Gregory: Now, Mr. Williams, let s start out please with where and when you were born and where you grew up.

Transcription

1 Interviewee: Williams, Earl and Lois Interviewer: David Gregory Date of interview: October 15, 2005 Category: World War II Status: Open Tape location: Box #51 Now, Mr. Williams, let s start out please with where and when you were born and where you grew up. I am originally from Graceville, Florida. That s a little town about twentyfive miles from here, not too far from the Alabama line. I was born and raised in Graceville. I graduated from high school there in May of I lived in Graceville until I graduated, and then is when I joined the Navy. Actually I joined the Navy during the time I was in high school, but I was not sworn in until after graduation. There were several of us that joined some type of service. But me and several others, we decided that we would rather ride than walk, so we picked the Navy. The Navy allowed us to join the service, but we were not sworn in until after graduation. Was there any training during that period, before you were sworn in? No. There was no training or anything. What that did, that automatically took us out of the draft. [Laughter]. You were how old then when you a Seventeen. Now, where were you on Pearl Harbor day? On Pearl Harbor day I was at one of our neighbor s house shooting basketball when I heard the news. Well, you was all kind of infuriated and you wanted to kill everybody, you know. We went on to the end of school and then went on in. We knew at that time that sooner or later we would be in one of the branches of the service, so things didn t progress to the point that the draft called because I was too young at the time, anyway. During my senior year, we knew that we were going to have to be in the Army or the Navy. So we decided that we d join the Navy. There was several of us in our class that. I had a brother that was in the Army, an older brother that was in the Army, and at the time that we were talking about joining the service and everything, he was in the Battle of the Bulge. He had had an injury. We didn t know to what extent or anything. Whenever I talked to my daddy, asking him would he he had to sign the papers for me to join at seventeen. So whenever I was talking to him, he didn t want to sign the papers, you know, due to the fact that my older brother was in the Army (1764_Williams)1

2 and in Germany at that time and they had just found out he had had a wound. But whenever I told daddy that I said, Well, if you don t want to sign the papers, then I m gonna be drafted and I m gonna be probably put in the Army and not what I want to do. So he reluctantly agreed to sign. So that s when after graduation then we did go into the Navy. You and your buddies? Me and my buddies, yeah. So where d they send you? Out of the bunch that was in the Navy, I was the only one that was sent to Camp Perry, Virginia, and that was an old Seabees training camp that was run-down and old barracks and poor facilities and just about everything. The others, some of them went to Great Lakes and different places, but sent me to Camp Perry. That was a camp just outside of Richmond, Virginia. An old run-down place it was. What was it like? What were you doing there? Well, for the time that we were going through boot training, it was marching, learning to follow orders, exercise, the gas chamber, the rifle range, and more marching and everything. I remember the second day after we got there (and I was the only one out of my group that was sent to Camp Perry), the second day that we got there, I don t know how many shots they gave us. It was a shot for everything in this world. The next day, as I heard a fellow say one time when he was asked, How ya feeling? He replied, he said, Well, what don t hurt, don t work. So I felt the same way what didn t hurt didn t work very well. And of all the strenuous exercise and everything we had that day. But I was in good shape, good physical condition. I had been playing football and basketball and baseball there in Graceville. My dad had a little small farm and I was quite often sent up to the farm to saw wood with a cross-cut saw for the stove and for the fireplace and help with peanuts and any kind of farm work. So I really was in good shape. I remember one of the times after we first got there, we had to run an obstacle course. As I say, I was in good shape. I ran the obstacle course and finished. I was one of the very first finishers, and the instructor that was watching us, he saw that. He said, Well, do it again. So I ran it two time and most of them didn t do it but one time. But I was pretty strong for my age, too, and as I say, I was in good shape, good physical condition. But they stressed being in good physical condition and all such as that. The different things they put us through, the rifle range and going into the gas chamber, you know, and turning the gas on and then having to put your mask on. Tear gas was the only thing they used then, but it was terrible [chuckles]. Now, who was your best pal when you were in boot camp? Did you meet some guys that you kind of buddied up with? (1764_Williams)2

