the day before the 17 deadline. 18 Q. And so Mr. Bridges was responsible for 19 filing them? 20 A. Yeah. He had volunteered to do that 21 since he was going to go down there anyway. I think 22 that we had some pretty bad weather at that time. 23 Also I was helping driving, and trying to help Chad 24 Monnan get his signatures to get on the ballot, and
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 24 of 87 PAGEID #: 5938 1 then was kind of more focused on that those last 24 2 couple of days as well. So, yeah, Bob volunteered to 3 do it, and I trusted him to do that. 4 Q. How many signatures in total were on 5 your petitions? 6 A. I honestly have no idea. I know it was 7 8- or 900, I think. But, again, I'm one of those, 8 like, it's in the rearview from me and I just kind of 9 delete that from my hard drive. I know it was -- I 10 remember feeling like it was kind of iffy whether we 11 would have enough for mine or not. 12 We thought maybe we would have enough 13 to -- that would withstand the -- the invalidations. 14 I know invalidation rates are much -- it's my 15 understanding invalidation rates are much higher for 16 candidates who are not Democrats or Republicans. So 17 we wanted to get as many as we could, but -- so I 18 wasn't exactly confident at the number that we 19 submitted. And it turned out that we didn't have 20 enough in the opinion of the -- whoever decided to 21 validate or invalidate. 22 Q. How many of your signatures were 23 validated? 24 A. I don't know. Not -- less than 500.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 25 of 87 PAGEID #: 5939 25 1 Q. Which resulted in you not being eligible 2 for the primary? 3 A. Correct, yeah. 4 Q. What was your goal in terms of minimum 5 number of signatures you wanted to collect? 6 A. I think sort of the rule of thumb we had 7 kind of used and that we kind of go by for every 8 campaign, all the way down to the Central Committee 9 where you're supposed to have -- just need five to 10 get on the ballot for Lake County or state Central 11 Committee, is to get -- try to get double the amount; 12 so I think 1,000 was the goal in my mind. But, you 13 know, if you could get more, fine; if a little less, 14 we'll take our chances. 15 Q. Okay. And did you -- did you collect 16 signatures for yourself? 17 A. Correct, I did, yeah. 18 Q. Who else? Mr. Bridges did, as well? 19 A. I think he got some. I know other 20 people did. Again, it was one of those where a lot 21 of things were -- a lot of the -- I think at one 22 point we had the forms on our website that people 23 could download. We had given them out at meetings 24 and stuff, so -- and then those had come back into
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 26 of 87 PAGEID #: 5940 26 1 the office; some by mail, some by people handing them 2 in personally to people. So I never kept track of, 3 you know, exactly who didn't keep a list, you know, 4 anything like that. 5 Q. Did you ever give any thought to using 6 paid circulators? 7 A. I had -- one of my former students that 8 I had taught at the charter school, I had -- he 9 collect -- his name's Ronnie Reid, he collected quite 10 a few for me. And I forget the exact arrangement I 11 had, maybe a dollar per signature, and I paid him out 12 of my campaign committee based on how many he 13 collected. 14 Q. Do you recall how many signatures 15 Mr. Reid collected for you? 16 A. A couple of hundred maybe. I don't know 17 how many were exactly the validation rate. 18 Q. What was the formal name of your 19 campaign committee? 20 A. I think it was Harris for Liberty. 21 Q. And when -- who did Mr. Reid give his -- 22 the petitions that he circulated, who did he give 23 those to? 24 A. To me, yeah. I -- he lives in west
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 27 of 87 PAGEID #: 5941 1 Dayton, and I -- I've helped him as a reference for 27 2 jobs and stuff like that. It was one of my favorite 3 former students. And there's not many jobs in west 4 Dayton, there's not much of anything; and so I 5 thought I could get a little help from my campaign 6 and put a little money in his pocket. 7 Q. Uh-huh. Did you find that using a paid 8 circulator was more successful in collecting 9 signatures than using volunteers? 10 A. Yeah. Unfortunately that somebody who 11 really had no interest in politics did a lot better 12 than some of our volunteers. I think that the 13 SB 193 thing and the uncertainty as to whether those 14 signatures would even -- you know, would count for 15 anything I think dampened some people's -- you know, 16 some members and supporters of our party from wanting 17 to get signatures, and I think that was the desired 18 effect of the Governor and the people who signed 19 that -- you know, passed that law. 20 Q. When Mr. Reid gave you the petitions 21 that he had circulated on your behalf, did you review 22 them? 23 A. Yeah. 24 Q. And had he completed the box at the
