MICHELLE RHEE: So, a lot of the... things that were coming out in the press were sort of saying, you know, "Rhee wants to fire people. It's all about firing people." And I don't think that it was a comprehensive sort of view of what I actually believe. JOHN MERROW: THAT DOESN T SOUND LIKE THE MICHELLE RHEE WE VE BEEN FOLLOWING ON THE NEWSHOUR SINCE SHE TOOK CONTROL OF WASHINGTON, DC S PUBLIC SCHOOLS IN JUNE 2007. I M JOHN MERROW. WELCOME TO THIS PODCAST. ALONG THE WAY, THE GUTSY YOUNG CHANCELLOR HAS CLOSED 23 SCHOOLS, FIRED OVER 15% OF HER CENTRAL OFFICE STAFF, AND REPLACED OVER ONE THIRD OF THE CITY S PRINCIPALS EVEN INVITING US TO FILM AS SHE GAVE ONE THE BAD NEWS. FROM DAY ONE, THE FIRST TIME SUPERINTENDENT HAS BEEN A MEDIA DARLING WITH COVERAGE ON THE CBS EVENING NEWS, CHARLIE ROSE, AND IN THE WALL STREET JOURNAL AND NEWSWEEK. TIME MAGAZINE FEATURED HER ON ITS COVER, HOLDING A BROOM IN AN EMPTY CLASSROOM. BUT NOW SHE SEEMS TO HAVE DECIDED THAT THE ATTENTION MAY BE GETTING IN HER WAY, PARTICULARLY NOW THAT SHE NEEDS SUPPORT FROM TEACHERS FOR A CONTROVERSIAL NEW CONTRACT THAT COULD WEAKEN TENURE. WHEN I SAT DOWN WITH RHEE IN MARCH TO DISCUSS HOW THE MEDIA HAS AFFECTED HER, SHE SEEMED MORE RESERVED MORE CIRCUMSPECT AND THEREFORE LESS INCLINED TO MAKE BOLD STATEMENTS. JOHN MERROW: The national attention... MICHELLE RHEE: Yeah. JOHN MERROW:... that you've been getting, has that helped you or hurt you? Or both? MICHELLE RHEE:... it's... it's been a mixed blessing. I think there have been some positives that have come from it certainly. And then I think that there are some... problems (Laughs) that it has caused. JOHN MERROW: Uh-hm. The "Time" Magazine cover... MICHELLE RHEE: Yeah. LearningMatters,Inc. 6e.32 nd St.,8 th Floor/NewYork,NY 212.725.7000/news@learningmatters.tv/www.learningmatters.tv
JOHN MERROW:... tell me how that happened. MICHELLE RHEE: It's always interesting because I was in that shoot for about an hour and (Clears Throat) most of that hour was spent with me taking pictures with kids, um, with me. And, um, so maybe about 60, 65 percent of the time was me with these kids. And the rest of the time was me holding rulers different ways. Um, and they only really took... I think three or four shots with the broom... actually, you know, for me the symbolism was different from what I thought I think people took out of it. And maybe that was a purposeful thing, um, from the magazine. I'm not sure. Um, but a... a couple of teachers have brought that up to me and they say, "Well, you know, why did you do that? You look like the witch with the broom... you know, mean, that sort of thing. And I... and I said very clearly... to the teachers I said, "If anyone wants to try to make the argument to me that... we don't need sweeping changes in this district... that we don't need to clean house in the central office... where we can't pay teachers on time, where we can't get you the health benefits... that's just... I mean I would... I would argue with you until the cows come home because that's just not right." Um... (Clears Throat) and I... and I think a lot was made of the cover, more than I would have anticipated or anything like that. JOHN MERROW:... you... you don't regret the "Time" cover? MICHELLE RHEE: N-... no, I don't regret it, because again, from my perspective, it was sort of symbolizing something. But what I do, um, think has been problematic is that... because of a lot of a the media coverage, you know, teachers have been getting a certain kind of view of me that has been somewhat one sided. And I don't think that it's... I... I don't think that's been helpful. That doesn't mean that everyone's going to be on board with the whole picture either. Right? There will be some people who probably won't like that. But there are a lot of people who were only seeing one side of it. And now that they, you know, from a listening session or because of letters I've been sending out on that sort of thing, they see the... the... the entire-... the entirety of the ideas. Um, I think they feel much better. JOHN MERROW: You wrote an op-ed in "The Washington Post." MICHELLE RHEE: Uh-hm. JOHN MERROW: Why did you feel a need to write an op ed? MICHELLE RHEE: Because... of that... of... of that very reason. LearningMatters,Inc. 6e.32 nd St.,8 th Floor/NewYork,NY 212.725.7000/news@learningmatters.tv/www.learningmatters.tv
