Father Malachi Martin The Third Secret of Fatima

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1 Father Malachi Martin The Third Secret of Fatima Vatican Intrigue What will come? FAN-TASTIC FORUM Father Malachi Martin Kathleen Keating-true or false? (Page 1) profile register preferences faq search UBBFriend: This Page to Someone! This topic is 4 pages long: next newest topic next oldest topic Author Topic: Kathleen Keating-true or false? (1 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

2 Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 28 February :30 PM I was going over some of Kathleen Keatings Teachings and found them to be contradictory to Father Martins. Am I the only one? Here's a little bit of information I can use to start the conversation: This (as well as some of her other teachings) go against Catholic Doctorine. Purgatory is lower towards Hell. There s thirteen levels of Purgatory. The 13th level being the closest to Hell, therefore, giving a little more punishment, actually, a LOT more pun-ishment than the first or second or third levels of Purgatory. And this is because we need to be purified. Ummm, because we sin and Jesus died for our sins, our souls maintain like the nasty ring around the collar that you can t get out, and that s where you go for the last bleaching process. The Catholic Church considers Purgatory at most a state-not a place. I've heard Father Martin say the same. So jump in and refute me! signing off... Save Disneyland TomG Posts: 175 From:,TX, USA Registered: Oct 2000 posted 01 March :38 PM, I've never heard Fr Malachi state that Purgatory is a state and not a place. The only one I have heard this from is the Holy Father, pope John Paul II. This was not de fide teaching, I think it is just his opinion. In this matter, unless he makes a statement ex cathedra, it is just his opinion. In second Maccabees (2Mc12:38-46) we find that it is salutary to pray for the dead. Jesus told us we would be held accountable until we have paid the last penny. While we have had our sins forgiven us, when we've obtained absolution, this does not mean there is not a temporal penalty that must be paid. Everyone in Purgatory is in a state of Grace, satisfying the temporal penalty due to sin. Purgatory is not a "second chance" for a sinner to get to Heaven. I tend to believe that God's Love for us is such a consuming fire that we can not behold the Beatific Vision while we carry around the baggage of the penalty due our sins. That Love is what I think the fire of Purgatory is, burning away that which can't enter Heaven so that we will be as clean as the Grace that has been given to us, and been (2 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

3 obtained for us at such an incredible price. As far as levels in Purgatory, I don't have a clue to what she is talking about. As far as I am concerned, if I make it to Purgatory, it is a great thing. I don't care if I am the last one out, shutting the gate behind me. I still know that sooner or later I will be in God's presence. This is so much better than the alternative of eternity in Hell. So I don't know what KK is talking about, and really don't care. Whether there are levels or not is a non-issue to me, not making any difference to my Faith. She can believe whatever she likes. In any event, since we do need to pay this penalty, we have to pay it somewhere. Of course, if we are spirit, and existing outside space and time, I'm not sure what difference there is between a state and a place. Out side of space/time, what is a place? It is most likely a state, so this whole issue may be moot. [This message has been edited by TomG (edited 01 March 2001).] Mercury Posts: 359 From: NY, NY Registered: Dec 2000 posted 02 March :14 PM Fr. Martin when asked about Maitreya on Art's show about 1 yr before his death said "no, he's not the Anti-Christ"...Kathleen K., however, after Fr. Martin's death said that Maitreya IS the Anit-Christ. I've never heard Keating explain the differning views. Was Martin wrong or is she perhaps not sure. She announced this on both Coast and Jeff Rense's show. Would be interesting to have her answer this on Monday, when she's on Coast again. Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 03 March :49 AM quote: Originally posted by TomG:, I've never heard Fr Malachi state that Purgatory is a state and not a place. The only one I have heard this from is the Holy Father, pope John Paul II. This was not de fide teaching, I think it is just his opinion. In this matter, unless he makes a statement ex cathedra, it is just his opinion... [This message has been edited by TomG (edited 01 March 2001).] I've never heard Father state that teaching. I have heard him say he belives in the Church's teachings and this one goes back a long way :-P (3 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

4 Catechism of the Catholic Church (1995) 1031 The Church gives the name Purgatory to this final purification to the elect, which is entirely different from the punishment of the damned. Notice that purg. is refered to as the purification-not place of purification etc.. St. Aquinas: "Incorporeal things are not in place after a manner known and familiar to us, in which way we say that bodies are properly in place ; but they are in place after a manner befitting spiritual substances, a manner that cannot be fully manifest to us." [St. Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologiae, Supplement, Q69, a1, reply 1] The Pope said during a catecheses: Purgatory is not a place but a condition of existence... Purification must be complete, and indeed this is precisely what is meant by the Church's teaching on purgatory. The term does not indicate a place, but a condition of existence. Those who, after death, exist in a state of purification, are already in the love of Christ who removes from them the remnants of imperfection (cf. Ecumenical Council of Florence, Decretum pro Graecis: DS 1304; Ecumenical Council of Trent, Decretum de iustificatione: DS 1580; Decretum de purgatorio: DS 1820). EWTN on the Pope... signing off... Save Disneyland [This message has been edited by (edited 03 March 2001).] lutefisk Posts: 533 From: The misty, mossy, north Registered: Nov 2000 posted 03 March :53 AM The thing that really caused me to pity Kathleen Keating was the way she seemed to enjoy talking about the endless torture of people who didn't believe like she did. She spoke with relish about the suffering of the last days and what Hell would be like for those who didn't knuckle under. Such enjoyment in the suffering of others, really put her in the "scary" section of my book. (4 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