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 28 of 87 PAGEID #: 5942 1 bottom of the petition -- 28 2 A. No. 3 Q. -- about being employed? 4 A. No. 5 Q. Why not? 6 A. Because he wasn't an employee of mine. 7 It was my understanding that employer and employee 8 have a very specific legal definition, and neither of 9 us met that definition. 10 Q. What's your basis for that 11 understanding? 12 A. Common sense. 13 Q. Did you check with anyone? 14 A. No. 15 Q. Why not? 16 A. Because neither I was not his employer 17 and he was not my employee. Don't need a weatherman 18 to know which way the wind blows. 19 Q. After you got the petitions from 20 Mr. Reid that he had circulated on your behalf, what 21 did you do with them? 22 A. Kept them on a folder on my desk until I 23 brought them in to Bob. I don't know if I gave them 24 to him personally or left them in our LPO office, but
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 29 of 87 PAGEID #: 5943 29 1 I collected them with all of the others that either I 2 had done or other supporters and, like I said, just 3 gathered them and put them in a stack until it was 4 time to get them together. 5 Q. "Bob" being Bob Bridges? 6 A. Yeah. 7 Q. Did you have any discussion with 8 Mr. Bridges about the fact that some of your 9 petitions had been circulated by a paid circulator? 10 A. Yeah. I had mentioned to him that I was 11 having -- that Ronnie had gotten quite a few for me. 12 And it never came up, again, the Employer box 13 because, again, I described to Bob how -- the 14 arrangement between myself and Mr. Reid. So he, I 15 guess, had the same understanding of -- yeah, just 16 never came up. 17 Q. You didn't discuss it one way or the 18 other with Mr. Bridges? 19 A. There was no discussion as to, "Hey, 20 did" -- nothing about the employer -- the infamous 21 Employer box, yeah. 22 Q. How much do you recall having paid 23 Mr. Reid to collect signatures for your campaign? 24 A. Again, I don't even balance my own
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 30 of 87 PAGEID #: 5944 1 checkbook; so I -- but I know that I kept track and 30 2 gave it to my treasurer and stuff. I'm guessing 3 around a couple hundred dollars. 4 Q. Who is your treasurer? 5 A. Daryl Olthaus. 6 Q. Do you know whether your campaign 7 reported that expenditure to the Secretary of State's 8 office? 9 A. It was my understanding that we did. I 10 mean, I turned the stuff in to him. I think on 11 some -- on a couple occasions, I paid cash. It was 12 kind of piece by -- you know, it wasn't all in one 13 lump sum, but I'm pretty sure it was a mix of checks 14 and/or -- and cash. 15 And I'm quite certain we did report it, 16 because I -- you know, obviously I believe in -- you 17 know, my name's on the committee, so I'm going to 18 take care to -- that's why I had a treasurer, not 19 only because you have to have one, because I'm not 20 good at that stuff and Daryl is. So I think we did 21 report it, yeah. 22 Q. At what point did you start using 23 Mr. Reid to collect signatures for you? 24 A. I don't know. I really have no idea.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 31 of 87 PAGEID #: 5945 1 Q. It was not in the beginning, though? 31 2 A. It wasn't in the very beginning. I 3 remember most of the times that I went over, you 4 know, to -- he doesn't drive; so I would drive over 5 there to drop off more forms and/or pay him or 6 whatever. I remember being cold; so it would have 7 been in the wintertime. 8 Q. Okay. 9 A. So -- 10 Q. What caused you to change your thinking 11 about initially using volunteers and then deciding to 12 use a paid circulator? 13 A. Again, kind of the lack of production 14 from the Field Development Division. 15 Q. Okay. How much time did you personally 16 spend seeking to collect signatures for your 17 campaign? 18 A. I don't know. I don't -- I don't know 19 how to measure that by time. 20 Q. Okay. Did you have a discussion with 21 anyone within the party about hiring a paid 22 circulator prior to hiring Mr. Reid? 23 A. I don't believe so. I wouldn't have 24 been the one to -- you know what, I really don't