3 Not really. You didn t really have time, because you couldn t go anywhere. Every two weeks was payday they gave you three dollars a two dollar bill and a one dollar bill. I still have the first two dollar bill that they gave me. I figured, well, I ll never spend it anyway, so I m going to get each one of the guys in the company to endorse it, to sign it. Which I did, and as I say, I still have it. But there was really no place you could go to spend the money, but you had three dollars every two weeks. I think boot camp lasted, if I m not mistaken, it lasted about three months. You really never got to be real close with anybody because of the activity, and there s nothing you could do. You couldn t really get close to anybody because there was so many different things you had to do and all. For a little recreation, one of the things we could do was we could go to the gymnasium. They had a boxing ring there, and they had weights. So I would work out with weights to my own satisfaction. I remember one little incident. We were coming from the lunch hall and one of the guys had brought an apple with him. He threw it, and it hit me. So I picked up what was left and I went and threw it back at him, and I cracked him on the head with it pretty good. He said, Well, I ll meet you at the gym. We ll have it out there. So that night we were headed out to the gym. We crawled in the ring. It was just going to be a regular fight, and we were about the same size, but as I say, I was in a lot better shape than he was. The first thing I did, I grabbed him and fell down and threw him on his back and almost knocked the wind out of him and got up and that was it. So I never had any more problems. [Chuckles] But, we got through boots without any problem. We had a good instructor. When did you finish up there? Do you remember? About when would that have been? Some time in 44? Yeah. We got out of boots and it must have been about July or August. I don t really remember. After we finished boots, then I got about a two weeks leave. So you got to come home? Got to come home. The good part about that was that, you know, a service man could get on the train and ride it any where in the United States and didn t cost a thing. They took us to Richmond, and I boarded the train there, the Silver Meteor, I guess it was, and went to Jacksonville then caught the bus in Jacksonville home. After I went back, I reported back for duty then, we didn t know it, but that s when the fun was going to start. It was cold. It was cold when we got back. In the barracks, some of them, they were very air conditioned. They had holes in the floors and in the walls, and they had an old pot-belly heater. And for fire we tore up some flooring and the side of the walls and built a fire in the heater. We didn t stay back very long because after we got back, they got us all together one day and told us what our assignments was going to be. The fella says, Well, most of you men are going to be sent to the amphibious corps down in Fort Pierce, Florida, where the amphibious training was going on. And he says, The bad part about that is that guys in the amphibious corps, when they re in action you got about thirteen seconds to live. And I thought to myself, That don t sound like very much fun. But he says, We re going to post a list. It ll be out on a bulletin board the next (1764_Williams)3

4 morning of everybody s going there and the other s will be sent to Treasure Island in San Francisco. The next morning I looked at, you know, my name was on the I was going to California. I guess it was a day or two after that, that they loaded us on a local, and I mean local, troop train. It was cattle cars is what it was. It was an old coal burning engine, and it took us seven days to go from Richmond to Oakland, California. We stopped at every side track for everything and every kind of train to come through. We had no priority. They had built bunks about three or four high in each car, and there was only slats. There was not a solid wall in those cars. Needless to say, a coal burning engine like that, you had cinders and that bed would be full of cinders. It was not under the most livable conditions, but they said, Well, we re getting paid for this anyway, so. Fifty dollars a month! Wow, big money! What d they feed you on the train? They had a dining car. I don t remember too much about that, whether they passed out lunches or what. There probably was maybe 200 or 300 or 400 I don t remember how many there was in the car, and I don t remember the heating condition at this point. But I do remember after we got out into South Dakota and places with snow, we d have to pull off on the side, on a side track, for trains to pass, and every place that we pulled off along the way there, there was plains just as far as you could see. Nothing but snow. And of course, every time the train stopped and we got out, they had snow fights. So when we got up into the mountains in California, the engine that was pulling us couldn t pull us up that high grade, so they had to back off, switch another engine get us over the mountain, and then hook back up to the other engine, carry us on. We got into Oakland, I think, one night, and then went out to Treasure Island, California. That was between Oakland and San Francisco. It s almost like a little island there. We stayed there and what happened there is that that was kind of a debarkation point. Days or weeks, I don t remember too much about how long, but whenever they would get a formal crew or personnel for a type of ship or something, they d put them in what we call the bullpen. In other words, they d get all the crew in there, and that s where they d stay until they were shipped out to that particular ship or station wherever they were going. The first thing that I was assigned to, they got a crew together, it was a destroyer, and the name of it was the USS Loftberg. So we get this crew together, they re probably maybe fifty of us in the bullpen there. We sleep together, we stay together, you know. We were getting just about ready to be sent down to San Diego, where the ship was to be commissioned and all, and they came in and they told us, said, Scratch that assignment. Whenever they commissioned it, whenever it went down the side there, the runway, it never stopped. It went on down under. [Chuckles]. So scratch the USS Loftberg. So there was another wait, maybe a week or two, and next thing we know we re sent to this bullpen. We were told we were going to be assigned to a light cruiser, USS Nashville. It had been out in the South Pacific in a battle and had been hit with a kamikaze. Somewhere between 200 and 300 people had been killed and wounded and all such as this, so we were going to replace the crew that was either dead or transferred off. The ship was up in Bremerton, Washington. That s where they sent us, up to Bremerton. We were in dry dock there for a little while. After we got on board, we were assigned to a certain division, and I was assigned to the 7th Division, which is an anti-aircraft division. Our job after we got on board there they had (1764_Williams)4