JOHN MERROW: Uh-hm. Randi Weingarten, the President of the American Federation of Teachers, characterized your op-ed as an apology. Were you apologizing... to... in that op-ed? RHEE: I don't think I was apologizing so much as I was clarifying. Because, again, it's not as if the op-ed, what was in the op-ed was different from what I have been saying for nearly two years now. JOHN MERROW: Fair to say now you are emphasizing the positive... that we do have a lot of good teachers? MICHELLE RHEE: So I think that... that... you... you keep sort of hammering on this but this is what I'm going to say. I can't control what the media sort of says or does. I can't contr-... all I can do is answer questions, right? Or make... make statements kind of... and then... which parts of that... the media decides to print, that's their decision, not mine. So... if... if... I was kind of proactively... everywhere I went... only talking about... firing, firing, firing, then that would have been one thing. But I don't believe that that's the... you know, what I was doing. That's not accurate. I think that's what... certainly was getting picked up by the media and for a very specific reason, right? That's not something that a lot of people are willing to talk about. JOHN MERROW: George Parker, the President of the Russians Teachers Union, says, teacher morale is as low as it's ever been in his 25 years in the city. Can you... what's your reaction? MICHELLE RHEE: I haven't been here for 25 years... JOHN MERROW: Uh-hm. MICHELLE RHEE:... so I can't comment on that. Um, but I can tell you that, you know, I've been spending the last few months doing teacher listening sessions. And... a few times a week... and so I hear a lot about what people are concerned about. And I think there is a lot of sort of feeling of uncertainty. People aren't... just aren't sure. You know, well, you know, in... and they sort of wonder about George Parker, they... and wonder about me. And so they're... sort of... kind of caught. One thing that I've gotten out of these teacher listening sessions I... that I... um, you know, know very clearly now... is that a lot gets lost in translation from... from, you know, me and my office sort of making a decision, a policy... etc, and then how it gets then translated down, um, to the teacher level. LearningMatters,Inc. 6e.32 nd St.,8 th Floor/NewYork,NY 212.725.7000/news@learningmatters.tv/www.learningmatters.tv
JOHN MERROW: Um, before we go... can you update us on the status of the contract negotiations? MICHELLE RHEE: Well, um, what I would say is that we have... tentatively, uh, been talking about, uh, moving forward in a... in a specific way. Uh, we haven't nailed down the specifics of it. Um, but it gives me some... some confidence and some hope, um... that we will at least be able to come to some resolution one way or another that, yes, we were able... either able to come to a deal or were not. And that hopefully we'll be able to do that and really move to that decision... sooner rather than later. Now would I... stake my anything on it? No. JOHN MERROW: Randi Weingarten, the President of the American Federation of Teachers, a national union... has gotten involved. What does that mean? RHEE: Hopefully, it means that she will help to move us forward. Randi has been very bold in what she's said since she's become the President of the AFT-. You know, she had a big speech at the National Press Club in November where she said... something like, "Now is a time of unprecedented change." She said, "And I'm going to take the first step in this to say that everything, with the exception of vouchers... everything is on the table as long as it's good for children and fair for teachers. Everything's on the table." And I think that when she said that, people across the country in policy funds and politicians and you know, different people everywhere thought, "Wow! That was... a bold statement." And my hope is that she's actually willing to put some meat behind that statement... that she's actually willing to put everything on the table... as long as it's good for kids and fair for teachers because we believe that our proposal is good for kids and fair for teachers. MERROW: Do... do you think... do you think the D.C. schools are making some real progress on the ground that maybe the public doesn't know about? RHEE: I think that in some schools, and with some teachers, we absolutely are. I don't think it's happening consistently yet. And I think that it's incumbent upon the district to ensure that... through professional development... through coaching, um, and through really good trainings... that we're proliferating those kinds of practices across every single school. And across every single teacher. And I wouldn't say that I'm confident that that is happening yet. Now are we starting to see a smattering of that here and there? Absolutely. JOHN MERROW: TO HEAR MORE FROM CHANCELLOR RHEE, VISIT OUR WEBSITE, WWW.LEARNINGMATTERS.TV. THIS PODCAST WAS MADE LearningMatters,Inc. 6e.32 nd St.,8 th Floor/NewYork,NY 212.725.7000/news@learningmatters.tv/www.learningmatters.tv
POSSIBLE WITH THE GENEROUS SUPPORT OF THE ANNENBERG, HEWLETT AND WALLACE FOUNDATIONS. WE APPRECIATE THEIR SUPPORT. IT WAS PRODUCED BY SELLY THIAM AND JANE RENAUD. I M JOHN MERROW. THANKS FOR LISTENING. LearningMatters,Inc. 6e.32 nd St.,8 th Floor/NewYork,NY 212.725.7000/news@learningmatters.tv/www.learningmatters.tv