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 32 of 87 PAGEID #: 5946 1 know. I know that I was pretty frustrated with, 32 2 again, the Field Development Division, and I don't 3 know if -- at what point maybe that was discussed and 4 if I was part of that. But it wouldn't have been 5 sort of my decision to make, but I may have been 6 involved in a conversation one way or another at some 7 point, but I just don't remember. 8 Q. Okay. Was Mr. Reid the only paid 9 circulator that you used? 10 A. Yes. The only person that my committee 11 engaged with and paid, I'm pretty certain of that, 12 yeah. 13 Q. Did you know that Mr. Earl and 14 Mr. Linnabary were using a paid circulator? 15 A. At some point I heard that Mr. Linnabary 16 was, that his campaign had engaged someone named 17 Oscar. And I -- at the time I didn't know if that 18 was first or last name, I didn't know anything about 19 him. 20 And I don't know when Steve decided to 21 do that, but it was my understanding that he made 22 that unilateral decision for his campaign at some 23 point. And I think he used -- that's the first I -- 24 I think the first I heard of any of our other
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 33 of 87 PAGEID #: 5947 1 statewide candidates hiring someone. 33 2 Q. Did you -- did you attend the protest 3 hearing that was conducted by Hearing Officer Bradley 4 Smith? 5 A. Yes. 6 Q. Did you -- that was on -- well, I don't 7 remember when. 8 A. Was that over two days? 9 Q. No. I think it was all one day as I 10 recall. 11 A. I remember I was there for one day, 12 because I remember sitting across from Terry Casey 13 not knowing at the time his involvement in all that. 14 Q. Okay. Prior to the hearing, did you 15 have any discussion with Mr. Linnabary about Hearing 16 Officer Smith working as an attorney for Mike DeWine? 17 A. No. 18 Q. Did you have any discussion with anybody 19 prior to or at the time of the hearing about 20 Mr. Smith also working as an attorney for Mike 21 DeWine? 22 A. I don't believe I did. At some point 23 when this issue came up a couple of weeks ago, I 24 guess Bob Bridges and Steve Linnabary perhaps knew
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 34 of 87 PAGEID #: 5948 1 about it at the time. But, again, this all -- I 34 2 don't recall knowing or thinking anything about Brad 3 Smith's involvement with -- with DeWine at the time. 4 I don't recall hearing about it, discussing it, 5 wondering about it. 6 The only thought I had was I knew Brad 7 Smith by reputation from his time at the FEC. And I 8 think that my understanding is some of his positions 9 about campaign finance I agreed with and thinking, 10 oh, well, he might be good, and turns out he was, 11 until he wasn't. But I was somewhat pleased that 12 Brad Smith was appointed to do -- to be the hearing 13 officer. 14 But, again, no -- I remember being 15 surprised when it came up in the last couple of weeks 16 or whatever about the connection with the -- with 17 Mike DeWine. 18 Q. Why did you say that perhaps 19 Mr. Linnabary and Mr. Bridges knew about Mr. Smith's 20 role as DeWine's attorney at the time of the protest 21 hearing? 22 A. Well, we got a -- Mr. Brown had asked us 23 when we had heard about this, and Bob -- again, this 24 is all, what, this month or last -- late last month.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 35 of 87 PAGEID #: 5949 1 And Bob called me -- you know, I answered Mark 35 2 Brown's question to say that I didn't know until 3 recently. Bob -- I was on the phone with Bob Bridges 4 about something else, and he asked me if he had told 5 me back in -- around the time of the hearing, because 6 I think he remembers knowing about it at the time and 7 he thought he may have told me. And I -- again, I 8 have no recollection of that and told him that. 9 And then my answer to Mark Brown, I 10 didn't choose to amend that answer because I -- 11 again, I had no recollection of him or anyone else 12 telling me that. 13 Q. Okay. So when Mr. Brown asked this 14 question of you, was that by e-mail? 15 A. Yeah. 16 Q. And you responded to him by e-mail? 17 A. Yeah, eventually. I know Mark sometimes 18 doesn't like how long I take to respond to him, but I 19 did. 20 Q. Okay. Well, I had the impression it was 21 an e-mail -- 22 A. Yeah, it was. 23 Q. -- based on what you said. 24 And then after you responded to