5 Poptart8 Posts: 835 From: Registered: Nov 2000 posted 03 March :03 PM Catholicism is an area that I'm not educated enough to recite. There does exist a level or condition in dimensional realities when discussing angels, angles and the devil. I'm inclined to accept the writings or teachings currently being discussed on this board as factual... neither is wrong in my opinion. TomG Posts: 175 From:,TX, USA Registered: Oct 2000 posted 03 March :15 PM, all that stuff up there is well and good. The teaching is that purification is taking place. Since it is taking place, it is taking place somewhere. Since we will be in spirit, it probably won't be a place as we understand it now. Your quotes seem to show Aquinas disagreeing with the Catechism The Coucil of Trent says that Purgatory isn't a place, but a condition of existence. You still need to be someplace during this existence, so it doesn't say that Purgatory doesn't take place someplace. As I said, it doesn't matter to me either way. Not believing in Purgatory would be a problem, picking through these deep issues gains me little. TomG Posts: 175 From:,TX, USA Registered: Oct 2000 posted 03 March :21 PM I'm pretty sure, on Art's show, or in her book, I don't remember, she indicated she saw this "anti-christ" in her backyard. I remember thinking, five billion people in the world and he went to her backyard, amazing. Of course, at that point she was careful to not say the name Matreya, I don't know why she was being so coy. (5 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

6 HurricaneJoan unregistered posted 03 March :31 PM My belief: There is no purgatory. That was a ploy of a corrupt Roman church to get people to pay MONEY to escape this made-up place. It was also used as political leverage, blackmail, in the Roman church. Jesus came to die for our sins because we wouldn't listen to His Father. Jesus said (in so many words), "Hey Dad, let me go down there and talk to them. Yeah...I know what they'll end up doing to me, but if I have to die to get the message across, I'll do it. It's just a physical death." The prophets of old envisioned the Son of Man having to do this, and related it in Old Testament scripture. If we accept His sacrifice, and ask Him to enter our lives, i.e., that we may apply His blood to the door mantle of our lives (as in the Jewish rites of smearing the blood of sacrificial lambs over the doorways at Passover so the "Angel of Death" would pass by the house), we are saved from our sins by GRACE, "not of works, lest any man should boast." Seems too easy, doesn't it? But that's how it is. Our souls are cleansed continually by Jesus' intercession to His Father. We hide behind HIS cloak of righteousness as we stand before the judgment throne, so to speak, at the end of time. At the time of death, we have our own transfiguration which is the final cleansing, then we enter before the Father washed clean by the blood. I think those who have accepted Jesus' sacrifice will go to "school" in Heaven, continually learning more and more. As for those who have never heard of Jesus, had no opportunity for this salvation, well, God will not hold them accountable but will deal with them some way. I don't know how... I've been both a Catholic and Protestant, and this is my theory, and what it is, too. Say no more. I'm here coz I love Art, that's all. :) Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 03 March :36 PM Didn't want to get into a picky fight over words here-sorry if that's what it looks like. I was trying to show that the Church believes and has always believed that Purg. is a state/not a place as part of a larger picture. That larger picture got lost and I'm going back to it. I really have some problems with Kathleen Keatings teachings. She seems so ultra- Pre-VII to the point of taking the old teachings (and myths) and is willing to continue to perpetuate the myths to make some money. quote:, all that stuff up there is well and good. The teaching is that purification is taking place. Since it is taking place, it is taking place somewhere. I agree and could start a full thread on this! I've heard a teaching that (6 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

7 this place (where purgatory lies) is heaven and the priest almost convinced me! signing off... Save Disneyland Mercury Posts: 359 From: NY, NY Registered: Dec 2000 posted 03 March :58 PM TOmG: "she was careful to not say the name Matreya," Tom, You're right, but in fact after discussing her "backyard visitor", she did say finally say it was indeed Maitreya during the May 14th Rense broadcast I believe...found at: maryals Posts: 1722 From: anchorage, Alaska, USA Registered: Sep 2000 posted 04 March :34 PM Excellent topic, and discussion! I had thought that Kathleen Keating was worth listening to, but, after reading some of these opinions, maybe I need to re-think. She will be a guest on C2C this week...mon/tue or is it Tue/Wed? Anyway, I'll listen more carefully. As for this "Maitreya" being, I was of the understanding that there were several, that this was a "title", and the "True Maitreya" had not yet "gone public". And perhaps this "True Maitreya" is the one we call Anti Christ. maryals Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 04 March :00 PM quote: Originally posted by maryals: Excellent topic, and discussion! I had thought that Kathleen Keating was worth listening to, but, after reading some of these opinions, maybe I need to re-think. She will be a guest on C2C this week...mon/tue or is it Tue/Wed? I think she's on Mon/Tues. I consider her one of those entertaining guests of Art's. I would never take anything she said very seriously but she entertains me like Ms. Paligia. (7 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