5 welders all over the ship there. They had three shifts, three eight-hour shifts, and welders around the clock. They gave us a fire extinguisher and said, You stay with this welder, and while he s welding, if anything catches on fire, I d put it out. I remember the welder that I had several times we tried to get the same one, you know, when they d come back but the one I had numerous times maybe after we d been on liberty, you know, we might have a night from four to twelve, or twelve to four, something like, any whatever shift they had. The welder that I had, he was a very generous person. And as, you know, service people gonna have a good time, I don t care where they are. And sometimes when we d come back, you know, maybe some of us had too good a time, but I remember my welder said, he said, Go ahead and lie down in that bunk. If anything happens, I ll wake you up. [Laughter] They finished the ship and made all repairs and everything. So after that we went on a trial run up the coast of Alaska a couple of times, and after everything checked out and all, then we loaded supplies and everything and headed back, headed down to the South Pacific. This was in the later part of We stayed out in the South Pacific, underway, just moving around. I know at one time we went into the Philippines, at the Manila harbor. You couldn t go very close to the harbor due to the fact that there were so many sunken vessels and the thing was not clear. But they had a landing craft that would come out to our ship and get us and take us into Manila and give us liberty for three or four hours. The first time that I went on liberty there, I said, Boy, I m headed for the ice cream shop. By then I had some good friends that we all stayed together. So this buddy of mine, we were there and walking along the streets there in Manila, and off in the distance you could still hear the fighting going on. There were guns and explosions. But we see this Red Cross shop. It said, Ice cream and cake, so that s where we headed. We went in there and got a little dip of ice cream, just about not even a scoop full and just a little slice of cake. We told them, Thank you, and they told us, And that ll be $5. So we gave them $5. I can still taste that ice cream and cake and that $5 now. After that we went back to the ship and we left port and several times we would go into Subic Bay. There was nothing there, but just it was just a stopping point. There was a beach, but they d give us liberty to go on shore for the afternoon. You d get your two bottles of green beer and tell you, Have a good time and don t be late getting back. [Chuckles] But several times we stopped in Subic Bay. We stayed out on patrol. I know one time we was on patrol about three months, and we were running low on supplies, and actually got low on supplies for breakfast. Whenever they d serve us toast, I noticed that they d serve it just about black burned, real bad. I asked one of the cooks, I says, Why do we get burnt toast. He says, You can t find the weevils in it. Weevils would get in the bread and everything. He says, That s a good source of protein, you know. I ve been asked, Did you have any action then? There was plenty of action, because there was submarines and there was mines in the water. I don t know how many times that we d have a submarine alert and we d drop depth charges. I remember one time I was on a duty on the side of a ship, and we had a thing on board ship they called a paravane. It was kind of a -v shaped thing that d extend out from the ship that was under the bow, attached to the bow of the ship, that extended out in the water. As you went along, if there was any mines that was underwater, well this paravane would cut the rope or the cable; the mine would pop to the top then. After we d passed it, then we d turn around and either the 20 millimeter or probably the 20 millimeter is what they used then they d explode the mine. But you always had that and (1764_Williams)5

6 submarines to think about. I remember one time I was on duty and I was just kind of leaning on the rope, kinda like this, looking down and all of a sudden there was the main deck to the water line of the ship was about twenty feet, but there was a humongous mine with tentacles, and it almost hit the ship, but it didn t. But that thing, if it had hit the ship and then went and exploded, it would have been a tremendous thing because that was a big thing. Anyway, the proper people was alerted about it and after we had got by without any incident there, one of the guns exploded it. We had a division of Marines on board on our ship, too. Our complement for the ship was a little over 1,100 people. Our ship was a little over 600 feet long, a little over two football fields long, which is a pretty good. As I say, I was in the 7th Division, which was an antiaircraft division, and also my job at one time another fella in the division and myself was put in charge of the incinerator. The incinerator was located on the 01 level, which is one deck above the main deck, out in the hot sun. The main job was really burning trash, but confidential information, such as that. While we were doing that, the officer on the ship would stand there and watch and poke around in there and see that everything was burned. That look familiar? That s the Nashville. That s the Nashville. Our armament consisted of five turrets. I think they were 6-inch guns, and then we had a smaller gun that was a little over 5-inch gun. And then we had the quad mounts of forty millimeters, and then we had mounts of twenty millimeters. Now you were on a gun crew? I was not on the gun crew. I was supplying ammunition. I worked in the magazine locker. The forty millimeters they used there was a full clip and on those quad mounts, when you got the four things on, you can t get ammunition to them fast enough because they re but as I say, there was another fella helping me, but we kept the magazine locker there, they kept them in tin cases, or metal cases. You just take the lid off and take the cases out and I had them laid on the floor, and somebody else would come and put them in the guns there. Every once and a while we d do some target practice with the bigger guns, with the 5-inch never fired those 6-inch guns much because there was too much concussion. Particularly if they was any aircraft. For firing at aircraft, they used the 40 millimeters, even though a six-inch was too it was too big. I remember one time as an exercise we had a plane torque up we had several planes that was on board the cruiser. Sea planes? Sea planes. That was an interesting thing. I never seen anything didn t know how in the world they d put the sea plane on this catapult and it was fired by one of the shells one of the powders that they used on the big guns. That was a 6-inch that they used. Of course, the pilot had the engine revved up, and then by the time that thing fired and shot him off one time we lost one of the planes; it didn t make it. But I got thinking now I had not seen (1764_Williams)6

