8 TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS 9 PUBLIC MEETING 10 JANUARY 15, (Commencing at 7:00 p.m.) 21 Reported by: 22 Patsy A. Hertweck, C. R.

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1 1 1 FRANKLIN COUNTY PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION FRANKLIN COUNTY GOVERNMENT CENTER 2 STATE OF MISSOURI SECOND FLOOR COMMISSION CHAMBERS EAST LOCUST STREET UNION, MISSOURI TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS 9 PUBLIC MEETING 10 JANUARY 15, (Commencing at 7:00 p.m.) Reported by: 22 Patsy A. Hertweck, C. R. 23 Midwest Litigation Services 24 25

2 2 1 I N D E X 2 PROCEEDINGS PAGE 3 4 Call to Order and Roll Call 5 5 Hearing Procedures By Ms. Eagan 6 6 Approval of Minutes 7 7 (December 18, 2012 Meeting) 8 9 Old Business: 10 File No Planning & Zoning 11 (Tabled to February Meeting) New Business: 14 File No Jim Latzel 15 Presentation by Ms. Eagan 9 16 Presentation by Mr. Latzel Discussion / Sent to Review Committee Planning Director's Report: 19 By Ms. Eagan Communications and Visitor Comments: 22 By Mr. Proemskey Adjournment Certificate of Reporter 75

3 3 1 E X H I B I T S 2 IDENTIFICATION DESCRIPTION PAGE 3 Franklin County: 4 A Franklin County Unified Land 6 5 Use Regulations B Official Zoning Map 6 7 C Official Master Plan 6 8 D Case Files -- all Cases Heard (All exhibits, if any, were retained by the 12 Commission, and will not be attached hereto.)

4 4 1 A P P E A R A N C E S 2 COMMISSION MEMBERS: 3 William Evans, Chairman 4 Timothy Reinhold, Commissioner 5 Donald Voss, Commissioner 6 Ray Cunio, Commissioner 7 Kevin Kriete, Commissioner 8 John Fischer, Commissioner 9 Jay Schultehenrich, Commissioner PLANNING AND ZONING STAFF: 12 Ms. Scottie Eagan, Planning Director LEGAL COUNSEL: 15 Mark Vincent, Attorney MIDWEST LITIGATION SERVICES: 18 By: Patsy A. Hertweck, C. R North Eleventh Street 20 St. Louis, Missouri (314)

5 5 1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 (January 15, 2013) 3 CHAIRMAN EVANS: It's seven 4 o'clock. I'd like to call to order the January 5 meeting of the Franklin County Planning and Zoning 6 Commission. 7 Scottie, would you take roll call. 8 MS. EAGAN: Sure. 9 John Fischer? 10 COMMISSIONER FISCHER: Here. 11 MS. EAGAN: Jay Schultehenrich? 12 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 13 Here. 14 MS. EAGAN: Ray Cunio? 15 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Here. 16 MS. EAGAN: Bill Evans? 17 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Here. 18 MS. EAGAN: Kevin Kriete? 19 COMMISSIONER KRIETE: Here. 20 MS. EAGAN: Eva Gadcke? 21 COMMISSIONER GADCKE: (Not 22 present.) 23 MS. EAGAN: Tim Reinhold? 24 COMMISSIONER REINHOLD: Here. 25 MS. EAGAN: And, Don Voss?

6 6 1 COMMISSIONER VOSS: Here. 2 MS. EAGAN: Okay. We have a 3 quorum. 4 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Thank you. 5 Please give us the presentation of the hearing 6 procedures and exhibits. 7 MS. EAGAN: Tonight's Planning 8 Commission hearing is governed by the Franklin 9 County Unified Land Use regulations of At this time, I would like to place into 11 the record these regulations as Exhibit A, the 12 official Zoning Map as Exhibit B, the official 13 Master Plan as Exhibit C, and the case file for each 14 case as Exhibit D for all the cases to be heard at 15 this hearing. 16 (Thereupon, evidence was marked 17 for identification as Exhibits A, B, C, 18 and D.) 19 All Old Business items on the agenda will 20 be dealt with first. The Planning Commission will 21 address each case and may request additional 22 information from anyone prior to making a decision. 23 Once the Old Business issues have been 24 taken care of, each item of New Business will be 25 open for public hearing. As each case is opened for

7 7 1 hearing, a staff report will be first be read to the 2 Commission, followed by any questions for the staff. 3 If anyone in the audience would like to 4 speak or comment during the public hearing, they 5 must first print their name on the sign-in sheet 6 provided, and then be sworn in by the Chairman. 7 When it is your turn to speak, you will come to the 8 front of the room to address the Commission and only 9 the Commission, not anyone in the audience, with any 10 questions or comments. 11 It is possible for the Planning Commission 12 to decide to move a New Business issue to Old 13 Business and vote on it the same night. 14 At the conclusion of all questions, 15 comments, and discussion concerning each case, the 16 public hearing for that case will conclude, and the 17 Planning Commission will proceed. Any decision by 18 the Planning Commission may be appealed to the Board 19 of Zoning Adjustment any time within 90 days. 20 Applications for such a appeal may be acquired from 21 the department offices during the normal business 22 hours. 23 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Thank you. 24 All the Commissioners should have received 25 a copy of the December 18th minutes and had a chance

8 8 1 to review them. Any additions or corrections? 2 (None voiced.) 3 If not, the Chair will entertain a motion 4 to approve the minutes. 5 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 6 Mr. Chairman, I'll make that motion to approve the 7 minutes. 8 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Do we have a 9 second? 10 COMMISSIONER KRIETE: Second. 11 CHAIRMAN EVANS: We have a 12 motion and a second to approve the minutes. All in 13 favor signify by saying aye. 14 COMMISSIONER REINHOLD: Aye. 15 COMMISSIONER VOSS: Aye. 16 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Aye. 17 COMMISSIONER KRIETE: Aye. 18 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Aye. 19 COMMISSIONER FISCHER: Aye. 20 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 21 Aye. 22 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Opposed? 23 (None.) The minutes are approved. 24 Old Business: File was addressed 25 last month, and has been tabled to the February 19th