8 signing off... Save Disneyland Capt.Hornblower Posts: 74 From: Cold North Atlantic Registered: Oct 2000 posted 05 March :59 PM Maryals, et.al.: Hello to us all. One needs more than a dose of salt when dealing with KK on this subject. My knowledge of this Maitreya individual is limited, however, it is true that KK finally identified him as someone she described as the representative of the Evil One. Fr.Malachi never made this identification (as far as I know). One has to wonder about that. Also, I was not aware that Father was good friends with KK. I only learned that after his demise when she informed us of the relationship. Unfortunately, he is not here to clarify the nature of that relationship. Caution, lass... Hope all is well. Love and thanks, Pat Mercury Posts: 359 From: NY, NY Registered: Dec 2000 posted 05 March :00 PM quote: Maryals said: As for this "Maitreya" being, I was of the understanding that there were several, that this was a "title", and the "True Maitreya" had not yet "gone public". And perhaps this "True Maitreya" is the one we call Anti Christ Maryals, yes, it does get confusing as there are several. But there are two main contenders using the title Maitreya at the moment. One is some Iranian guy linving in the US, (mostly ignored) and the other, living in London and promoted by Benjamin Creme. It was Benjamin Creme's Maitreya K. Keating was talking about. He seems to be the one most people mean when they say "Maitreya". Even the NY Times did a story in the 1980's about one of his mysterious appearances. Also, B. Creme has a web site about him at This is the Maitreya guy and organization Art is not letting Keating name as Anti-Christ on the air tonight... The story is a bit spooky so who knows what's going on. [This message has been edited by Mercury (edited 06 March 2001).] (8 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

9 Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 06 March :11 AM quote: Originally posted by Capt.Hornblower: Maryals, et.al.: Hello to us all. Hi! quote: Fr.Malachi never made this identification (as far as I know). One has to wonder about that. Also, I was not aware that Father was good friends with KK. I only learned that after his demise when she informed us of the relationship. Unfortunately, he is not here to clarify the nature of that relationship. I didn't keep track of the Keating/Martin relationship either until he died. Does anyone else here know of any prior mention before his death? signing off... Save Disneyland lutefisk Posts: 533 From: The misty, mossy, north Registered: Nov 2000 posted 06 March :36 AM The more I listened to Kathleen last night on Art's show, the more I believed that she may have had only a passing aquaintance with Fr.Martin. Kathleen seems to be so full of hatred that I can't see her having the kind of relationship with Malachi that she claims she had.perhaps, though, she did and Malachi was trying to help her. I really don't understand her putting "medals" on her animals to protect them. I also absolutely don't understand a "God" who would torture people for eternity because they disagree with it and then say that it calls them in "Love"??? (9 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

10 Conspiracy Theorist Posts: 300 From: Reno, NV posted 06 March :17 AM As a kid in Catholic School in the 60's, and educated by priests, I never heard any reference to "13 levels of Purgatory." It was taught as an actual place, with fires similar to that of Hell, but without demonic presence, and a place where most of us would go for at least a brief time. Going by the principle, "In my father's kindoms are many mansions," it seems logical that, just as there are many levels of Heaven, there would be many levels of Hell or Purgatory. But, I've never heard these levels delineated. I took extreme offense, BTW, when Art asked her about her theory of "The Beast" being constructed, she identified it as a 500-foot Buddha being constructed in India. Give me a break! Rick Jackson connie martinez Posts: 72 From: st.augustine,florida.u.s.a Registered: Aug 2000 Poptart8 Posts: 835 From: Registered: Nov 2000 posted 06 March :33 AM How would she (KK) know all of this?..to be so sure?...purgatory is right here... on earth...only my stupid logic.. Regards,connie. posted 06 March :42 PM Attitudes have a way of coloring our preceptions... when addressing the merits of dimensional entites. The symbols locked or hidden sometimes has us believing in icons to protection. These were not the words of any of the masters who walked before us on earth. Make no judgements... take no icons... hold to your soul... love unconditionally as we are all cut from the same bolt. We must find common ground... build a stronger foundation to entry the 6th dimension. Those who ignore this will be lost in a type of pergatory. I pray for humanity and you must join me in this prayer. (10 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

11 mac Posts: 558 From: Registered: Oct 2000 posted 06 March :20 PM Keating strikes me as a "wanna be" and an opportunist. The depth of her comments and supposed, association with Fr. Martin, appear to have been surficial. Yea, so maybe they spoke on the telephone; or exchanged a few letters. Big deal. I feel that Tom's research is much more meaningful than Keating's rant. She seems to be lacking any substantive theory of her own; and merely "cherry picks" from others who have a following - and adds a bit of pop-culture and groundless paranoia. Ok, now for my own rant. Kind of annoyed that we would have to devote an entire thread to Keating. We could have had easily digressed into this discussion within the "Life and Times of Fr. Malachi Martin Thread. Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 06 March :32 PM Mac, I started this thread here under Father Martin because I was discussing points where MM and KK digressed. I try to look into the future and I could easily see this thread moving far away from the Life and Times of Father Martin. signing off... Save Disneyland Hilda Sophia Posts: 1334 From: Connecticut posted 07 March :38 AM My understanding is that levels in Purgatory are described in Dante's "The Divine Comedy". However, I'm not sure if that is the source you are looking for. (11 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