7 it, I didn t know after we d shoot the plane, after it s launched, he ain t going to come back and land on that catapult. How we going to get it on board? Well, the way that s done is after your plane is launched and everything, the ship will make a round circle in the water, and by doing that it calms the water in that circle. The plane comes in and lands and taxis up then to the fantail of the ship. There s a landing net that s attached to this hoist, and the plane taxis up onto that landing net, and then a cable comes down off the end of this and attaches to the plane, picks it up, turns it around, and sets it back on the catapult. What s a landing net look like? It was a just wide net, a mesh type net, that trailed behind the ship. And the water was calm behind the ship there, and where the cable the net was long enough that the plane could taxi up on it. The cable could attach to the plane, pick it up and turn it around and set it back on the catapult. So that landing net, I will get to it later it served another purpose. I suppose the last really action that we saw was when we and the Japs were on the island of Borneo, and they had a few planes there and they were personnel, and you know, they were a pain-in-the-neck there. So this big armada of ships one day we just went up and down the coast along there where they were, bombarded them with big guns, little guns. Our planes did not take part in that because the planes were used more or less for observation than anything else. But during the process of that operation, we were firing onto the island. They had some planes in the air, and of course, there was one or two carriers that also had planes. The scary thing that really excited me during that time was I was passing out that forty millimeter ammunition, and they were firing at the Jap planes and everything. All of a sudden, over the PA system they announced that there s a kamikaze plane heading our way on the port side at about sea level. And I could see the plane it was far enough off, I could see it coming towards us. And I was frozen. You know, there I was with all that ammunition, and the ammunition that we were using was really high explosives; that forty millimeter shell was called HEIT, which meant High Explosive Incendiary Tracer. So they were very sensitive. You didn t want to drop one on the deck even. But as that plane got closer, you know, the guy that was helping me with the ammunition, he went berserk. He just froze and yelling and whatever. About that time when it was really getting closer, one of our fighter planes, they called it a black widow, happened to sneak up behind him, and one burst from his gun hit the plane and it just exploded. Well, it was way too close then! But I never forgot that. If it hadn t been for that, I don t know well, who knows where it would ve hit, but it surely would ve hit somewhere on the ship. It was not very pleasant. That was one of my most memorable things that it s still in my mind, you know. After that happened, later on that afternoon everything quieted down. They quit bombarding and everything. Captain, or whoever the information officer, gets on the PA system and says, There will be no more firing or anything. Says, We have run the Japs inland. He says, Now the cannibals will take care of the rest of it for us. [Chuckles] Well, the next day we were still in the area, and the ship comes up and it anchors just off the island there. Here comes a landing craft boat, up. Says, Men, we re going to give you liberty on the island there for a few hours. So once again you get your two bottles of green beer and tell you to go and enjoy yourself on the island, but says, Do not go inland. Stay on the (1764_Williams)7

8 beach. Which we did, and then we came back to the ship. And it was enjoyable being able to leave. You know, you re so young back then you see, I was only eighteen then. And you re so young and everything and carefree back then, you don t really give a hoot, not too much. One thing I didn t mention earlier before I came on board, my ship was a flag ship for MacArthur, and he stayed on board our ship until he made that infamous journey from the ship to shore on the Philippines when he made the statement, I have returned, you know. And all the pictures maybe this ought not to be for publication. All the pictures show him coming ashore. They don t show pictures after he gets ashore and walking up. They had Marines they had a line formed, Marines on both sides. And he was walking ashore. Somebody would have killed him. He was not a very well liked man. For instance, I was told he left the ship before I came on board but I was told that while he was on board, he did not want any guns going off because it disturbed him. True or not, I don t know. But they said he didn t like the guns, big guns in particular, to be fired because they disturbed him. End side A too much longer after that we were patrolling and the captain gets on the PA system and tells about the atomic bomb that was dropped on Hiroshima and also the one that was dropped on Nagasaki. And he says that the Japanese have surrendered unconditionally. So the captain calls the division of Marines to bring their arms and line the ship, and he ordered the ship to be stopped. Every one of the Marines were there with their rifles, they re lining the entire ship. The Captain says, you know, whatever, Gentlemen, he says, The war is over. Japan has surrendered unconditionally. Let s go for a swim. [Chuckles] Well, guess where we were? We were in the Marianna Trench. Are you familiar with any? The water at that point was the color of this bag here. Black. Fifteen thousand feet deep. It s the deepest part of the ocean. So he orders those landing nets to be thrown over the side there, attached and thrown over the side. When he tells us, You know you can jump in the water and have fun, whatever. You had to have some way to get back on board ship, so you climb up the nets. Well, so there we had the chance to go swimming, 15,000 feet deep. And as you might be aware, the Navy at the point was not coeducational. The Navy also did not furnish you with swimming suits. So if you jumped into the water, you was either in your birthday suit or your shorts. If you was in your birthday suit, you had to be careful how you entered the water, you know, you keep your legs together [chuckles] and how you jumped in. But anyway, I ll never forget that. I says, I wasn t particularly fond about I says, I jump in, I ll hit bottom, I was sure. But anyway, I jumped in, and I was coming up, I think, before I ever hit the water. I jumped in a couple of times, swimming around there. What an exercise that was. So we all had a good swim. It wasn t (1764_Williams)8