9 9 1 meeting. We have no other Old Business. 2 So moving on to New Business: File , Jim Latzel is requesting a Conditional Use 4 Permit to operate a philanthropic kennel and 5 boarding stable in the Agricultural Non-Urban Zoning 6 District. 7 The property is located at 6457 Highway 8 AC. 9 Scottie, will you give us the details. 10 MS. EAGAN: The Facts: The 11 total acreage of the property is approximately acres in size. 13 Applicant has expressed interest in 14 dividing off approximately 41 acres for this 15 activity. 16 This property is located in the 17 Agricultural Non-Urban Zoning District. In this 18 District, philanthropic uses, including associated 19 educational and instructional activities and 20 kennels, require a Conditional Use Permit. 21 The properties surrounding this proposed 22 site are zoned Agricultural Non-Urban. 23 The area surrounding the proposed site is 24 primarily undeveloped land with a few low-density 25 residential properties approximately 1,000 feet

10 10 1 away. 2 There is one residential building 3 currently on the property. 4 This property has no clear access. It 5 appears this property uses a private drive, not a 6 platted road, to access this property. 7 The Applicant is not the current owner. 8 The property is owned by the Karen Gupta Trust. 9 Staff Comments: The Applicant should have 10 proposed hours of operation. 11 Any building used in connection with this 12 CUP will need to be approved by the Franklin County 13 Building Department. 14 One space is required for 300 square feet 15 of gross floor area for philanthropic uses. 16 All conditions shall be completed within 17 one year of approval, unless otherwise stated. 18 Failure to meet all conditions within the 19 specified time would result in the Conditional Use 20 Permit being void. 21 The Applicant shall be limited to the 22 number of runs for the kennel. 23 Parking spaces shall be provided in 24 accordance with Article 12 of the Unified Land Use 25 Regulations.

11 11 1 The Applicant plans to divide off 40 2 acres. Planning and Zoning shall receive 3 documentation prior to issuing the Conditional Use 4 Permit. 5 The Applicant shall not commence 6 operations until all conditions are met and the 7 permit is issued. 8 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Thank you. 9 Is the Applicant present? 10 MR. LATZEL: Yes, sir. 11 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Would you 12 please step forward, and state your name and address 13 and sign in, please. 14 MR. LATZEL: Jim Latzel, Highway AC, Sullivan, Missouri. 16 CHAIRMAN EVANS: And if you 17 would, sign in, please. 18 MR. LATZEL: (Signing in.) 19 (Thereupon, the witness was 20 sworn on his oath by the Chairman, and 21 testified as follows:) 22 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Please give us 23 some detail on what you're proposing. 24 MR. LATZEL: Well, what it is is 25 a -- a similar to the Humane Society type situation

12 12 1 of animals that -- abused animals that have no place 2 to go, other shelters that have too many animals 3 that we take them in and board them and try to adopt 4 them out. 5 CHAIRMAN EVANS: All right. 6 It says you're going to try and split off 7 41 acres of an existing property. 8 MR. LATZEL: Yes, sir. When I 9 filled that out, I thought I put -- there's acres total there, and I have a certain 40 acres 11 surveyed out of that for the -- for the sanctuary. 12 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Okay. Is this 13 an existing operation? 14 MR. LATZEL: No. 15 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Now, this land 16 is not owned by you. You're just going to split 17 this off. Is this going to remain with the existing 18 owner? 19 MR. LATZEL: Yes. What it is, 20 sir, is a doctor and his wife have owned this ground 21 for quite a few years, and it's been like her last 22 thing on her bucket list to do for the animals. And 23 I'm the director of -- for the sanctuary. 24 CHAIRMAN EVANS: And there is 25 one house on the property?

13 13 1 MR. LATZEL: On the 40 acres, 2 yes. 3 CHAIRMAN EVANS: On the 40 4 acres. 5 MR. LATZEL: She put up another 6 one over on the other section that she's saving for 7 conservation. 8 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Do you have 9 plans on exactly what you would be building there as 10 far as kennels? 11 MR. LATZEL: Just that -- it was 12 really hard to do anything till we come to you 13 people first, as far as planning and designing. We 14 were thinking somewhere around dogs, you 15 know. It was my understanding that when we get done 16 here, then we would go to the Building Commission. 17 So we really couldn't get too elaborate on 18 drawing out any plans of what we could do till we 19 found out what we needed to do here first. 20 We were trying -- what we were wanting to 21 do was do 40 dogs with like doing soundproofing on on the inside and the outside of the kennels 23 where it would be more of a box shape. Instead of 24 echoing out, it echoes back into the -- to the 25 kennels itself, where the dogs are at.

14 14 1 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Any questions 2 from the Commissioners? Ray? 3 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Jim, when 4 you said animals, are you talking exclusively dogs? 5 MR. LATZEL: No. No, it's dogs, 6 horses, mules, burrows, ducks, geese. You know you 7 just wouldn't believe -- I don't know if anybody 8 here has been out to Long Meadow Rescue Ranch. 9 They're pretty much exclusively horses, and they're 10 just loaded to the max with ducks and geese. 11 Just simple things like that that you 12 wouldn't think that there isn't any homes for, there there isn't. I mean, it's -- so we're pretty 14 open. I mean, we're not going to do birds or snakes 15 or any of that type thing. 16 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: And your 17 sanctuary will be on the 40 acres, right? 18 MR. LATZEL: Yes. 19 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: And of 20 course, I know you mentioned kennels here. I assume 21 that those will be exclusively for the dogs, right? 22 MR. LATZEL: Correct. 23 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: What other 24 accommodations are you going to have for, you know, 25 the donkeys or whatever else you bring in?