12 everaftergirl Posts: 2367 From: Southern California posted 07 March :03 AM I have addressed many of the issues spoken on this thread under C2C Topics, Kathleen Keating. I was raised Catholic, but became a Christian in At that time, I began studying the Bible, but I never read about purgatory. Then years later, I read "The Lost Books of the Bible and Forgotten Books of Eden". In these apocryphas I found much of what the Catholic Church teaches, however, they were not available to the public. In the "Forgotten Books..." in the "Secrets of Enoch"...Enoch was taken up for many days to be shown the mysteries of the heavens and write about them. Then he brought the books back to his sons on earth, prior to be "raptured", just as Elias was. He visited 10 levels of Heaven. He calls them the Heavens. On the fifth level, he saw the fallen angels that were being held there until the Great Judgement. Enoch says, "...there I saw many and countless soldiers, called Grigori, of human appearance, and their size was greater than that of great giants and their faces withered, and the silence of their mouths perpetual, and there was no service on the fifth heaven, and I said to the men (angels) with me: 'Wherefore are these very withered and their faces melancholy, and their mouths silent, and wherefore is there no service on this heaven?' And they said to me: These are the Grigori, who with their prince Satanail rejected the Lord of light, and after them are those who are held in great darkness on the second heaven, and three of them went down on to earth from the Lord's throne to the place Ermon, and broke through their vows on the shoulder of the hill Ermon and saw the daughters of men how good they are, and took to themselves wives, and befouled the earth with their deeds, who in all times of their age made lawlessness and mixing, and giants are born and marvellous big men and great enmity. And therefore God judged them and with great judgment, and they weep for their brethren and they will be punished on the Lord's great day." (About their mouths being silent and melencholy...aliens and hybrids communicate telepathically.) I believe these fallen angels are also the aliens who are hybriding with humans, and I believe that after the "rapture", as KK said, the alien kidnapping theory may be an explanation for the disappearance of Believers. Regarding the coming of Jesus, the Bible says (2Thessalonians 2:3) that "...it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed (ac)..." At some point, aliens may be announced as real, and with it an explanation that we are descendants of them (something like that), but this may cause a great "apostasy" among many, a falling away from the faith, but this is only speculation. Revelation says that their will be a great deception that will cause many to believe a lie. This may also tie in with what I've written here. (...more in next post) (12 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

13 [This message has been edited by everaftergirl (edited 07 March 2001).] everaftergirl Posts: 2367 From: Southern California posted 07 March :08 AM About purgatory, I believe that it is one of the levels of heaven. I say this from studying apocryphas, NDE's and many other things...and also from dreams I've had about loved ones who have passed on and were Believers. In my dreams, each one was on a different level of Heaven, depending on how they lived their lives on earth. If they didn't grow spiritually here, they had to grow there. (There are also those who passed away, that have never visited me. It is uncanny, but none of them were Believers and I often wonder where their spirits are.) The first dream about my step-father...he was in an small out-house type shack. As time went on, he progressed and got stronger, and eventually over the years, I saw him as very young. Some of my relatives who hadn't developed spiritually on earth, chose a job do to in Heaven. Some showed me what they had chosen. As I said, each time I was visited by them, they were stronger, and eventually younger. Others were young the first and only time I saw them, but only those who had grown spiritually on earth and served the Lord. I have had a vision of something that happened in the future from the first time my mother visited me after she passed away, and that proved to me that these were real visits from those in Heaven. I believe purgatory is a real place to grow if we don't grow spiritually on earth. I don't believe KK's version of it is accurate, because of what I have seen in my dreams. However, studying NDE's, there are other levels...such as in an account in the book by George Ritchie, "Return from Tomorrow", where Jesus shows a young man who died, different planes where people were stuck (like ghosts) after dying...suicides and others. He was also shown this place I have dreamt of where people went and learned things. Then the final place was Paradise with God and Jesus, but all who were Believers didn't get there immediately. It depended upon their spiritual growth on earth. Also, in Jesse Duplantis' book, "Heaven: Close Encounters of the God Kind", Jesse also describes that we cannot all go immediately to the throne of God, unless we grow spiritually on earth and are ready. The book is an about his encounters with God and his visit to Heaven. (About my experiences, when I was young, I was a "doubting Thomas" much like Art, however after hundreds of experiences, I became open minded.) [This message has been edited by everaftergirl (edited 07 March 2001).] (13 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

14 This topic is 4 pages long: next newest topic next oldest topic All times are PT (US) Administrative Options: Close Topic Archive/Move Delete Topic Hop to: Contact Us Powered by Infopop Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.47d (14 of 14) [12/18/ :55:22 AM]

15 Father Malachi Martin The Third Secret of Fatima Vatican Intrigue What will come? FAN-TASTIC FORUM Father Malachi Martin Kathleen Keating-true or false? (Page 2) profile register preferences faq search UBBFriend: This Page to Someone! This topic is 4 pages long: next newest topic next oldest topic Author Topic: Kathleen Keating-true or false? (1 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