9 too long after that that we were still out patrolling around Okinawa, and the captain gets on the PA system and announces that there s bad weather ahead, that there s a typhoon, and that there s no way that we can outrun it or get out of its way. That we will be experiencing some bad weather. The thing stretched for about 1,000 miles. That night was when it hit our ship, headed directly into that typhoon. I had to stand a watch for two hours up in the wheelhouse, and everything was watertight. All the hatches and everything was closed. So I had to make my way through the almost like tunnels going up to the wheelhouse. They would only let the watch be for two hours because it was so rough. Whenever I got up to the wheelhouse, my two hours there, the spotlight on the ship was turned on and had it focused on the bow of the ship. We were only doing like five knots an hour, but if we had ever gotten into that trough, the waves they said were over fifty feet high, and the wind was like over 200 miles an hour. I would notice when the bow of the ship, it almost like a submarine, went down and bring up a wall of water, and the wind was so strong that it would blow that wall of water over the fantail of the ship. I thought to myself, you know, after my watch was over and I was making my way back down to my division I was feeling the bulkhead, you know. And I could feel it, you know, as it was giving, and I said, Lord, you know, I ll never see Graceville again. [chuckles] But we made it through the night, and the next morning, you wouldn t believe it. The next morning the storm had passed, and they started opening up the hatches, and people started coming up on main deck and everything. And David, as far as you could see the water was just as smooth as this table. There was not a ripple in it anywhere. But one of our sister ships, the USS Pittsburgh, the storm broke the bow off of that ship. It didn t sink, but I don t know how many people there was destroyers, destroyer escorts, landing craft, that was sunk during that storm. You couldn t get out of the way of it. You didn t have enough time. And the other ships were washed up, like 200 yards, up there at Okinawa. Anyway, after that was over with, they announced that we were going to be a part of what they called the Magic Carpet fleet. They were going to use us then to bring troops from the CBI Theater China-Burma-India Theater. We would pick up a load of troops, we d bring them to Hawaii, unload them there, and then come back and get another load. So, we did that. The first load that we carried to Hawaii they also cut the crew down to just a skeleton crew, which I was part of the skeleton crew there. So we went back and got another load of troops and brought them back to Hawaii, and they announced then that we would not be going after any more troops, that we were being sent around to the ship yard in Philadelphia to be decommissioned. So we went in to San Diego before we left then to go back down through the Panama Canal and up into the Atlantic to Philadelphia. This was the first time that our ship had seen an American port since the war ended, and I figured, Well, man, there ll be bands and everything playing. You know what, I think there was couple of women to see their husbands that was on ship and that was it. No fanfare, no nothing. Not that I really expected anything, but I thought maybe we might see a little something. When we left there we took on some supplies, and then we went on down through the Panama Canal up into Philadelphia. I stayed on board then until the ship was decommissioned. At the time that I was on board, I was the only one on there that knew how to assemble or disassemble those twenty millimeter guns because I had a little bit experience in working with them. So I had to show the people, you know, how to disassemble them and everything. Then after that, then I left and went down to Jacksonville where I was discharged. (1764_Williams)9

10 When would that have been? When were you discharged? I was discharged in June of Also, there was no question about my being discharged because we had all gone into the US Naval Reserves and not in a regular Navy. But one of the guys that was in my division during boot camp and during Treasure Island and during the Nashville stay, I m still in touch with him, and we talk once or twice a month. He s the only one. All of the other guys that I don t know what happened to them, and some of the other guys that I was friendly with, or that palled around with, they ve since died. So, the Nashville doesn t have reunions? Yes. They ve been having reunions, and I did not know anything about them until [to Lois Williams] two years ago? I think it was two years. It was two years ago we had a reunion in Nashville. So Mama and I and Lynn. and my daughter here in town and my son that lives over in Tallahassee, they went with me to the reunion. I saw some people then I did not know, but the ship was commissioned in 1938, so there was a few people there that had served on board and served elsewhere and all. So the Nashville reunions, they involved everybody that served on board the ship. The one they had this past May in Kentucky, in Cincinnati, Kentucky had it there. But anyway, we went to the one in Nashville, and I was really I was really, really that just got me. When we got there the first night, the business people, the Better Business Bureau and everything, they had I don t know how many people were there that expressed their pleasure and just all kinds of kudos. It just, you know, it just, it got me. For representing their city and everything, it was very touching. And my good friend was there too, so we spent a lot of time together. There in the city of Nashville they have a museum that s strictly the USS Nashville, so we went through there. There is not very many people left, and I m not sure whether they re going to have another reunion or not. They had talked about the next one and the last one, is because there s so few people now that s attending. They talked about having the next one in Washington, to be able to visit the World War II museum there in the Mall, so I don t know, I hadn t heard anything lately. Sure. Let s go back, let s go back to correspondence. Were you writing to anyone when you were in the service? My parents, just about all. (1764_Williams)10