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 36 of 87 PAGEID #: 5950 1 Mr. Brown's e-mail was when Mr. Bridges called you? 36 2 A. Yeah. Again, I don't know if the call 3 was specifically for that, but I do remember 4 discussing it on the phone with Bob, because I think 5 maybe he had seen my answer and wanted to make sure. 6 I think he was, like, "Did I tell you, because I may 7 have?" I said, "I honestly don't remember anything 8 like that." 9 Q. I was going to get to that. Was this, 10 like, a group e-mail? 11 A. Well, the e-mails that Mark has been 12 sending us typically -- in regards to this case 13 typically include Mr. Kafantaris, the other two 14 parties to this lawsuit, and sometimes Bob Bridges on 15 those. So I'm guessing -- and typically, depending 16 on the content of the e-mail, I might hit Reply to 17 Mark Brown or I might hit Reply All to everyone. 18 Q. And on this particular e-mail regarding 19 Mr. Smith's role, did you reply just to Mr. Brown or 20 did you reply to all? 21 MR. BROWN: I'm going to object. I've 22 let you go a little ways on this, Steve, but you're 23 getting into attorney-client privilege stuff. So, 24 no, don't answer that.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 37 of 87 PAGEID #: 5951 1 MR. TIGGES: Was -- reply to all is an 37 2 attorney-client privilege? That's all I'm asking is 3 whether it was reply to all. 4 MR. BROWN: I just don't want you 5 getting into any more subject, Aaron, is all. That's 6 all attorney-client privilege. 7 MR. TIGGES: I'm not asking him for 8 that. I just want to know if he replied to all. 9 That's my only question. 10 MR. BROWN: You can answer that 11 question. 12 THE WITNESS: In any specific e-mails 13 regarding the Brad Smith/DeWine connection, I 14 honestly don't know. 15 BY MR. TIGGES: 16 Q. Okay. 17 A. But I know that in some way Bob must 18 have -- or, let me say might have seen or heard about 19 my answer to the question about the Smith/DeWine 20 connection, and he then -- at one point we were 21 talking about something else, and he brought it up 22 again because we want to be truthful and everything 23 like that, and he wanted to make sure. He was, like, 24 "Did I mention this to you?" And so I don't know how
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 38 of 87 PAGEID #: 5952 1 he found out about -- 38 2 Q. Okay. 3 A. -- the answer, but yeah. 4 Q. That's fair. The conversation that you 5 had with Mr. Bridges about Brad Smith's 6 involvement -- 7 A. Yeah. 8 Q. -- that was a telephone conversation? 9 A. Yeah. The one in which we tried to 10 clear up whether or not I had heard about it -- 11 Q. Okay. 12 A. -- at the time of the hearing, yeah. 13 Q. And Mr. Bridges asked you during that 14 phone call -- well, first of all, was it just you 15 and -- excuse me. 16 A. Just the two of us, just me and Bob. 17 Q. Just you and Mr. Bridges in the phone 18 call? 19 A. Yeah. 20 Q. And did Mr. Bridges bring up the issue 21 of Brad Smith's involvement or did you raise it 22 during that phone call? 23 A. I think he did. I think he did. 24 Q. And he asked you whether he had told you
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 39 of 87 PAGEID #: 5953 39 1 at the time of the protest hearing that he knew about 2 Mr. Smith working for DeWine? 3 A. Correct. 4 Q. Or words to that effect? 5 A. Correct. 6 Q. And you said, "I don't recall you 7 telling me that before"? 8 A. Yeah. I honestly have no recollection, 9 because I -- I remember -- I remember when I heard 10 about it, the Smith/DeWine connection within the last 11 few weeks, I remember being very angry at that, at 12 hearing that. 13 Q. On the phone call you had with 14 Mr. Bridges, that's recent within the past few weeks 15 or a month or so? 16 A. Correct, yeah. 17 Q. On the phone call that you had with 18 Mr. Bridges, did he say to you that he thought he 19 might have told you about Brad Smith's role as 20 DeWine's attorney back at the time of the protest 21 hearing? 22 A. Exact words, I don't know, but that was 23 the gist of it. Like, "Hey, are you sure that you 24 didn't hear it from me or somebody else," yeah.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 40 of 87 PAGEID #: 5954 1 Q. Okay. Did he ask about anybody else 40 2 aside from himself? 3 A. I think he mentioned that Steve 4 Linnabary might have known, and that he might have 5 talked about it with Steve. 6 Q. At the time of the protest hearing? 7 A. Near the time of the protest hearing. 8 Q. Okay. 9 A. Yeah. 10 Q. Did Mr. Bridges indicate to you how he 11 had learned at the time of the protest hearing that 12 Mr. Smith was working for DeWine? 