16 TomG Posts: 175 From:,TX, USA Registered: Oct 2000 posted 07 March :04 PM everaftergirl, I found it interesting that you were once a Catholic, then became a Christian. TomG Posts: 175 From:,TX, USA Registered: Oct 2000 posted 07 March :05 PM lutefisk, when you say 'it', are you talking about the Holy Roman Catholic Church? mac Posts: 558 From: Registered: Oct 2000 posted 07 March :46 PM People would do Keating a huge favor, by telling her to get some "professional" help. Too bad no one can sue her for infringing on their theories. I would be pleasantly surprised if she ever had a singular thought, concept, or theory of her own. everaftergirl Posts: 2367 From: Southern California posted 07 March :39 PM...accidentally posted twice BTW, why are you guys so down on KK? I mean, I've read many books from others on prophecy. Why is KK any different? She gathers information together and writes about it. Or is it that you don't think she knew Fr. Malachi Martin? I wonder if any of us could get in touch with someone he knew and find out. Anyone game? But then, maybe she is telling the truth about knowing him. It is possible you know. [This message has been edited by everaftergirl (edited 07 March 2001).] (2 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

17 everaftergirl Posts: 2367 From: Southern California posted 07 March :40 PM Hi TomG, Actually, growing up Catholic, I had no meaning of what being "Saved" was. I did not have a personal relationship with the Lord Jesus. There are many Catholics that are not Saved. My own mother did not receive Jesus as her Savior until I was in my late 20's. Many people think that because a person attends church they have received Salvation, but that is often not true. I'm just glad someone asked me. lutefisk Posts: 533 From: The misty, mossy, north Registered: Nov 2000 posted 07 March :48 PM Hi TomG, When I used the term "it" I was referring to God. Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 08 March :48 AM I have problems with KK because she doesn't practice what she says she does, uses Catholic medals and scapulars as talisman and basically doesn't teach what the Church believes while insinuating that she does. Perhaps she did know Father well. If so, I wouldn't be the only one surprised because many of her beliefs go directly against his. signing off... Save Disneyland (3 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

18 Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 08 March :51 AM quote: Originally posted by everaftergirl: Hi TomG, Actually, growing up Catholic, I had no meaning of what being "Saved" was. I did not have a personal relationship with the Lord Jesus. You said you grew up Catholic but didn't know what being saved was? Granted, I've never heard the words "saved" used in the Catholic Church as it is more of a Protestant term so your point confuses me. Are you saying that many Catholics don't accept Jesus Christ as their savior and that he died for their sins? Simply by eating at His table, sharing His body and blood and accepting His forgiveness I consider myself *saved*. IMHO without these beliefs I'm not Catholic... quote: There are many Catholics that are not Saved. My own mother did not receive Jesus as her Savior until I was in my late 20's. Many people think that because a person attends church they have received Salvation, but that is often not true. I'm just glad someone asked me. Thank God of the gift of Reconciliation...without that I would never experience Salvation. To me, being Catholic is not a passive religion. You must participate in the sacraments to receive salvation. You must participate in them to be a Catholic in good standing. It appears that we simply have different ideas of which road of Christianity is correct. signing off... Save Disneyland (4 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

19 OddBodkin Posts: 38 From: Green Bay, WI, USA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 08 March :16 PM I don't know about the rest of y'all but one of my problem with KK is the fact that she is naming this Maitreya person as the Anti Christ. As far as I'm concerned there has been no real documentation for this persons existence. Maitreya is just a character created by Benjamin Creme, to what purpose I couldn't guess. Prove me wrong. Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 08 March :43 PM quote: Originally posted by OddBodkin: I don't know about the rest of y'all but one of my problem with KK is the fact that she is naming this Maitreya person as the Anti Christ. Add the buddah statue to Maitreya and I'll agree. I've seen pics of Maitreya though. He's real. Second Message down..also there is a good website for the Creme's group there. There have also been false Maitreyas- same idea as false Messiahs. signing off... Save Disneyland Edited because I dang well felt like it (and I had a broken URL) [This message has been edited by (edited 08 March 2001).] everaftergirl Posts: 2367 From: Southern California Hi all... posted 08 March :25 PM Disneyfreak, about being "Saved", Salvation, etc., it means that you've said the Sinner's prayer, asking for forgiveness of sins, and asking Jesus Christ into your heart. Some people who attend churches have not done this because they have not been told about it. I had received Communion, Confirmation, etc., but I did not have a personal relationship with Jesus, and I had not received Him by saying the Sinner's prayer until I was 15. It doesn't matter what denomination is, i.e., Catholic, Christian, Baptist, Protestant, etc., as long as they have been "Saved" as I call it, that's all that matters. BTW, I have a great respect for the Catholic Church and attend (5 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