11 letter? What did you tell them? What would you say to them when you wrote them a Well, there wasn t very much you could tell them, you know. I ll tell you a little story I heard about this fella that had been in the service, you know, when he was overseas. And he wrote home and told his mother how homesick he was for her home cooking and for his own bed, but most of all he missed the little pot under the bed. She wrote back and told him, says, well, she was glad to know that he was homesick and that he missed her cooking and everything, but don t think anything about the little pot because he missed it while he was home [laughter]. So really, there wasn t much you could say. I had devised a method that I could tell them where I was by names of couples. You know, I d say, well, I got a letter from Mary and John, and I also heard from Frank and Jim. You know, and you get those so, and where those things crossed, you know, well, that s where I is. But other than that, they monitored every letter that went out, so needless to say, I didn t do an awful lot of writing, but there s not very much corresponding that went on. Some of the guys had good luck charms, rabbits foots and things. Did you carry anything like that? No. No, I didn t. I wasn t very committed at that point, but I knew the Lord answered our prayers and would take care of us, so just that and dumb luck and ignorance got us through. When you were on board ship, what were your quarters like? Did you share a bunk, or did you have one all to yourself? Well, they would have a big room like this, or the room was not much bigger. But they had bunks about three high all down the walls, and they d have them then in the middle in the room, so you could get around and everything. I didn t mention this right after the war as I told you before, our ship was a flag ship from MacArthur, and after the war was over they said the unconditional surrender would take place in the Tokyo Bay. Well, our captain and the crew and all thought, Hey, MacArthur s going to call us, and we re going to go back and we re going to see that being done and everything. Well, one thing that we were not aware of, and we started writing some correspondence, you know, to see that well, what we were not aware of that Truman was President, and the USS Missouri, the battlewagon, had been in the service just a short time. So with Truman being President, guess who went to Tokyo Bay? The USS Missouri. So to get us out of the way so that we would not be causing any problems, what d they do? They sent us into Shanghai, China, and we stayed there three months, right after the war. For whatever reason, I know not. What were you doing there? Nothing. We d go on liberty, whatever. We just stayed anchored in the (1764_Williams)11

12 Wangpu River, just off of the jetties there in Shanghai for three months, and then after that is when they put us in what they called the Magic Carpet fleet, bringing troops back from the theater there back to the US. We were very disappointed that we were not given that opportunity to be part of the ceremony. What was it like coming back home to your folks and your family and real world? You d been gone for a couple of years, hadn t you? Yeah. What was it like? I really couldn t say. I felt nothing different. As I say, you know, by then I was still eighteen years old, and you know, I still didn t have enough sense to know what was going on. Nothing really. I had no psychological problems or anything like that. I knew that after I got home, I knew that I would be entitled to the GI Bill, and that I would probably utilize it and go to school, but other than that things were just about the same as like when I left. Now you went off to college? At that point, I had applied under the GI Bill to go to University of Florida, and I was accepted, and one of the fellas that was in another branch of the service that was good friend of mine had also applied, so we were both accepted. So we went down to the University of Florida, and it was such a big influx of veterans that was using the GI Bill some of them down there called it the hog barn they had some bunks in there, but it was away from the campus, and it was not under ideal conditions. We spent the first night there. Early the next morning, somebody announced that due to the overcrowding and everything that they had opened up the Tallahassee they called it the Tallahassee Branch, University of Florida at Dale Mabry Field in Tallahassee. And they said that anybody that wanted to transfer was welcome to do so. Well, that fella got trampled. He got run over, because there was a bunch of folks that left, and I was one of them. So we came back to Tallahassee and checked in there and was assigned one of the barracks there. So the first year that we were there, we were known as the Tallahassee Branch, the University of Florida. And Florida State College For Women was not coeducational, and the University of Florida was not coeducational. All right. So in the spring of year, the legislature created Florida State University as a coeducational institution and the University of Florida, so we were known then beginning in the fall of 47 as Florida State University, and coeducational. And of course, Florida then was coeducational. Well, the first year, while we were there we got a basketball team organized. I was on the first team there, and we were known as the Tallahassee Branch, University of Florida. As some of the fellas over there called it TBUF. And I guess to this day we were still that. The next year they had a new coach, and he kicked just about everybody off that team and brought in his own boys, but we played about fifteen or sixteen ball games. I remember we played the University of Tampa. We tried to get a game with the University of Florida, but they wouldn t play us. I think (1764_Williams)12