15 15 1 MR. LATZEL: Horse barns. 2 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Horse -- 3 horse barns? 4 MR. LATZEL: Yeah. Yeah, 5 they'll have the panels -- the panels in just like 6 Long -- Long Meadow Rescue Ranch has. 7 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: And you're 8 going to bringing these stray animals in, and some 9 of them probably abused or whatever. Are they going 10 to be -- going to have a vet? Are they all going to 11 be -- receive their vet work before you bring them 12 in or MR. LATZEL: What they do is 14 they go into quarantine for -- if it's one that has 15 come from another -- I can't think of the word I'm 16 looking for. But if it's one that hasn't come from 17 another place that somebody else has picked it up, 18 it's been rescued by somebody else, they go into 19 quarantine for two weeks, and then we use McDonald 20 at Sullivan to do -- we're leaning towards as our 21 vet. 22 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: And will 23 this be a public operation, will the public be 24 coming and going, or just MR. LATZEL: We'll have like an

16 16 1 adoption day on Friday, and then half a day on 2 Saturday we'll be open to the public. 3 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: And I 4 noticed it says here -- Item No. 6 on the back says 5 the property has no clear access. 6 MR. LATZEL: As far as? 7 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: The road 8 from -- off AC into the property. 9 MR. LATZEL: Yes, we have a road 10 in there. 11 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: The road, 12 is it an easement or MR. LATZEL: No, we own the 14 strip. 15 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: You own the 16 road? 17 MR. LATZEL: From AC, yeah. 18 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Just just out of curiosity here. The word philanthropic 20 that's used, is it -- I don't know -- the way you 21 describe it, I don't know whether it's a 22 philanthropic operation or not. 23 MR. LATZEL: Well, that was when I was filling out the application, that word 25 came up, and I asked them if I would write it on the

17 17 1 application, because I hadn't really heard that word 2 too much. So -- 3 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: I guess the 4 question to Scottie, is it appropriate that we have 5 an application where we -- are we going to leave it 6 as philanthropic? We don't have a definition for 7 philanthropic. 8 MS. EAGAN: I mean, I wasn't -- 9 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Or does it 10 make any difference, I guess? 11 MS. EAGAN: I mean, in terms of 12 parking, it would for -- but I mean, that's that's not a big issue. I think what we mean with 14 philanthropic was operating under a 501(c)(3). 15 Is that what you're operating under? 16 MR. LATZEL: Yes, 503. I think 17 it's 503(c). 18 ATTORNEY VINCENT: 501(c)(3). 19 MS. EAGAN: So that he would 20 nonprofit. 21 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Question to 22 Mark. Is that -- is that the qualifying factor or 23 one of the qualifying factors to be a 501(c)(3) to 24 be philanthropic? 25 ATTORNEY VINCENT: Yes, it is.

18 18 1 It is a charitable organization, charitable 2 structure. No one is making money on the deal, only 3 the employees are being paid, you know. Red Cross 4 has a lot of not-for-profit philanthropic, but it 5 has a lot of paid people. So it's okay to pay 6 people, but there's no dividends or return to the 7 investors paid out. Nobody is going to make a 8 profit. 9 If the owners of the land were to make 10 money other than a fair-market-value rent, IRS would 11 pull their 501(c)(3) status. So that's how they 12 control it. 13 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: So to use 14 the conventional definition of philanthropic which 15 is, you know, promote human welfare, I guess. Are 16 we saying by taking care of animals, we're promoting 17 human welfare? 18 ATTORNEY VINCENT: Philanthropic 19 is not just human welfare conditions. There's all 20 kinds of things that are philanthropic. 21 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: I'm just 22 going by Webster's definition. 23 ATTORNEY VINCENT: Let me go get 24 my Black Law Dictionary. 25 COMMISSION CUNIO: What Black's

19 19 1 Law Dictionary and read that. I don't want to make 2 a big deal out it. I was just curious to ask. 3 ATTORNEY VINCENT: I'll get it. 4 It's right here. 5 CHAIRMAN EVANS: So you are 6 organized -- 7 MR. LATZEL: Yes. 8 CHAIRMAN EVANS: -- as a 9 501(c)(3)? 10 MR. LATZEL: Yes. 11 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: So I assume 12 you have fencing, good fencing, all around the whole 13 property. You said you would bring -- would be a 14 variety of animals here. 15 MR. LATZEL: To kind of sum that 16 up, I've spent just a tad shy of a million dollars 17 up there this past year. 18 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Really? 19 MR. LATZEL: I mean, that farm 20 has been rundown and let go, and 30 some years ago, 21 I guess, I used to grain farm it. And it's 22 surprising when you let property go, how quick it 23 can spend money on it. 24 But we've done all new fencing around the 25 whole 167 acres, a lot of improvements, a lot of

20 20 1 removal of cedars,just on and on. 2 COMMISSION CUNIO: But the -- 3 but the application is saying it's only going to be 4 the 40 acres. 5 MR. LATZEL: Correct. 6 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Yeah. 7 MR. LATZEL: And then it's my 8 understanding, the way she's explained it to me, 9 that any time that I needed more ground, if we 10 expanded out off that 40 acres, she'd be more than 11 willing to donate more ground. 12 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Now, Scottie, 13 correct me if I'm wrong. But if we give the CUP, it 14 would be for the acres, and the expansion 15 would require you to come back MR. LATZEL: Okay. 17 CHAIRMAN EVANS -- to modify that 18 Conditional Use Permit. 19 MR. LATZEL: Okay. 20 CHAIRMAN EVANS: So that's the 21 whole deal with the conditional use, is what you do 22 and where you do it. 23 MR. LATZEL: So do I -- should I 24 maybe say now that I want to try to do the acres, and then change -- what she wants to do is

21 21 1 the remainder of the ground going to conservation, 2 and conservation -- 3 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Right, and I 4 can't tell you what to do. I'm just saying that the 5 Conditional Use Permit, as far as specific plot of 6 ground, in this case acres, and you would have 7 to come back to modify that Conditional Use Permit 8 if you wanted to increase the size of the operation. 9 Or you could request a larger size now. 10 It's -- that -- that is up to you. 11 MR. LATZEL: Well, I'd like to 12 request a larger size now if I could. 13 CHAIRMAN EVANS: You would just 14 have to, I guess, modify and give that to Scottie. 15 Would that be correct? 16 MS. EAGAN: Uh-huh, because what 17 we would probably do on the application is say 18 you're requesting to use X amount of acres and not 19 give a parcel number to it. 20 MR. LATZEL: Okay. 21 COMMISSIONER KRIETE: The 22 property hasn't been divided yet, right? 23 MS. EAGAN: No. 24 COMMISSIONER KRIETE: So it's acre parcel right now. So --