13 A. No. 14 Q. Okay. Did you ask him that? 15 A. No. I don't think I did. 16 Q. Did you speak with Mr. Earl about Brad 17 Smith's role as DeWine's attorney? 18 A. Never directly to Mr. Earl. Again, if 19 I -- I know there's the issue of the responses to 20 Mr. Brown's e-mail. 21 Q. Right. 22 A. So never directly one-on-one with 23 Mr. Earl. Possibly through the e-mails or, yeah, 24 through Mr. Brown, but not directly to Mr. Earl.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 41 of 87 PAGEID #: 5955 1 Q. And I'm just asking you about direct 41 2 conversation. 3 A. Sure. 4 Q. What about with Mr. Linnabary, did you 5 ever speak with him about Brad Smith's working as 6 DeWine's attorney? 7 A. Again, all -- from now on, all of these 8 are talking about here in the last few weeks. 9 Q. Yes. 10 A. I think we've settled back then. There 11 may have been a Facebook or an e-mail message of, 12 "Hey, did you hear about this," or something like 13 that, but no, nothing beyond a mention, no. He 14 never, like -- I didn't find out from him, and, 15 again, nothing more than a passing mention that I can 16 recall. 17 Q. Was this a Facebook message from you to 18 him or him to you? 19 A. Typically him to me. I don't really 20 message -- yeah. I don't recall ever -- he'll pop up 21 with a comment for me every once in a while. So it 22 would have been from him to me, but I -- I honestly 23 don't remember if that was brought up by him. 24 Q. Did Mr. Linnabary indicate to you that
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 42 of 87 PAGEID #: 5956 1 he knew at the time of the protest hearing about 42 2 Mr. Smith working for DeWine? 3 A. I don't think so, no. 4 Q. Okay. You said -- I think you said this 5 earlier, and correct me if I'm wrong, because I don't 6 want to misspeak. 7 A. Sure. 8 Q. Let me ask it this way: Did you collect 9 signatures for Mr. Earl's candidacy? 10 A. Yeah, I did, yeah. 11 Q. Do you have -- do you have an 12 approximation of how many signatures you collected 13 for Mr. Earl? 14 A. No. 15 Q. What about from Mr. Linnabary, did you 16 collect signatures for him? 17 A. I would think that I probably did. I 18 know we had a couple of meetings in Greene County 19 that I remember having a folder with some of the 20 various, you know, petitions. And, of course, like, 21 every petition has to be people from a different 22 county, all the hoops you got to jump through. And 23 sometimes I would, you know, tell people, "Hey, I've 24 got all these. If you haven't signed them, go
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 43 of 87 PAGEID #: 5957 1 through the list," and all that, but I don't -- I 43 2 would imagine his would have been in the mix, but 3 I -- I don't recall specifically. 4 Q. Okay. Did you ever recommend to any of 5 the other statewide candidates that they consider 6 using Mr. Reid to collect signatures? 7 A. No. I don't think so. 8 Q. Okay. 9 (EXHIBIT MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 10 BY MR. TIGGES: 11 Q. Mr. Harris, let me hand you what's 12 marked as Exhibit 1. 13 A. Yeah. 14 Q. If you could review that, please, and 15 let me know once you've had a chance to do so. 16 (Witness complies with request.) 17 A. All right. 18 Q. Do you recognize Exhibit 1? 19 A. Yeah. I mean, it looks like an e-mail 20 that went on the LPO Leaders list from Nathan Eberly. 21 Q. And did you receive this? 22 A. Yeah. I received it. I would have -- 23 it would have been sent to my e-mail address. I 24 remember seeing it at some point. I don't know when
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 44 of 87 PAGEID #: 5958 1 I would have seen it. 44 2 Q. Okay. 3 A. When I would have opened it and/or read 4 it. 5 Q. Okay. In the second paragraph, 6 Mr. Eberly makes a statement, "However, at this time, 7 we are near the point of losing the LPO official 8 recognition." What did you understand that to mean? 9 A. Well, I mean, at that time SB 193 had 10 been passed and signed, and the provisions trying to 11 enact it for 2014 had not yet been struck down by the 12 federal court judge; so I assumed he was talking 13 about that. 14 Q. He goes on to say, "Ballot access is at 15 stake." Did you understand that ballot access was at 16 stake in mid December 2013? 17 A. Yeah. I mean, obviously a law had just 18 been passed to take us and all non-democrat or 19 Republican parties off the ballot; so, yeah. 20 Q. By the date of this e-mail, December 18, 21 2013, had you by then concluded that Mr. Eberly was 22 not fulfilling the responsibilities that he had? 23 A. Yeah. I -- yeah, in my personal 24 opinion, yeah.