13 we played Stetson. We played some junior colleges. As I say, the University of Tampa. Florida Southern. We won some ball games. We had a good team. A couple of the guys in particular that was on that first team, and I don t know what happened to the other guys, but one of the guys was Jim Pavy, he was on the team the following year, the first team that FSU had. As a matter of fact, he scored the first two points. Well, he died about three months ago. And then the other fella that I knew that was a good friend is Billy Parker, who has been a real donor and a beneficiary to the university. He made a pile of money, and he s given a bunch of it, but he s still living down in Clearwater, I believe it is. But you were on the first team? I was on the first team, yeah. women? Very good. Well, what was it like, being one of few men on a campus full of It was terrible. [Laughter] It was terrible. [Laughter] Yeah. David, I believe, there was about roughly 500 men that was there that first year, and I think they said there was about 3,500 women. The legislature had whenever they did that my understanding is that they said, We want to experiment with this. You know, if this works out well for FSCW and, also, for the University of Florida there, says, We ll make it a coeducational university. Well, needless to say, it was a tremendous success because there were no problems. Lot of the instructors there at FSCW had never had men in their class. Not only men but seasoned veterans. A funny thing happened. I don t remember what class it was, but there was a number of us veterans in this class along with some of the girls that came out to the West Campus. We found out that the lady that was teaching our class (she d never had men in her class before that), we found out when her birthday was, and so we decided, said, Hey, we re going to take her out to dinner. And so the day of her birthday, we informed her, we said, The men here in this class are going to take you out to dinner tonight. We ll be over at your house at such-and-such a time and pick you up and take you out to dinner. Well, she was just overcome. [Laughter] She didn t have a husband, either. There was about, maybe about ten to fifteen of us in the class there. So we all went to her apartment, and she came out and we paid the ten cents for her to ride the bus up to a restaurant there in Tallahassee, uptown. Then we escorted her back home. And I m telling you, I don t think there was a one of us that made less than a B, and some of the girls almost flunked. [Chuckles] Now, what was her name? Do you remember? I don t remember her name. (1764_Williams)13

14 What d she teach? I think it was history. I m just not sure, but anyway, we d have to write some essays and stories, and you know, but we could doll them up, all kind of gory details and that, and she ate it up. We had a lot of fun then. As I say, there was no complaints, and there were no problems when it came up before the legislature. But you know, if we hadn t conducted ourselves in a more civil manner and everything and all, I m not sure, they probably would ve gone ahead and made it coed. But anyway, the university made money on it because the school, under the GI Bill, the government paid them x-number of dollars for each student. They were encouraging more and more students, you know, to get involved and everything. Of course, then the following year, in school year, they had the first football team. Of course, about 1950, when we really started a little bit more serious about football, trying to get a game with the Gators, they finally had to go to the legislature. And the legislature called the two presidents, got them together and says, You all work out a schedule, or else we ll work it out for you, you know. You know, so they did. And Florida agreed to play. They said, The only way we ll agree to play them is for eight straight years you ll play in Gainesville, and we ll pay you something like $25,000 a ball game, for eight years. In the meantime, the Gators were making a fistful of money over it because they were filling the stadium. That s where hating the Gators comes in. Now when did you graduate from Florida State? Well, I had a bad year, and it was in 51 before I graduated. But I guess that was the way it was supposed to be, because that s when I met Lois, in 50, and that s when we decided to get married. So we were married right after both of us graduated from FSU. Come June of next year we will be celebrating our 55 th wedding anniversary. Well, that s great, that s great. Congratulations. Well, let me talk to you a little bit, Mrs. Williams. Are we all set, you think, for now, or if something pops into your mind, you ll tell me, won t you? Okay. Mrs. Williams, you had said you were a plane spotter? What was that like? My Girl Scout troop served as plane spotters on weekends. Frostproof was on a direct flight line from the east coast to Tampa - Dale Mabry Field. We reported the type of planes and direction of travel. Okay, this would have been about when? Forty-one. Forty-one, okay. (1764_Williams)14

15 And our Girl Scout troop, most of them they were looking for plane spotters and most of us volunteered, and spent every Saturday morning up on top of the bank building there in Frostproof, Florida, watching for planes and recording what kind of plane it was, whether it was single engine So they were training you. They gave you pictures of the images of the planes and you could identify them, could you? looking. Uh hum. Fairly well. There were usually two or three of us up there What was that like? Did you climb up on the roof? Uh hum. Just stand with did you have binoculars? probably we did. I don t remember having binoculars. I m sure we must have. I think Now, how long did you do that? All through the war? Through most of it. So you were living at home in the war. I was living at home with my parents. What was that like? We did pretty well. We were a family of six; I have three sisters. Even with the rationing, we had to watch out, but we were luckier than most people because with six of us in the family we were able to get enough sugar and the things the meat that was rationed. I found a few of the little red disks, red and blue disks, in that pitcher over there. [Chuckles] What were the disks? The red, I think, was for meat, and I don t remember what the other was. There were two different kinds. But you got so many per person in the family. Now was any one of your siblings in the war? (1764_Williams)15