22 22 1 MS. EAGAN: Right. It would 2 give him a Conditional Use Permit on the whole 3 piece. If we wanted until he divided it, then we 4 could wait on the size. 5 CHAIRMAN EVANS: That's right. 6 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Correct -- 7 correct me if I'm wrong, but I mean, you said you're 8 going -- we're looking at the 40 acres right now, 9 and that's going to be used for the sanctuary. If 10 we expand it to whatever you want, the entire 11 acreage, and that would permit him to use it for 12 running the animals over the entire area. But as 13 far as the conservation part, we wouldn't get 14 involved in any activity as far as CHAIRMAN EVANS: No, they could 16 do whatever they wanted. They could use the acres, and they could do the conservation COMMISSIONER CUNIO: On the 19 other. 20 CHAIRMAN EVANS: -- on the other 21 until they saw -- needed to use that acreage. So you 22 would not -- they wouldn't have to use it, but they 23 would have the ability to use it without having to 24 come back to us. 25 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: So in other

23 23 1 words, Jim, the way I see it is you could use it for 2 -- you know, if -- the full 160, if that's what you 3 went for, for all of the animals if that's what 4 you're intending. 5 MR. LATZEL: Yes, that's what 6 I'd like to do, because there's -- there's areas -- 7 she hasn't done it as of yet with the conservation, 8 as of with anything new, you know, you know it's 9 going to grow, hopefully it'll grow. And there there'd be -- I think it would probably be better 11 for us in the long run if we could just go ahead and 12 do that with the 167 acres, you know. 13 We just don't really know what the future 14 is going to bring, but it would save time and money 15 for us down the road if that would be acceptable 16 with you people. 17 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Yeah, I -- if 18 you intend to use it in the future. Again, it's up 19 to you, but I would get -- I would probably modify 20 the application to include the larger acreage. 21 I did have one question on the proposed 22 sanitary sewer drain deal that you're showing on the 23 little blueprint there. Exactly what is that? 24 MR. LATZEL: We really don't 25 know the size of water that would be used, and as of

24 24 1 the first of the year, I've just retired. I owned a 2 septic sewer company, and I didn't -- you know, we 3 don't know if we need to go to the lagoon system, 4 underground system, and I just kind of left that 5 open because we -- we really can't say till we've 6 got the building, you know, the water flow, what's 7 going to come out of each kennel, how big of a 8 lagoon or septic system would be. 9 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Okay. The only 10 reason I ask, and requesting a larger parcel may 11 resolve this, but that proposed sanitary sewer field 12 is outside that acres as -- as we see it on 13 here. 14 MR. LATZEL: I think that sketch 15 is from Wonderlick. That's who I had do some 16 surveying out there. What that is, is where the 17 dividing line is of that 41 acres. 18 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Right. 19 MR. LATZEL: That -- that is 20 actually for where my house is at there. To make it 21 even, we just done an easement to that drain field. 22 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Okay. 23 MS. EAGAN: I have a question. 24 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Scottie. 25 MS. EAGAN: Dividing off this 41

25 25 1 acres, what was the purpose of that originally? 2 MR. LATZEL: Part of -- the 3 original was part of the farm sanctuary, and then 4 the remainder would be for the conservation area. 5 MS. EAGAN: What's left of the 6 hundred and something acres, is that what you're 7 talking about, the remainder? 8 MR. LATZEL: Yes, but as time's 9 went on and I've spent their money, they've kind of 10 seen where it would be pretty easy to grow bigger 11 than the 40 acres. 12 MS. EAGAN: Okay. Do you think 13 in the future you would ever want to separate 14 certain acres from it, or do you think it would just 15 be one under this? 16 MR. LATZEL: I'd really rather 17 not separate it. 18 MS. EAGAN: Okay. 19 MR. LATZEL: I'm not going to 20 live ever. I -- the way we've got this set up is 21 like perpetual. When she dies, when I die, it still 22 keeps running. 23 MS. EAGAN: Okay. I guess my 24 question for you is if you divide in the future, how 25 would that affect the Conditional Use Permit?

26 26 1 ATTORNEY VINCENT: He can't 2 expand a conditional use. I'm not sure you can't 3 shrink it. 4 MS. EAGAN: Okay. Sometimes we 5 put the parcel number on the permit, and the parcel 6 number stays with it. 7 ATTORNEY VINCENT: But this is 8 off the record here, Scottie -- I mean, off the wall 9 here, but parcel numbers don't control it really. 10 MS. EAGAN: Right. I'm just 11 thinking in terms of finding it in the future and 12 what it originally went with. But I mean, in the 13 past, we didn't put parcel numbers on permits. So I 14 just wanted to make sure it won't affect in the 15 future it would have on it. 16 ATTORNEY VINCENT: Sure. You 17 know, having said that, we're all dead and he's 18 dead, who knows what's going to happen. 19 MS. EAGAN: Right. 20 CHAIRMAN EVANS: I guess just 21 out of curiosity, if they have 180 acres included in 22 the Conditional Use Permit, they can use 60 acres 23 and decided to sell it off in the future. Then that 24 would not be included? 25 ATTORNEY VINCENT: That'd be

27 27 1 correct. Right. 2 CHAIRMAN EVANS: That is, the 3 owner would not request it. So it wouldn't go with 4 the land if it was sold off. 5 ATTORNEY VINCENT: That's 6 correct. Right. 7 CHAIRMAN EVANS: So -- 8 ATTORNEY VINCENT: Yeah, you 9 can't get two conditional uses out of one. 10 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Right. Okay. 11 MR. LATZEL: It's set up now 12 where it can never be sold, sold or developed. 13 CHAIRMAN EVANS: With the 14 conservation? 15 MR. LATZEL: Well, no, not with 16 them. I mean, legally with the deed that it can 17 never -- it can change hands, but it could never be 18 developed. 19 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Okay. And that 20 would be in the trust? 21 MR. LATZEL: Yes. 22 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Any other 23 questions? (None voiced.) Okay. 24 I think a couple of things we probably 25 need, even though the Building Department has to