20 periodically still. However, my church of preferance is interdenominational. I am very interested in what you said, "I have problems with KK because she doesn't practice what she says she does, uses Catholic medals and scapulars as talisman and basically doesn't teach what the Church believes while insinuating that she does..." Please can you elaborate on that? I keep an open mind with KK, seeing what she has to offer, if it's new, inaccurate or accurate, etc. (because much of what she says I believe is true, but not all)...and also I am curious and suspicious of this subject and her naming Maitreya as the ac. Someone else posted the same thing I did...that Fr. Martin said Maitreya wasn't the ac. Does anyone else know about this, or have it on tape? If so, can you post the short transcript of what Fr. Martin said. I want to follow up on this and get to the bottom of it. mac Posts: 558 From: Registered: Oct 2000 posted 09 March :54 AM Could you please carry on your discussion in the Religion threads? Not sure why you need to launch into this here. Sure, each thread meanders from time to time. Following the stream of consciousness is nice. But give us a break. I'm not in the Malachi Martin threads to hear about someones personal viewpoint about being saved. There are some nice threads in Religion and Spirituality. rapa Posts: 1833 From: Fairbanks, Alaska, USA posted 09 March :06 PM The reason I think KK is full of prunes is because I don't think she or anyone else can for sure know who the ac is or even if there is a physical being as the ac. I think it is pretty arrogant of her to accuse anyone. Who knows maybe she is the ac. (6 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

21 lutefisk Posts: 533 From: The misty, mossy, north Registered: Nov 2000 posted 09 March :59 PM Rapa, I agree. It's precisely that "arrogance" that puts the mighty gulf between her and Malachi. Malachi Martin was the most gentle of souls. People would call up and get angry with him on Art's show sometimes and he would be so gentle and loving with them. I sure miss him. I loved the way he "tolerated" other faiths while being deeply involved in his own. I felt that, even though I believed that "Hell" was a condition created within everyone's own framework, that Malachi would have discussed this with me and NOT tried to tell me I would burn forever, for having such a belief. His deep, unshakeable love for God AND all humanity showed. He didn't NEED to be right like Kathleen. TomG Posts: 175 From:,TX, USA Registered: Oct 2000 posted 09 March :16 PM lutefisk, Fr Malachi may have tolerated other beliefs, but he never capitulated. I remember at least once where he said plainly, "... you have a right to believe that, but you're wrong". His demeanor was always priestly, but don't ever doubt he was a lion, very strong and sure of his Faith. And he would never agree that walking down to a Jimmy Swaggert altar call, saying a prayer, raising your hands, and speaking in tongues, was a one way ticket to Heaven, irrespective of the actions of the rest of your life. lutefisk Posts: 533 From: The misty, mossy, north Registered: Nov 2000 everaftergirl Posts: 2367 From: Southern California posted 09 March :49 PM Tom, You are right. He did have a "mighty" side to him! He definitely stood for what he believed, and yet, he was very approachable. posted 10 March :28 AM Hey Mac, You said, "Could you please carry on your discussion in the Religion threads? Not sure why you need to launch into this here. Sure, each thread meanders from time to time. Following the stream of consciousness is nice. But give us a break. I'm not in the Malachi Martin threads to hear about someones personal viewpoint about being saved. There are some nice threads in Religion and Spirituality. Don't even think about telling me what or what not to post in here. This is a FREE forum! Just in case you DIDN'T notice, Father Malachi and Kathleen Keating are talking about JESUS AND GOD, and the future as prophesied in the Bible. (7 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

22 If you have a problem with me talking about it, that's just too bad. I am sick of all the crap that's been going on lately. We all used to have different but PEACEFUL discussions on this forum. What IS going on here? I will not be intimidated! Guess what? In case you didn't notice, Father Malachi Martin and Kathleen Keating spoke the Word of God. And for me personally, knowing Scripture, I don't believe that KK could speak so boldly as a testimony for Jesus and God, if she were a fake. There are some things which unbelievers may not speak...and I have not seen this apply in her case. And of course, I could be wrong, but that doesn't give you the right to shut me out, or shut me up. You know what's wrong with today? Everything is backwards. People have been "brainwashed" over the past 27 years or so to believe what is right is wrong, and what is wrong is right. That's why kids are killing kids. So, you may try to make me look bad for what I'm saying here in this discussion room, but, oh well! (Contrary to popular belief, I am no Pollyana.) [This message has been edited by everaftergirl (edited 10 March 2001).] everaftergirl Posts: 2367 From: Southern California maryals Posts: 1722 From: anchorage, Alaska, USA Registered: Sep 2000 posted 10 March :09 AM BTW, one rotten apple can spoil the whole barrel. I know this is a true statement. posted 12 March :54 AM What is happening is the Smoke of he who shall not be named is creeping into and onto this Ship. > At another Topic/Thread, Capn' Code spoke of giving the Ship a good cleaning. > I'm not implying that anyone should leave > Just that The Deceiver, The Mixer, The One who sets Friend against Friend, The Confuser, is trying to creep on board our Ship. > It's one thing to disagree and discuss, it's another to get nasty and mean. > For the most part, in a nutshell, I believe that Kathleen Keating is True and I will continue to listen, carefully, to her and go to her Site. > (8 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