16 I had a foster brother in the war. We had lived in Enterprise, Florida where the Children s Home, Methodist Children s Home, was, and he lived there. And my parents wanted to adopt him, and they wouldn t let them. But he was my foster brother, and he was killed in the battle of Java Straits. He was in the Navy. But I remember counting coupons, you know, for the meat and for sugar. Shoes? What about shoes? Shoes. Did you have enough shoes. Well, we managed. How about grease? Were you saving grease and things like that? Oh yeah. Saved baking grease. What did you do with it? Fry food in it. No, no, I mean, weren t they turning in things like they would have scraps drives and? Well, there were scrap drives, but I don t remember turning in I don t remember turning in grease. I was what, eleven, twelve, thirteen? Closing the blinds at night. Yeah, closing the blinds outside your Did you have black outs? Oh, yeah. We had to close the blinds and keep the lights down low. Yes. What was your daddy doing? My dad was principal of the school there. He was a teacher. My mother was a teacher. And I grew up to be a librarian, school librarian. [Laughter] What do you remember most about Frostproof during the war? (1764_Williams)16

17 Small; small community, really. It s grown a lot. We had a Girl Scout troop. And like I say, we were plane spotters on Saturday mornings when we were out of school. Were some of the other kids doing similar kinds of things then? Your Girl Scouts were spotters, were other kids doing anything? Well, we were always collecting newspapers and things like that, that they wanted you to collect. Soup labels, can labels. Yeah, cans probably, too, weren t you? And cans, yes. Flatten them and save them, right? Right. Yeah. Were you writing to anybody, to a serviceman or anything? Wrote to my foster brother occasionally. Mother and Dad did most of the corresponding. And I think somehow or other one of my other sisters ended up with a lot of his letters. Oh, great. Now personally, I remember V-J Day. What do you remember about the end of the war? Oh, I had an accident on bicycle that day, so it wasn t a very pleasant day. Did Frostproof celebrate? Did they have a parade or anything? I don t recall, I really don t. Anything else come to mind? Not too much. I remember I was honored to take care of a lot of the little disks, sugar and meat and things like that. I did a lot of going to the grocery store for my parents on my bicycle. I rode my bicycle to the grocery store. Mama give you a list and a disk. Uh huh, and I went, yeah. I took them down and the money actually, I think maybe we had a charge. A small town, you could charge it. (1764_Williams)17

18 or was it? Oh, sure, sure. And then you came off to what would then have been FSU, right, I was here the year it was made FSU 51. And you graduated from there when, then? Let s see. It was 47. Yeah. I think graduated in 51. We graduated the same time from two entirely different schools. And ended up, would you believe it, sitting together during graduation. Is that how you met? I was the beginning student in the alphabet in my school. He was the end of the alphabet in his school, so we sat together at graduation. We were engaged at the time. That s how you met. Well, he was dating one of my sorority sisters. Oh, is that right? And they had broken up. We started dating and just clicked. Well, do you remember about FSU when you were there? Favorite teachers? Most of them were in my school. I was in school of the Library Science, and most of them were in that school. And what sorority were you in? Zeta Tau Alpha. Anything else come to mind? got engaged, or Oh, I don t know. Being serenaded at the sorority house. When anybody So you were serenaded then, when you got engaged? restaurant. I was serenaded. And walking uptown to the picture show and the (1764_Williams)18

19 A lot of changes. Seen a lot of changes, yeah. I even walked home a number of times because I didn t live at the house there on campus a couple of years. And I lived way out. I could get the bus so far, but I had to walk a good little bit. Occasionally I d miss the bus and walk. Walked some more. A lot more. [Chuckles] Mr. Williams, any thoughts come to mind we need to finish up with? I was just looking over this brochure you have on the Nashville, and my dates and their dates, I don t remember. I question about some of that, but it may be authentic, but I would tend to think that it s more correct than maybe some of mine. But Tallahassee was a small town back then, and I was a charter member of the Pi Kappa Phi fraternity, and also Lois and I were charter members of the Saint Paul United Methodist Church whenever it organized there. That s where we got married. We have three children, we have nine grandchildren. All three of my children went to FSU. I told them they could go anywhere else in the world they wanted to go to school, but if they didn t got to FSU, they d pay their own way. So needless to say, they decided to go to FSU. Well, as a matter of fact, my oldest grandson now is working on his Ph.D. At the present time he is working with the Department of Energy out in Albuquerque in conjunction with his Ph.D., so he s computer science and math. He s very smart. But we are die-hard Seminoles. That s what I understood. You can put that and etch that in stone on my grave. Die-hard Seminole. We have season tickets to the football games. End (1764_Williams)19