28 28 1 approve all the structures, is we'd have a little 2 bit more detail I believe on the animals that you 3 would have there, you know, what the kennels -- you 4 know they may have to approve the barn and the 5 kennels, but we'd have to have some idea exactly the 6 capacity that you're going to have there and what 7 it's going to look like. 8 MR. LATZEL: We'd be at 40 on 9 dogs maximum. On horses, we'd be at 12, horses, 10 burrows, donkeys, et cetera. 11 At some point in time, I'm sure that we'll 12 have cats in there. But you know, we really don't 13 know. That's the whole thing that's so hard about 14 this is we really don't know the size. You know, he 15 demand's out there. If you had a hundred horse 16 stalls, you could fill those hundred horse stalls 17 real easily. 18 But for now, all we can figure on is maximum of dogs, and 11 or 12 for the horse stalls. 20 You know, and then the funding, they -- they've 21 funded it and fund this now themselves. You know, 22 we don't take any -- any other funding. There will 23 be a point in time we will, but then it goes into 24 growth. So it's really hard for me to say on, you 25 know, other than what I just did.

29 29 1 Forty -- there might be a point in time we 2 might go to 80, and it might be a year from now or 3 two years from now, and five years from now, we 4 might still be at CHAIRMAN EVANS: And the reason 6 I ask is not just because it's -- it's animals and 7 kennels. Any Conditional Use Permit is that we -- 8 as one of the conditions, we will have capacity of 9 whatever business is taking place there. So we have 10 to have some idea, and if we put in 40 dogs and horses, you know, in the Conditional Use Permit, 12 again, anything over and above that would not be 13 allowed in the Conditional Use Permit. 14 MR. LATZEL: Okay. I see what 15 you're saying. 16 MS. EAGAN: One suggestion we 17 could do is, I mean, if you wanted, you could wait 18 another month,and you could get information of the 19 potential of how many you could possibly keep on 20 that many acres now that you're doing the whole 21 piece instead of just the You come back before our review committee, 23 who will meet at the beginning of February, and then 24 they can make their decision next month. That way 25 you're not limiting yourself to a specific number

30 30 1 tonight. It would be next month. 2 MR. LATZEL: Is there any 3 specific number that -- that you require that can be 4 put on? I mean, if I said a hundred dogs and 80 5 horses and 40 cats, you know, is there a limitation 6 of how many animals that we could put on? 7 CHAIRMAN EVANS: You can request 8 whatever you want. Now, the Commissioners may come 9 back and say a hundred horses is too many, we'll 10 allow you 70. But again, we're just trying to make 11 it easy for you saying MR. LATZEL: Right. 13 CHAIRMAN EVANS: -- let us know 14 what you're going to MR. LATZEL: Right. 16 CHAIRMAN EVANS -- what your max 17 is, and we can work down from that. You don't want 18 to come in and limit yourself and have to come back 19 again, again, and again. 20 MR. LATZEL: I appreciate that 21 very much. While we're here and I'm here tonight, 22 would it be all right if I just requested it for a 23 hundred dogs and eighty horses, forty cats? 24 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Yeah. You 25 would still have to get with Scottie, I think, to

31 31 1 amend any complications on the acreage. 2 And Scottie -- if you call Scottie any 3 details we require. Now, because it will be open 4 like on Friday and Saturday, is there any 5 requirements as far as revenues or anything like 6 that or -- 7 MS. EAGAN: Ut-uh. 8 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 9 Mr. Chairman, I CHAIRMAN EVANS: Jay? 11 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: If 12 we're talking about determining how many horses or 13 how many geese or how many ducks or whatever is to 14 be on this property, aren't we treading on an area 15 that we're all of a sudden entering into determining 16 how many animals can actually be in a potential 17 agricultural area? 18 And I don't -- I don't feel comfortable in 19 heading in that direction with -- with a limitation, 20 per se. If you're going to talk about a kennel on 21 there, I think a kennel may be something to give 22 consideration potentially to, depending upon the 23 number runs, et cetera. So there I wouldn't have certainly I -- I could share a little concern of 25 yours in which you're speaking, but I think -- I

32 32 1 think we're entering into a very questionable area 2 as to saying well how many horses would you expect 3 to have or how many donkeys. 4 I think the gentleman already has 5 emphasized, at least I think to say, the whole some acres is already fenced. So I think that's a 7 -- certainly I think that's a consideration there, 8 but again, I just -- I feel I'm a little hesitant 9 that we would be going down that past, Mr. Chairman. 10 CHAIRMAN EVANS: I agree more on 11 the horses because it depends entirely if they're 12 free range or if you had them on hay or whatever, 13 you could have 300 or -- or 25, but I think the 14 kennels is certainly we've had this issue before on on kennels. Probably would be the issue, and I 16 agree with you. 17 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 18 And I -- go ahead. I'm sorry. 19 COMMISSIONER REINHOLD: The 20 other question, the other thing we have to remember 21 about this is most of the kennels get inspected 22 three or four times a year by the State, and the 23 State guidelines for kennels are pretty strict. 24 They go out there and see the dogs not 25 being taken care of or if the kennels are not clean,

33 33 1 things like that, they'll shut them down 2 immediately. That's statewide. 3 So I think some of that would be put on 4 the State authority with that. 5 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Right. 6 MR. LATZEL: And we have to be 7 licensed with the Department of Agriculture, and 8 they come out four to six times a year to do 9 inspections. Every dog that comes in has a set of 10 paperwork, whether we were to rescue it or it comes 11 from a Humane Society or it comes from some other 12 kennel. It has to come in with paperwork or we 13 start paperwork on it, and that documentation stays 14 with that dog till it's adopted out, or if it goes 15 to another kennel because they have room and we're 16 filled up, that documentation stays with that dog. 17 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: I just was 18 going to say I agree with Jay. He made the 19 complaint I was going to make, that I mean, we're 20 talking about an agriculturally zoned area. 21 Kennels are one thing meeting the State 22 specifications that you're going to keep dogs in a 23 kennel. But when you talk about, as you said, 24 horses or geese or whatever you're going to have on 25 a hundred and -- if the Applicant decides to go with