23 How much more will the Ents endure? maryals FairBecca Posts: 2535 From: over slept...i ain't sure... Registered: Jan 2001 posted 12 March :48 AM and again... on this thread.. I've found my dear ship mates at odds! Everaftergirl, and Maryals,Mac... What can I say. I respect you all so much... and have learned so much from reading behind your posts,... it's a wonder ya'll don't charge me a fee! I'll watch for smooth waters. Amanda, I'm distressed...when you're distressed, like a kid, I kinda want things to "be O.K." The old saying..."when Mom's not happy... then neither are the rest of us!" O.K. I'll butt out here too... but please know...i do respect you... all... and mean no offence by my intrusion. Smile on your brother.. you may have to borrow $20. bucks from him later! FairBecca.. (Polly Rebecca) mac Posts: 558 From: Registered: Oct 2000 posted 12 March :31 AM Amanda, it is nice to see you speak your mind. I can't make you "look" one way or another, on the message board. No one can do that. Intimidation? I'm not sure that one can do that by simply stating an opinion - as we all do. As you do. As for my opinion about what is germain to this thread; it is simply that...my opinion. Just as it was your opinion to express a similar position when you did not agree with some of the lighthearted, goofy threads in the Art Bell area. I think you sort of inferred that we were junking up Art's area, or something. I am not sure that disagreement suggests anything other than simply disagreement about a topic, issue, position, etc. It is a rather enlightening process for me, in that it challenges me to evaluate my facts, check my biase, and think outside my own box. Not sure, only my guess - but some seem to equate "peaceful" with "agreement". Well, at least we agree on one thing. I'm sick of the *rap I have seen posted in the recent two months here as well. Especially the double-standards folks take around here. (9 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

24 So be it... rapa Posts: 1833 From: Fairbanks, Alaska, USA posted 12 March :42 AM The only discord I have been noticing at FF is difference of opinion turned into a debate of who is right. Just because we don't agree with each other is no reason to feel a post is negative. What is negative to me may not be negative to you. When it starts to get personal, there is a problem but an attack on someones beliefs is only an opinion. And we all have a right to opinion whether it is positive or negative. If you want to post on a message board that always agrees with your opinion then an un-censored board will always make you feel picked on. Snorrithor Posts: 1007 From: SE Michigan USA posted 12 March :39 AM The reason I think KK is full of prunes is because I don't think she or anyone else can for sure know who the ac is or even if there is a physical being as the ac. I think it is pretty arrogant of her to accuse anyone. Who knows maybe she is the ac rapa Relying on certain Mahayana Buddhist citations and quotations, we believe that in this fortunate eon one thousand buddhas will appear. This is the time of the fourth buddha, Buddha Shakyamuni, whose teaching is still existing, and the fifth Buddha will be Maitreya Buddha... His Holiness the XIVth Dalai Lama THE KEATING PERSPECTIVE 07/23/ "Okay. So the word is out about the Antichrist. His true identity has been revealed. For those of you who may have missed the Monday or Friday Sightings shows, let me fill you in on it. Benjamin Crème is promoting his savior, Maitreya, as god incarnate. Once again, for the record, this guy, according to 500 visionaries, is THE guy Of course, Crème isn t touting Maitreya (hereinafter referred to as Turban Head) as the AC. No. It is the contrary. According to Crème, Turban Head is the savior, the Christ." Crème seems as kooky as Keating! But Keating is a Bigot and Racist! Turban Head!!?? Even if Buddhists wore Turbans - it is still a Bigoted and Closed-Minded term! Now -- if KK is the Antichrist!: It would be a very clever diversion, wouldn't it. It's so easy to pick on Buddhists and Jainists because they (10 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

25 practice what many only pay lip-service to: Peace and Humility Religions are like fireflies. They require darkness in order to shine Arthur Schopenhauer ( ) German philosopher Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 12 March :27 PM quote: Originally posted by rapa: The only discord I have been noticing at FF is difference of opinion turned into a debate of who is right. Just because we don't agree with each other is no reason to feel a post is negative. Agreed. When this happends the board becomes like UseNet. I don't post at Usenet:-) signing off... Save Disneyland Capt.Hornblower Posts: 74 From: Cold North Atlantic Registered: Oct 2000 posted 14 March :50 PM Hello to Mac, Tom, Maryals and all: The ents, Maryals! I'd almost forgotten them! Loved every moment of those books... I think Maryals is correct. I, too, smell the smoke. I think it arrived (as Mac noted) weeks ago. I have no use for censored boards or censored 'anything'. That is not the issue, however. I'm sure none of us desire that. What I do notice is a change in attitude and tone. I hear anger where before there was none, I see people taking offense where none was implied. Where did all this come from? All of us here hold varying opinions about many things and we have always discussed our differing opinions without being negative. I'm sure we will continue to do that--we have been and will continue to be, friends. We have been spoiled in a way, I suppose. When I am able to get on line and stop here, I feel like I am sitting beside the hearth with my good friends sharing an ale and a fire while we wonder aloud about our friend, Fr. Martin. Ah, but then reality strikes. It's not a sitting (11 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

26 room we are in, we are in an outdoor cafe fronting a sidewalk on a busy street. All manner of folks are about. Most pleasant, some not, and some who smell smoky. So be it. Mac --(who is always a gentleman)--thanks again for your research and insight. I, for one, will sit back in my cafe chair with you all and wait till the crowd thins so we can continue our conversations... As ever, Pat This topic is 4 pages long: next newest topic next oldest topic All times are PT (US) Administrative Options: Close Topic Archive/Move Delete Topic Hop to: Contact Us Powered by Infopop Ultimate Bulletin Board 5.47d (12 of 12) [12/18/ :55:37 AM]