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 45 of 87 PAGEID #: 5959 1 Q. What was your reaction when you read 45 2 Mr. Eberly's e-mail, the one marked as Exhibit 1? 3 A. At some point, most of my reactions with 4 his are all hat, no cattle, right. I mean, he talks, 5 but he doesn't deliver, and so -- 6 Q. Never heard that phrase before. 7 A. Yeah. 8 Q. What does that mean? 9 A. Well, again, I -- he -- he's -- was 10 always very good at writing e-mails, and that's about 11 it in my -- in my experience. 12 Q. By the time of this e-mail that's marked 13 as Exhibit 1, by December 18, 2013, were you using 14 Mr. Reid at that point as a paid circulator for 15 signatures? 16 A. I think I would have been, yeah. 17 Q. How did you -- did you approach 18 Mr. Reid? 19 A. Yeah, I did. I think that, again, he -- 20 a lot of my former students have asked me for, "Hey, 21 do you know of any jobs? Can you be a job 22 reference," et cetera. And so I knew Ronnie was -- 23 you know, I was thinking, hey, I may need some help 24 with this. He's one of the first people I thought
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 46 of 87 PAGEID #: 5960 1 of. He's a very trustworthy guy, great guy. 46 2 And I don't -- you know, like I said, I 3 think at one point I think two or three times I've 4 gotten calls from employers. I know he did get a job 5 at Walmart once based on -- well, you know, they had 6 called me for a reference and he later got it, and he 7 was always, you know, wanting to try and make money, 8 better himself. So I thought of him and approached 9 him, and he said yeah; so... 10 Q. To your knowledge, did Mr. Reid have any 11 prior experience collecting signatures for a 12 campaign? 13 A. I don't think he did, no, because I 14 remember, you know, kind of having to explain the 15 whole process to him. It's kind of confusing anyway. 16 And so, yeah, he gave no indication that he had done 17 anything like that before. 18 Q. Did you provide Mr. Reid with the 19 petitions? 20 A. Yeah. Yep. 21 Q. Did you sit down with him and explain 22 how they needed to be filled out? 23 A. Yeah. 24 Q. Did you speak with him about the
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 47 of 87 PAGEID #: 5961 1 Employer box at the bottom of the petition? 47 2 A. I don't think so, no. 3 Q. You didn't discuss that particular item? 4 A. No. 5 Q. Did he ask about it? 6 A. I think at one point he -- we had a 7 general discussion on, "Hey, what do I fill out? 8 What do I not fill out?" And I don't know if I 9 specifically told him not to or just said, "Only fill 10 in the things I tell you." 11 Again, it wasn't ever, like, a 12 specific -- I don't recall how we addressed or didn't 13 address that particular part of the form. 14 Q. But as I understand what you're saying, 15 either directly or indirectly, you essentially told 16 Mr. Reid, "Don't fill out the Employer box"? 17 A. Either that or I did not instruct him 18 about it either -- yeah, I never instructed him to 19 fill it out. Again, it was always my opinion that -- 20 that, again, as we went over, employer/employee meant 21 one thing and it didn't apply in this case. And so I 22 didn't -- didn't think it needed to be filled out and 23 so I acted accordingly. 24 Q. What would it have hurt if he had filled
Case: 2:13-cv-00953-MHW-TPK Doc #: 237-2 Filed: 09/26/14 Page: 48 of 87 PAGEID #: 5962 1 it out? 48 2 A. What would it have hurt if -- I -- I 3 don't know. I don't -- it wouldn't have hurt 4 anything, yeah. 5 Q. All right. Are you familiar with 6 something called management@lpo.org? 7 A. Yes. 8 Q. What is management@lpo.org? 9 A. It's an e-mail list that I believe is 10 for the members of the Executive Committee and for, 11 like, appointed directors. So it's possible, like, 12 in the -- I think in the time frame we were talking 13 about, I was both an at-large member of Ex Com and 14 the Communications Director, but in order to be a 15 director of one of our divisions you don't have to be 16 an Ex Com member. So it was basically for the 17 directors and/or the Ex Com members, I believe, is 18 the people on that list. 19 Q. So you would have been on the Management 20 list? 21 A. Correct. 22 Q. Did you ever learn that Mr. Earl and 23 Mr. Linnabary were using a paid circulator? 24 A. I think I -- I think we -- I think I did