34 34 1 the 160 acres, I mean, that's -- that's quite a bit 2 of ground, and it's an agricultural activity. No 3 other agricultural activity out there is judged 4 according to how many animals they can have on their 5 place or not have on their place. It's left to 6 their discretion. So I agree with Jay, that I think 7 dogs are one thing, but -- and maybe the cats. I 8 don't know. 9 What -- what's your intentions on the 10 cats? 11 MR. LATZEL: Uh, you know COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Because 13 cats can be a problem in the neighborhood. 14 MR. LATZEL: Yeah. 15 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Well, maybe 16 out there because people take care of them. 17 MR. LATZEL: They go to the hay 18 barn. 19 ATTORNEY VINCENT: If you look 20 at it maybe a little differently, you know. You 21 guys are hitting on it exactly right. You're 22 talking about something that normally if it's going 23 to be a farm, you can go out there and just do it, 24 and you can have as many as you want. 25 But isn't it not a function more the

35 35 1 kennel being -- what effect it would have on the 2 surrounding property and the noise and that? So what 3 about a setback, location of a kennel itself, not 4 the size? 5 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 6 But I don't think -- Mark, I don't think -- from 7 what I'm seeing here, it looks as though potentially 8 the property is -- is enclosed with -- by woods, 9 from what I'm seeing there. 10 ATTORNEY VINCENT: Right. 11 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: At 12 least in that regards. 13 ATTORNEY VINCENT: And I don't 14 know that there are any neighbors around there or 15 potential neighbors in the future. 16 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 17 Well, I was looking up there at first to see if 18 there was something that would show what was behind 19 the building, but MS. EAGAN: We can't get it to 21 work. 22 COMMISSIONER KRIETE: I think 23 you got a lot of good ideas. I think maybe a little 24 bit more on paper here to kind of zoning and 25 building plan, but just a lot plan that shows

36 36 1 exactly how this is going to layout on the property 2 would be. 3 MR. LATZEL: Did I submit -- 4 MS. EAGAN: The only thing we 5 have was this. 6 MR. LATZEL: Well, that's smack 7 in the middle of that 40, at least how is was going 8 to be. The closest house is 3/4 of a mile away, and 9 the closest to our property line is approximately foot to any neighbor. 11 MS. EAGAN: So it's -- in 12 relation with this Wonderlick one, it shows the 13 existing house. 14 MR. LATZEL: Yes. 15 MS. EAGAN: Where in relation to 16 that is this potential for it, like in the middle 17 of, smack in the middle? 18 MR. LATZEL: Yes, right in the 19 middle. 20 MS. EAGAN: Okay. So he's 21 saying right around where it says acres, which 22 was on this Wonderlick survey. That's in your 23 packet. 24 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: I'm 25 sorry. Say that again, Scottie.

37 37 1 MS. EAGAN: He said it's going 2 to be right around where it says acres. 3 COMMISSIONER KRIETE: Will be 4 where the kennel is? 5 MS. EAGAN: Right. 6 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 7 Okay. 8 ATTORNEY VINCENT: So again, 9 we're sure that no kennels will be located closer 10 than X number of feet from the property line. 11 There's no way -- you can put one heck of 12 a lot of kennels on a hundred and some acres. 13 MR. LATZEL: Well, we'd like to 14 restrict that too. You know, we're trying to do it 15 the right way and build it the right way and go 16 about it the right way. And it's -- we're treading 17 new ground, and I tried to go around to other places 18 and get input from them and thoughts of where they 19 think that they might have messed up in the past as 20 far as kennels, as far as barns, and things like 21 that. 22 And I'm just trying to go about it the 23 right way, and you know, make it functional for 24 everybody. One thing about this every animal we 25 have up there, maybe excluding a few chickens, were

38 are adoption type animals. You know, it's not 2 like that they're -- they're there. They've got 3 special needs. It's not like they're going to be 4 there forever. There might be exception to the rule 5 of one or two older horses or dogs that, you know, 6 won't adopt out, that we'll just go ahead and keep. 7 CHAIRMAN EVANS; Now, I think 8 all the Commissioners would agree that what you're 9 doing is great. I've been to Longview, and that's 10 quite the operation out there. You know, it's 11 something that's needed. 12 Yeah, I would suggest that we just get a 13 little bit more detail and just deal with Scottie on 14 it so we know where -- where the kennel is going to 15 be, where you're going to put the buildings, the 16 amount of acreage. 17 And she mentioned we have a review 18 committee that meets early next month, and they may 19 want to make a site visit, just to look at it, and 20 the review committee will make a recommendation then 21 to the entire Commission next month. 22 MR. LATZEL: Okay. 23 CHAIRMAN EVANS: And then we 24 would possibly take action then. 25 Any other questions from the

39 39 1 Commissioners? 2 COMMISSIONER REINHOLD: Bill, I 3 was wondering. I guess is there any way that you 4 could put a setback on it, say a 200-foot from the 5 property line, and move this to Old Business and 6 vote on it this evening? And -- because it would 7 stipulations that we have have some improvement of? 8 I guess I've talked to the gentleman 9 before the meeting. We were just talking about some 10 of these things and what they want. They want to 11 get a Conditional Use and then hire a consultant to 12 go ahead and guild it, to get it going, because they 13 don't want to spend the money it takes to get the 14 design and all that unless they knew for sure 15 they're going to get a Conditional Use. 16 CHAIRMAN EVANS: That would be 17 up to the Commissioners. 18 I just feel more comfortable having the 19 detail, having it on -- having it on paper. I don't 20 see any problem with getting it, and then acting on 21 it next month. But again, it's the -- it's the 22 Commissioners and anyone at any time can make a 23 motion. 24 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 25 Mr. Chairman, I would agree with you on that. I

40 40 1 think it would be wise to let's provide an 2 opportunity for staff and the gentleman to meet to 3 provide a little bit more detail, but I would 4 certainly sense that certainly I will express my -- 5 my thoughts to you. And that is that -- that I have 6 no reservations in regards to what you're proposing. 7 Okay. 8 And certainly right now on everything I 9 see, it's my plans to move forward with approval. 10 My vote would be to approve. Okay. 11 So if need something like that to move 12 forward with, you know, because I would be more than 13 willing to open up at least and say in all 14 likelihood I will vote for it. Okay. But again, I 15 think we need to have a little bit more detail 16 before we do that. I think it'd be wise for us to 17 basically cover some of the basis yet on there. 18 Okay. So COMMISSIONER REINHOLD: Sure. 20 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 21 Okay. 22 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Yeah. We have 23 a responsibility to do the due diligence here, and 24 again, I feel the same way. I think we're just 25 looking at a couple of details, and I see no problem