27 Father Malachi Martin The Third Secret of Fatima Vatican Intrigue What will come? FAN-TASTIC FORUM Father Malachi Martin Kathleen Keating-true or false? (Page 3) profile register preferences faq search UBBFriend: This Page to Someone! This topic is 4 pages long: next newest topic next oldest topic Author Topic: Kathleen Keating-true or false? (1 of 12) [12/18/ :55:40 AM]

28 Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 14 March :27 PM Would someone please elaborate...i've been away quite a bit as the company that takes most of my time is involved with Efront and I've been doing some research...with megs of ICQ logs that can take a bit of time! signing off... Save Disneyland Capt.Hornblower Posts: 74 From: Cold North Atlantic Registered: Oct 2000 posted 17 March :44 PM Hello, all. Listened to Art the other evening and I was happy to hear that of all the shows he has been asked to replay, the most requested are those where Fr. Malachi was his guest. What a testament to the inherent goodness and holiness of the man! Even after his death, Catholics and non-catholics alike are asking to hear, once again, what were his thoughts concerning Holy Mother Church and the possibilities that lay before us. I have been fortunate to have been able to sign-on with this small group of folks who have continued the discussion. I am very glad that I found you. You are, without exception, bright, articulate people whose insight I value. (And whose kindness I am thankful for.) I posted the other day mindful, of course, of the statements which preceeded my entry. I was very concerned and unhappy--never in the several years we have been together have I heard such anger. Two individuals replied to Mac in a manner totally inappropriate. One, whom I believe to be male, was arrogant and insulting. That kind of a person you would remove from your house. The other, whom I believe is female, declared she 'would not be shut-up' when she was asked, politely, to continue the conversation in a thread more appropriate to the topic. Let me make my thoughts very clear: 1. This thread is about Fr. Martin and the record he left us. It is my understanding that we are attempting to discern his thoughts concerning the future of the Church. It is not about issues of evangelicanism, pentacostalism, or protestantism of any kind. These are all interesting, but questions concerning the Church's position on these issues can be answered more properly elsewhere. 2. Mac's postings were focused and on point. I agree with him. 3. The venomous and angry attacks which were launched against him (2 of 12) [12/18/ :55:40 AM]

29 were wrong. It is there that I smell the 'smoke' Maryals spoke of--it arrived here from outside, not from Mac. Mac is a good man whose countless hours of research has benefited us all. He is a bright and kind man who offends no one. People need to know that and I have no problem telling them!! The board has remained quiet since the last 'blast' and I am concerned about that. That may have been their intent. If it was, they have failed. (You know-- shout loud enough and nice people will move away...) On this, the feast day of good St.Patrick, (at whose table surely sits Fr. Malachi) I wish us all the best. Fr. Malachi was a good and kind man. He would want us all to be the same. Being trained as a Jesuit, he would also urge us to continue our discussion! Just a thought. Pat maryals Posts: 1722 From: anchorage, Alaska, USA Registered: Sep 2000 posted 18 March :21 PM Dear Capt.Hornblower How eloquent! Thank you...your post speaks for me. > I pray and send out Good Thoughts that our friends will return to this Main Topic of Father Malachi Martin as well the sub-topics within. > How much more will the Ents endure? maryals Posts: 1528 From: New Orleans Square, Disneyland posted 18 March :43 PM Okay-here's the deal. I'm rarely taping or copying the transcripts of KK. I did notice that from what I can see KK didn't claim this 'good' relationship with MM until his death. Some have said otherwise-that Martin has acknowleged it. I've gone through the transcripts at KK website without mention-anyone done the legwork on this one? If so what did you find out? signing off... Save Disneyland (3 of 12) [12/18/ :55:41 AM]

30 Hilda Sophia Posts: 1334 From: Connecticut posted 20 March :02 AM Friends, I haven't been able to find out how well Kathleen K. knew Father Malachi, but am still searching. When I find anything will post it. I recently sent for Brian Doran's tapes, "Malachi Martin: God's Messenger". It is great to hear his voice in interviews from various sources. I was disappointed that it came in three cassettes, but side two of the third was blank. I would think that there is enough material so that could have been filled. Unfortunately the book he was working on and other personal property was "lost" and some things we will never know. I hope people keep posting here. We need the memory of Father Malachi and his work kept alive. HB3 Posts: 2243 From: Altadena, CA Registered: Nov 2000 posted 20 March :04 AM I seem to recall that KK traded a few letters with Fr M...that's it. She mentioned this on Art's program once. I don't think she ever met him face to face -- at least, she never mentioned it, as I recall. I believe this "great friendship" was in the form of an amiable correspondence. [This message has been edited by HB3 (edited 20 March 2001).] deeremom Posts: 1895 From: Very Small Town, Texas Registered: Oct 2000 posted 20 March :25 PM Hilda Sophia, I strongly agree that we hope to keep these Father Martin threads alive. I hope the malcontents will leave the people who are doing serious research on Father Martin alone! I am an old cynical Catholic, open to many views. I have loved the information on these threads and hope it will continue! Pat (4 of 12) [12/18/ :55:41 AM]