41 41 1 with the operation in general. 2 MR. LATZEL: Okay. 3 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Any other 4 questions? 5 MS. EAGAN: You just want to 6 call me or come by the office, we can sit down -- 7 MR. LATZEL: Okay. 8 MS. EAGAN: -- get it all done. 9 They meet on February 8th. So it will 10 need to be before that. 11 MR. LATZEL: Okay. Thank you, 12 gentlemen. 13 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Thank you. 14 I guess we need a motion probably to send 15 this -- Jay? 16 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: Is 17 there anybody CHAIRMAN EVANS: Oh, yeah. Is 19 there anybody present who would like to speak 20 regarding this? (None.) 21 If not, I think we need a motion to send 22 it to the Review Committee. 23 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: I make a 24 motion we send it to the Review Committee. 25 COMMISSIONER KRIETE: Second.

42 42 1 CHAIRMAN EVANS: There's a 2 motion and a second. All in favor signify by saying 3 aye. 4 COMMISSIONER REINHOLD: Aye. 5 COMMISSIONER VOSS: Aye. 6 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: Aye. 7 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Aye. 8 COMMISSIONER KRIETE: Aye. 9 COMMISSIONER FISCHER: Aye. 10 COMMISSIONER SCHULTEHENRICH: 11 Aye. 12 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Opposed? 13 (None.) The motion carried. 14 COMMISSIONER REINHOLD: I just 15 wanted to say that I went by there because I seen it 16 from the road doing all that they've done. It looks 17 like it's going to be a class -- pretty classy 18 place. And it looks like it's all done. I mean, 19 everything they've done so far around there is 20 really nice. 21 COMMISSIONER CUNIO: It 22 certainly not going to hold anything up, is it, just 23 by the Review Committee and all the crossing the Ts 24 and dotting the Is? 25 COMMISSIONER REINHOLD: I don't

43 43 1 think so. I think they were just -- they wanted a 2 feel of it, I guess, today. And nobody's opposing 3 it. They would have -- they didn't want to spend 4 engineering fees for everything until they had a 5 confirmation. 6 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Yes. All 7 right. 8 Preliminary plats. We have none. 9 Planning and Zoning Commission Forum. 10 Anyone have any issues? (None voiced.) 11 Planning Director's Report. 12 MS. EAGAN: As you got my 13 , we're going to kind of hold off on the whole 14 training with Mark until we get new commissioners 15 appointed. We felt that it wouldn't make a lot of 16 sense to educate you guys only to have to educate 17 them in the future. 18 I'm meeting with the Commission on 19 Thursday, and hopefully they'll have some names of 20 some people that they've been talking to that that they want to appoint. 22 Also we decided that the County -- I think 23 Mark talked a little bit about it last month as 24 doing a thing called codification where all of our 25 codes are going to be under one book. And so before

44 44 1 we do that, the Planning and Zoning staff is doing a 2 complete overhaul of our regulations this year. And 3 our plan is to do it piece-by-piece. So 4 article-by-article, and then go through the 5 appendix, and as we get a few done, we'll send it to 6 you guys for review and recommendation. And then 7 we'll send it up to the Commission as a full. 8 Right now we're starting with zoning 9 districts and subdivision regulations. We figured 10 that will take us the most time to go through and 11 make changes and submit it to you guys, and it would 12 probably be the longest process for you guys to 13 review and make recommendations to the County 14 Commission. 15 So we'll do 7, 8, and then we'll start 16 back and go 3, 4, 5, 6, so on and so on, and the 17 last one will deal with Article 2, the definitions. 18 So if anybody has any suggestions of 19 things that you've seen with our regulations that 20 have been issues in the past or anything that's not 21 there that you guys would like, let myself, Tori or 22 Nichole know because we're the ones that are going 23 to be doing it. 24 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Okay. 25 Communications and Visitor Comments. Is

45 45 1 there anyone here wishing to address the Commission? 2 MR. PROEMSEY: Yes. 3 CHAIRMAN EVANS: Please state 4 your name and address and sign in, please. 5 MR. PROEMSEY: My name's Larry 6 Proemsey. I live at 101 Skyview Lane, Labadie, 7 Missouri. 8 (Thereupon, the witness was 9 sworn on his oath by the Chairman.) 10 I know some of the guys here, and they they know who I am. I -- I run a company called 12 Skyview Construction and Crane, and one of the main 13 things we do is build cell towers. I have nine 14 crane crews, four civil crews, and currently I think 15 thirteen power crews. So we build a lot of towers. 16 We do other things too. We're the we're the largest crane, hoisting and rigging 18 contractor in the -- in Franklin County. We -- we 19 have a lot of cranes. We -- we don't put trusses on 20 houses very often. Every once in a while I do it 21 for Tim, but I don't do it for very many people. 22 Mostly we have big cranes. Our customers 23 are AT&T Cellular, Union Pacific Railroad, Ameren. 24 That's the kind of stuff that we do, but by in large and I built most of the bridges in Franklin

46 46 1 County. We set most of the curbs on them around 2 here, mostly in this part of the state. 3 In addition to that, like I said, we build 4 a lot of towers. My biggest customer is AT&T 5 Cellular. They're currently in the midst of a 6 really, really vigorous build program, as are all 7 the cellular carriers. AT&T particularly though. 8 And we build about three -- we'll touch in 9 the average year five to seven hundred cell sites, 10 and we'll build from the ground up as many as a 11 hundred, maybe a little bit more. 12 And where I live is basically -- I know 13 John and Tim and some of you guys may well know 14 where Skyview Lane is, but if Skyview Lane comes 15 over the back of Maplewood Hill Farm Estate. It's 16 just a little bit to the west side of Labadie, and 17 on the hill just before you drive into Labadie, if 18 you know where that's at. 19 Because I do a lot of work with AT&T and 20 because I know all the people over there, I -- I 21 have the ability to tell you where they have dead 22 zones. Not that anybody has to guess about that. 23 You come down Highway T, when you drop off the hill, 24 you won't get any signal. That's the reason. And 25 the reason for that is the nearest tower is on

47 47 1 Highway 100. It's down from Stratman's Feed, there's 2 a little like industrial park there. I don't know 3 the name of that road, but that's the closest tower 4 over there, which is on a pretty high piece of 5 ground. 6 When you get to Labadie and drop off that 7 hill, it doesn't work anymore. So there's a pretty 8 big dead zone there. 9 I talked to Scottie first about the 10 different avenues you go down to get a permit. I'd 11 like to build a tower there on my land. It would 12 serve several different purposes. In addition to 13 having a cellular carrier on there, I could probably 14 get all the cellular carriers to locate on it. I 15 haven't talked to all of them. I have a very close 16 relationship with AT&T. 17 Additionally, there is a big demand right 18 where we're at for wireless internet, and again, the 19 wireless internet for YHPI are on the same tower 20 that's on up on Highway 100. I don't know much 21 about that tower. The tower was originally feet. I extended it to 220 about three years ago, 23 and then about a year and a half ago, I took it all 24 the way to 250. We've done three structural 25 upgrades to that tower for the tower owner, who's

48 48 1 American Tower Corporation, and I can tell you that 2 that tower is maxed out. 3 It is failing structural on the G 4 standard, and I've actually got a package at the 5 office to do some more upgrades to it. 6 One of the -- the way the ordinance is 7 written, and I may be using the wrong word. Scottie 8 could tell you exactly. But in order to build a 9 tower that's taller than 80 foot tall, you have to 10 be within 2,000 feet of a lettered highway under the 11 current zoning. And I'm probably about 4,000 feet 12 off of Highway T right there. 13 Cellular technology has changed a lot in 14 the last few years, and exploded. And the -- the 15 idea that -- that cell sites are used for car phones 16 is quite honestly, you know, 1990 technology. The 17 primary focus for cellular carriers these days is 18 data transmission. I don't know how many of you 19 have got kids, but I've got a kid in high school 20 that spends more time on an ipad that comes off a 21 cellular tower when she does -- doing her -- I mean, 22 she does most of her homework on the ipad as opposed 23 to doing it like I do with a pen and pencil. And 24 I'm embarrassed to tell you that I have a 25 five-year-old that has an ipad and can work it

49 49 1 better than I can. It's a little bit embarrassing, 2 but according to AT&T's statistics, about 75 percent 3 now of their data and cellular usage is static use. 4 In other words, not somebody driving a car. 5 As a matter of fact, I don't know what all 6 you drive. I drive a big enough truck that it's 7 illegal for me to use a phone. If I get caught 8 using a phone in my truck, it's a $3,000 fine. 9 Right now, there's a pretty big dead spot 10 on that part of the planet, and I got a -- I've got 11 an opportunity with AT&T to build a tower there, and 12 what I would like -- what I'm really struggling with 13 is exactly how to do it. And Scottie explained this 14 to me, and I -- I just want to talk to the 15 Commission before I waste a lot of time here. 16 I can apply for a variance request or say the other word. 18 MS. EAGAN: An amendment. 19 MR. PROEMSEY: -- an amendment. 20 The truth of the matter is I'm not really trying to 21 reinvent the wheel or -- or crusade for anybody or 22 anything else. I would advise the Commission, and 23 like I said, I build several hundred sites a year, 24 and I have meetings with the cellular carriers every 25 day. And I can tell you that in the future they're

50 50 1 probably -- and I know you're talking about revising 2 your code. So maybe that'll all come up in that -- 3 in that point. If somebody, you know, has some 4 questions, and you're wanting to talk to me, I'd 5 always make myself available for that, but I think 6 some of that may need changed eventually. 7 As it applies to this specific tower, I -- 8 I believe that I could apply for a variance request 9 and be able to make this -- make a case strong 10 enough to get a variance and do that. 11 What I'd like to put up is a 150-foot tall 12 monopole, which is basically a cylindrical pole. 13 The way the zoning ordinance is currently written, 14 and I got this -- you guys, if I get off here, help 15 me. Because I'm over 2,000 feet from a lettered 16 highway, the only thing you can build is an 80-foot 17 tall stealth pole like a flagpole. 18 I can tell you from a technological 19 standpoint, there's a problem with those flagpoles. 20 Currently I have a contract with AT&T, and I'm going 21 through the City of St. Louis and jerking down every 22 one of them. They're all coming down, and we're 23 putting bigger ones up, what we call a drop and 24 swap. You pull one down and put a bigger one up. 25 If you've ever -- I just didn't want it --

51 51 1 if you drive in Highway 100 into Ellisville, just 2 before you get to Clarkson Road, look to your left, 3 and you'll see two cell towers standing next to each 4 other, but you better hurry up because one of them's 5 coming down by the end of this week because the new 6 one's up. 7 Typically the original cannisters on the 8 top of a cell tower is with the flagpole. I'm 9 assuming everybody knows what I'm talking about, but 10 a flagpole has a tower. They ran 18 inches in 11 diameter, and you can't get the antennas they need 12 inside of those. So the ones that they're running 13 now basically -- well, if you really want to see 14 one, drive in there and you'll see one. It looked 15 like a 55-gallon barrel. That's how big around it 16 is. 17 To be honest with you, the carriers don't 18 like them for a couple of different reasons. The 19 biggest reason is it doesn't carry the technology 20 that they need. The other thing that I can tell you 21 is when you build those kinds of towers, you get one 22 carrier on it and you're done. There's just not 23 enough capacity to one of them to get more than one. 24 And to be honest with you, where I'm at 25 right there, I really need to be 150 foot for what

FRANKLIN COUNTY PLANNING AND ZONING 2 FRANKLIN COUNTY COMMISSION 3 FRANKLIN COUNTY GOVERNMENT CENTER 4 SECOND FLOOR COMMISSION CHAMBERS 5 400

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